If you saw this guy, would you shoot him?

[Glock19]

The officer obviously believed it was a gun and the guy got out of the vehile and didnt stop reaching. It was a justified shooting. Just a bad bad accident...

 

[Vigilant]

Don't remember seeing that in any of the human training videos must have missed it. Old people have a tendency to do things like this, and as far as "hopping", well never mind. Must be cool to be clairvoyant though.

Not clairvoyant at all, I saw a man get out, forgive me for saying hopping, grab an object, the officer shout commands, the man didn't heed them, officer shot, quickly realized it was a mistake, NOT A bad shoot, a horrible mistake. Would it wrap one of us without a badge up in a whole bundle of shyte, probably, but if you don't like that go get sworn, and spend a couple of years on the streets. This was a Horrible mistake, the officer will live with the rest of his life, but should it end his career? I don't think so, YMMV.

 

[Bunnykid68]

The officer obviously believed it was a gun and the guy got out of the vehile and didnt stop reaching. It was a justified shooting. Just a bad bad accident...

If he believed it was a gun why did he stop shooting while the guy still had the gun in his hand?

 

[Tandem160]

Terrible..The cop should be arrested. Thank god he'll lose his ass in civil court.

 

[Denny347]

Why does LE seem immune to one of the cardinal rules of firearm safety? Know your target. Doesn't that mean ascertaining with a fair degree of certainty who it is and why he deserves to be shot?

Does this also apply to dads who shoot their daughter's unarmed boyfriends while in their daughters bed?

 

[churchmouse]

Does this also apply to dads who shoot their daughter's unarmed boyfriends while in their daughters bed?

I have been waiting for this to come up.

 

[Denny347]

Right on script again... "It's just an isolated incident!"

As for "lit up", it was an old man. Slow, probably a little deaf. Better shoot him. Officer Safety.

You have stats saying this is NOT an isolated incident? Out of millions of traffic stops, how often does this happen? Please school me.

 

[Denny347]

I have been waiting for this to come up.

Not sure why it took so long.

 

[churchmouse]

Not sure why it took so long.

Was not a LEO on civilian thing.
I have watched the video a few times now as at first I did not see it all clearly. It is obvious the LEO was not a JBT but was scared for his safety. Right or wrong this should have been handled differently on both side. Civilian should have stayed in his truck. This would have ended very differently had he followed instructions.

I will say he sucks as a marksman and was doing the spray and pray.

 

[public servant]

This would have ended very differently had he followed instructions.

Same with the teenage boy.

 

[Vigilant]

Does this also apply to dads who shoot their daughter's unarmed boyfriends while in their daughters bed?

I vote good shoot both ways, one a horrible mistake, the other was a dumb bimbo teen trying to get out of trouble and causing the death of her play toy. Both good shoots based on the given evidence.

 

[Denny347]

We have the luxury of examining this FOREVER as is normal here. But the shoot/no shoot scenarios take milliseconds to unfold. The gift if 20\20 hindsight.

 

[churchmouse]

We have the luxury of examining this FOREVER as is normal here. But the shoot/no shoot scenarios take milliseconds to unfold. The gift if 20\20 hindsight.

As experienced by both the LEO and the DAD............

 

[Denny347]

As experienced by both the LEO and the DAD............

Yes, while we might be confronted with these decisions more often, we are certainly not the only ones. I have not condemned the dad nor am I condemning the officer. Both are tragic and those responsible will have to live with their decisions. I hope I never get placed into this situation...EVER. As good of of a job I try to do, as a firearms instructor, and as a combatives instructor, I could EASILY be placed in the same situation that could force me to fire on a person with whom I thought was armed only to find out they were not. I will them be demonized for a good decision at the time I had to make it.

 

[k1500]

It is too easy to analyze after the fact. The officer did have the advantage of distance from the "threat" and cover of the car. This buys time in determining a threat to life. I prob would not have fired. The old guy is lucky the cop was a bad shot.

 

[rambone]

It would not have even dawned on me to shoot the guy. I guess I need more training.

 

[RUSH2112]

That was awful to watch. Nobody has any common sense anymore??

 

[jsharmon7]

It would not have even dawned on me to shoot the guy. I guess I need more training.

How often do you stop unknown vehicles at night?

 

[CathyInBlue]

Do people truly not see the inherent difference between being surprised by a definite threat within the confines of one's own home and going out on patrol searching for, finding, and confronting law breakers?

Do people truly not see the inherent difference between being in close proximity to a young man making quick, searching motions with his hands and being 20-30 feet from an oldster moving slowly?

This is purely a training, or lack thereof, issue. This trooper never seen old men in pick ups who store their walking stick in the bed? Do those cruisers not have PA speakers that are clear enough to be understood at 20-30 feet?

I bet his training on recognizing everything that is not under his direct control as a weapon and a threat was crackerjack, though.

 

[DemolitionMan]

No, it's not an assumption. In a me vs you scenario, the "me" always wins when "you" is perceived to be a threat. And I would think this obviously isn't unique to police, would you agree?

The question is when does it become me vs you? LEOs need to be held to a very high standard when making that choice since they are entrusted by the public with the enforcement of law, and given training and weaponry to perform those duties. If officers are being trained that their safety is more important than the public's safety then I think that the priorities need to be reevaluated.

Please understand I am not in the LEO bashing crowd. My dad was a cop for 12 years and involved in a police action shooting that he regretted for the rest of his life, so I feel a lot of sympathy for the officer in the first video.

I honestly don't know what to think. I'm seeing a lot of assertions on both sides about what officers are being taught. I can only guess that it varies from department to department, not to mention sheriff vs city vs state. I'm willing to believe I only hear about more of these cases lately because I visit forums like this one, but I can't shake the perception that police are quicker to choose deadly force than they were in the past.