How often do you guys shoot your Full Auto Guns?

[Slow Hand]

And, what calibers do you shoot? I've got a small thought in the back of my head to clean house in the gun safe and buy something with a happy switch. Just wondering how often you go shoot your go fast toys. I know caliber and cost has a lot to do with it and wheter or not you reload for it. A .22lr would be 'best' for lots of shooting, but I'd rather have something ina more useful caliber; whatever that means!

Also, cost aside, do they get old? I've shot plenty of different types of full auto stuff from .32acp Stetchkins up through belt feds and they were all fun, for the day. I love to remeber them and look at pics of me with belts draped across my arms and empty brass filling the air, but does it get old after awhile? If I did get something F/A, my collection would be more of a using array, rather than the odd conglomeration of neat stuff I now own and shoot too little.

Thanks for any advice, opinions, experiences, etc.

Doug K

ps, what can I buy in the $10K range? I hear about cheaper Macs at $2-3K and real neat stuff like Thompsons at $20+K, but little in between.

 

[VUPDblue]

Ohhh, but there is LOTS in between! Some of the most useful F/A's are less than $10k like the UZI family, the MAC family and a good portion of the M16 family. I don't shoot mine as much as I'd like, but that being said, it comes out nearly every time I hit the range! I shoot my M16 mostly with my Spike's .22lr conversion because it's mucho fun and mucho cheap. I shoot the 9mm conversion slightly less than the .22, and I hardly ever shoot it in .223 due to the cost of good ammo. Hell, $15 for a mag dump (roughly 2 seconds) puts the cost/fun ratio out of my comfort zone. Anyway, I did some pairing-down of my collection to buy my M16 but I don't regret any of it for a second.

 

[bigcraig]

Doug, IMHO it is hard to beat the price of a good MAC 11/9.

If I would just dig up some mason jars out of the backyard I could buy one myself.

 

[VUPDblue]

I'll bring the shovel!

 

[shooter521]

I shoot my M-11/9 maybe 3-4 times a year. I shot it more than that after I first got it, but the newness wore off quickly. Couple that with the limited number of public ranges that allow F/A weapons, the fact that MACs are no fun to shoot in semi-auto (unlike VUPD's M-16, which essentially just becomes an AR when not in "group therapy" mode), and the skyrocketing cost of ammo, and the subgun tends to stay in the safe while my 9mm SBR and other semi-auto rifles get the lion's share of the playtime.

Don't get me wrong, I like my MAC. It's a lot of fun to shoot in its current incarnation, and it's especially gratifying to let folks who have never handled a full-auto shoot it (NFA Day). At the price I paid 4 years ago, buying it was a no-brainer. At the prices they're bringing now, though, I'd have to give it some serious thought. IMO, your NFA dollar might be better spent on suppressors and SBRs. Machine guns are fun, but ultimately they're just toys. If you *do* go that route, get the best you can afford (i.e. don't settle for a MAC if an UZI or M-16 is within the realm of possibility).

HTH!

 

[epsylum]

I wouldn't know, I am still working on getting mine (damn bills ). I am getting an awesome deal on the M11-A1 I am getting (around a 1/3 of its actual value) and if it wasn't for that, I probably wouldn't be getting one.

For future reference, anyone want to trade a M11/9 for an RPB M11-A1 .380 straight up at some point in the future?

 

[bigcraig]

shooter521 makes a really good point. In fact to be honest I have enough money sitting in my desk to buy a MAC, but I just can't seem to pull the trigger on buying one. I just know that as soon as I buy it, and the newness wears off, I will regret not waiting until the funds were saved to buy a M16, which is what I really want.

I suppose if you can swing the purchase of a M16, thats the way to go.

 

[Slow Hand]

I've done some looking around and on Subguns.com there are a couple of M16's for right around $10K. Now, there are other's for $14-17K. What's the deal with those? The cheaper ones are not Post-86 Dealer samples or anything. Are they converted AR's that have less value than an original Colt M16? I'm kinda thinking that the M16 is a great way to go because of it's modularity.

I also saw a few S&W 76's and MK760's. How are these? I've never shot one, but I bet they would be fun. I'm guesing that mags are more expensive than say a Mac and there is much less aftermarket for them. The simple wire stock turns me off as far as lots of shooting, though. I remeber seeing these advertiesed in Shotgun News back when i was a jeweler in Brownsburg, maybe seven years ago, for just under $2000, now they are double that! I thought if doing the same thign I am now and buying one of them then. That would have been a pretty good investment!

Then, there are the late model Thompsons for around $12K. Out of my price range, but I never even thought of them! I only ever see the 1928's and military M1's for around $25K. Wish I could talk dad into cashing in some of his retirement $$ to buy an original '28 and a boxful of drums!

Looks like I need to do some more research. What shops, if any, in the area have a decent, in stock supply of full auto guns? I can save myself $200 by buying from a dealer, right? If I see something out of state, I have to pay to transfer it to the dealer and then to me, plus whatever transfer fee the dealer charges; correct?

Thanks,
Doug K

 

[shooter521]

there are a couple of M16's for right around $10K. Now, there are other's for $14-17K. What's the deal with those?

