Ind. Bullet Co. leading barrel?

[bigmich]

you might try slugging your barrel it is very important that the lead bullet be one thousands bigger than the barrel other wise you will get leading also 18 bhn is the standard for most commercial bullet caster about everybody uses it
if there is anything i can do fore u let me know i will try to help in anyway i can

thanks
mitch
indiana bullet co

 

[Cam]

Why would someone make leads bullets in .452 with an 18BHN?...most/all the rounds that use that bullet are low pressure anyway...like ACP or Long Colt.

Is there anyway to functionally use these bullets with the low pressures of 45acp?....I dont want to have to clean the bore like this after every 20-50 rounds.

Thanks for all the input
God bless
-Shred

Have you tried any other powders? Any different loadings? Or just the 4 grains of Clays? Need to experiment a little.

Are your loads accurate? Here is why I ask; As has been suggested, slug that barrel to see what size bullet you need to be working with. That would be where I would start. I have a Ruger Blackhawk in 45Colt that I was chasing terrible leading down on as well as equally terrible accuracy, even on a rest. I slugged the bore and it was not the problem, but it pointed me in the direction of where the problem was....the cylinder throats were nearly .002" undersized which was swaging the boolit down to being undersized for the barrel, thus allowing gasses to go around the boolit in the bore and leading the barrel. A quick twist or two from the proper sized reamer in the cylinder throats fixed both problems and made it a tack driver at 25 yards. I use that revolver to hunt with every year now.

Could also use some Lee Alox lube. I have tried that with success.

One last thing I would ask is how much lead you are truly seeing and are you sure it is lead? Where are you seeing it? Is it streaking all the way down the barrel? In the end near the chamber? Near the muzzle?

I finally came to the conclusion that I didn't necessarily have to have my bores so clean I could eat off of them and as long as I didn't get slivers of lead out on the cleaning patch, I was good to go. I began to enjoy it a lot more after that and have tossed thousands of lead bullets downrange without issue since.

 

[Sirshredalot]

Have you tried any other powders? Any different loadings? Or just the 4 grains of Clays? Need to experiment a little.

Are your loads accurate? Here is why I ask; As has been suggested, slug that barrel to see what size bullet you need to be working with. That would be where I would start. I have a Ruger Blackhawk in 45Colt that I was chasing terrible leading down on as well as equally terrible accuracy, even on a rest. I slugged the bore and it was not the problem, but it pointed me in the direction of where the problem was....the cylinder throats were nearly .002" undersized which was swaging the boolit down to being undersized for the barrel, thus allowing gasses to go around the boolit in the bore and leading the barrel. A quick twist or two from the proper sized reamer in the cylinder throats fixed both problems and made it a tack driver at 25 yards. I use that revolver to hunt with every year now.

Could also use some Lee Alox lube. I have tried that with success.

One last thing I would ask is how much lead you are truly seeing and are you sure it is lead? Where are you seeing it? Is it streaking all the way down the barrel? In the end near the chamber? Near the muzzle?

I finally came to the conclusion that I didn't necessarily have to have my bores so clean I could eat off of them and as long as I didn't get slivers of lead out on the cleaning patch, I was good to go. I began to enjoy it a lot more after that and have tossed thousands of lead bullets downrange without issue since.

I have since loaded up some lead with 4.9g titegroup and some green dot as well...but have not had a chance to go to the range yet.

The "marking" in the barrel was closer to the throat and was a grimy grey color when patched, but it never came out on a regular patch until I scrubbed the B'jezus out of it with a copper brush.

Will look into slugging the barrel but I have run .451 plated bullets with great success.

Will keep everyone posted once I make it to the range.

God bless
-Shred

 

[Skip]

Why would someone make leads bullets in .452 with an 18BHN?...most/all the rounds that use that bullet are low pressure anyway...like ACP or Long Colt.

Is there anyway to functionally use these bullets with the low pressures of 45acp?....I dont want to have to clean the bore like this after every 20-50 rounds.

Thanks for all the input
God bless
-Shred

First off, there HAS to be a reason.....

In my opinion, it is because that is what their alloy is....Not a real good reason. Alloys that are harder USUALLY melt at a lower temperature because they have more tin. Tin is what makes them shiny too. How do you sell to the public? Aesthetics.

All barrels are not created equal. Some have rough transitions from chamber to rifling.....Bad for lead. Some are a bit oversize, some under. Oh, I just had a thought, if you have the Lee Factory Crimp die and are using it.....stop. I have seen them cause a gazillion more problems WITH LEAD than they will ever cure. They size the bullet when the case is resized. In my previous post, I stated that size matters. If you make them smaller than they were, how does that help? Right, it doesn't. Put it away and save it for jacketed stuff. It won't resize them because they are already at .451". FWIW

Now, of the powders you have suggested, I would not use one of them with lead. Green Dot is the only one that was developed when lead bullets were king and I have had a terrible time with it in other calibers. So, not me.

If I could make a suggestion, try Bullseye, Unique or W231/HP-38. They will make your gun woefully dirty but not because of leading. They were all developed when about the only bullets one could buy were lead.

Run them at the top of their respective pressure ranges. Do not run any at the low end, your bullets are too hard for that, period. They were not made for your barrel, they were made for the caster's convenience.

As I stated, I run bullets from 12-15 to 1800fps with NO leading.

Pressure is your friend with lead, to a point, velocity may not be. The first thing to try is cleaning your barrel with an amoinia based cleaner. After that, run the pressure at the top of the book data, no higher.

Next time, buy bullets no harder than 15BHN for your 45ACP.

FWIW
I hope this helps

 

[Slapstick]

I shot close to 200 rounds yesterday using Indiana Bullet Co. 230 .45's in a Remington R1. No leading, it cleaned right up. I am using Unique. I don't why you'd be having a problem, it could be a number of things or maybe just a bad batch of bullets. Me, I'm ordering another 1000 since they shoot great, accurate and they didn't lead my barrel.

 

[Skip]

Here is a chart to look at. Page 2:

http://leeprecision.com/cgi-data/instruct/90924.pdf

Look at the maximum pressure for a 18BHN bullet, do the same for a 15BHN or a 12BHN. Then, look at the maximum pressure of a 45ACP with standard loads......No where close.

If you have a smooth transition, too hard of bullets and too light of a powder charge, those bullets will not obturate and you will have leading galore......

 

[Broom_jm]

Why would someone make leads bullets in .452 with an 18BHN?...most/all the rounds that use that bullet are low pressure anyway...like ACP or Long Colt.

Is there anyway to functionally use these bullets with the low pressures of 45acp?....I dont want to have to clean the bore like this after every 20-50 rounds.

Thanks for all the input
God bless
-Shred

450 Bushmaster or 460S&W jump to mind. 454 Casull and the less common 45 Win Mag are also candidates for HARD cast .452" bullets? I'm not into shooting cast bullets, but if/when I do get into it, I'm sure there will be a learning curve, including matching the right size and relative hardness to the cartridge I'm firing them from.

 

[Skip]

Plus "P" 45 Colt, and 45ACP are also candidates for harder bullets, depending. Some of the Ruger Only loads that I run through my Blackhawk Convertible get water quenced lead bullets. Now, my alloys are not scientifically made nor quality controlled, no need for that, but, water quenching can raise the hardness to almost double, depending on the temperature of the bullet at mould drop and the amount of arsenic in the alloy. I don't remember but, does the chart even go to 30BHN? If so, they need driven hard! Not fast, high pressure, there is a difference.

 

[Matt52]

Very interesting. Thanks. I'd like to hear others confirm this procedure.

A few strokes with the copper ChoreBoy wrapped around a brush seems to work well for me.

Just take some scrap lead and throw it in and watch it bubble and dissolve.

 

[Matt52]

Would be interested what it would do to the finishes on most barrels.

Funny enough I found this in a glock reference manual and your not supposed to use lead in glocks. It says leave it for 10 minutes and then rinse in water Ive only used it on a stainless steel barrel so I cant tell you what would happened to a blued barrel.

Vinegar and peroxide are actually mild when combined It doesnt burn you hands or anything but for whatever reason a chemical reaction with the lead accurs and with in minutes the lead is dissolved and run a patch thru the barrel and your done.

 

[straight-shooter]

First thing is I slug each one of my barrels and record the results. I always size the bullets .001 over bore diameter. You can change all kinds of things but if the bullet doesn't fit correctly, your behind the eight ball from the git go.

Example is I cast some 9mm bullets and sized them to .356 and had terrible leading. Knowing my powder type and weight were correct and my lead BHN was at 14 I opted to up the diameter of the bullet. I sized at .357 and zero leading! Bullet fit is king in this game and not so much hard lead.

As mentioned by Skip, never use the Lee FCD as it will size the bullet in the case and will almost guarantee leading. I found this out the hard way and had plenty of bullets to pull and recast.

I only use Unique and W231 in 9mm and 45 ACP

Alox ? well, not bad results but very minor leading was still present. I bought a Lyman lube press and now have zero leading with the White Label Lube.

Another thing worth mentioning is finding the optimal velocity for your lead bullets. I found that if it was pushed to hard the leading would show up near the muzzle. If pushed not hard enough it was present at the forcing cone area. Once I find the correct powder weight then no lead is present.