Most transferable "M-16s" are probably converted ARs, though there are some factory machine guns out there (those will obviously be on the higher end of the price spectrum). What you're paying for is 1) brand name/quality of the host gun, 2) quality of the conversion job, and 3) overall condition. That being said, there's virtually nothing "wrong" with an M-16 that can't be fixed – just ask VUPDblue. I'm not saying go out and buy the cheapest, scroungiest beater you can find, but you don't have to insist on a Colt factory MG, either, unless that's what you really want.

I also saw a few S&W 76's and MK760's. How are these? I've never shot one, but I bet they would be fun. I'm guesing that mags are more expensive than say a Mac and there is much less aftermarket for them.

I recently considered ditching the MAC for a SW76/MK760. After talking to a couple of my trusted machine gun gurus, I decided against it. Original S&W 76s are spitting distance from an UZI, price-wise. And with the 760, I kept hearing things like "can be made to run well" and "if you like to tinker" ... sounded an awful lot like my MAC, which is still more troublesome than I'd like it to be.

What shops, if any, in the area have a decent, in stock supply of full auto guns?

I doubt you'll find any. Sad but true.

If I see something out of state, I have to pay to transfer it to the dealer and then to me, plus whatever transfer fee the dealer charges; correct?

True, but IIRC, if the out-of-state gun is in the possession of a dealer (vs. an individual), it will transfer to your dealer for free, so you'd just be on the hook for your dealer's transfer fee, plus the tax stamp. When you hear folks talk about a gun being "on a Form 3" or "on a Form 4" they're talking about how the gun would transfer out. Form 3 is a dealer-to-dealer transfer; Form 4 is an individual transfer.

Another thing worth noting - if you have a C&R FFL, you can buy C&R-eligible machine guns (of which the S&W76 is one) directly from an out-of-state dealer or individual. Saves a bit of money and streamlines the process, but limits your selection to a short list of C&R MGs.

HTH!

 

[Slow Hand]

Thanks, Mark. You answere dmany of my questions. I like the look of the 76/760, but know nothing about them. I know the MAC's have huge aftermarketcompared to many subguns. Thanks for the info on price differences in M16's. I've got my application in for a C&R, so that may help make a decision, then again, it's only $200 extra on a multi thosand dollar gun, so why limit myself. I am a huge history buff and would love a Thompson, even a later version as long as they are reliable. I even saw a Reising for what seemed a decent price.

I appreciate the info from everyone. This will take some serious thinking on my part and when I decide, I'll still have to sell off everythign to raise the cash to have on hand for when I find the best deal!

Thanks again,
Doug K

 

[VUPDblue]

Just an update from me, I was at the range most of the day yesterday with the M16 in tow. We put about 1k rounds of .22lr downrange and about 200 rounds of .223 downrange with it. Can't beat .22lr on 'go fast' for a great time!!!

 

[shooter521]

Can't beat .22lr on 'go fast' for a great time!!!

No argument there. I just wish Richard Lage would get his .22LR MAC kits done...

 

[Slow Hand]

Just an update from me, I was at the range most of the day yesterday with the M16 in tow. We put about 1k rounds of .22lr downrange and about 200 rounds of .223 downrange with it. Can't beat .22lr on 'go fast' for a great time!!!

Nick,
Where do you shoot full auto? IS it a private range? Are teh reange owners more lenient on FA if you are suppressed? Wouldn't scare teh neighbors near as much!

Doug K

 

[VUPDblue]

Actually yesterday we were at Waveland. I spoke with the person who lives there when we paid-up and she was in and out the whole time we were shooting and didn't say anything. Now, we weren't being dumbasses and spraying the whole place down, and we were shooting suppressed (except .223) the whole time, but I assume that it is OK out there now that I haven't been corrected.

 

[Slow Hand]

I've been to Waveland numerous times and have almost always had a good time. Only nearly bad experinece was partially due to my lack of planning. I had some freind down from Ft Wayne and over from Missourri. We went out there to shoot for the day and there happened to be a Boy Scout group coming the same day, so we were not able to use the rifle range. The bad part was that my wife was shooting at some bad guy targets and they asked us to take them down when teh BS arrived. We were a bit put off by that, but it's therer range and I'm happy it's avaialbe to use for such a low cost, so we complied. My wife had plenty of fun ringing the steel plates for the rest of the day.

Doug K

 

[tcshooter]

Take a good look at the Reising - decent weapon - but I am saving up for a Sterling - a buddy of mine has one and it is the Cadillac of 9mmm subguns for my tastes - - accurate and shoots the cheaper ammo and, if nothing else, it is functionally reliable every time we go to the range.

If you really want to save cash at the range, look at which weapons have 22lr kits available for them.

Look at barrelxchange.com for conversion kits for many NFA weapons. This guy makes kits for many calibers in the Browning 1919's as well as subguns. A buddy of mine got a caliber conversion kit for his Uzi. He loves it.

 

[Caleb]

where do you go to buy FA guns?

 

[tcshooter]

there's a shop here in Lafayette -(Applied Ballistics) - there's a good guy to deal with in Connorsville as well -( Rad - I got a suppressed Walther P-22 from him last year ) Both will be at Knob Creek in a couple weeks along with most of the larger FA weapon dealers in the country so you can personally handle just about every weapon you have ever thought of wanting to buy...just food for thought...

 

[oldschoolmuscle]

i am thinking bout jumping on the band wagon... i already have one surpressor and another one pending... just saving money....

i have been looking at mac's and thompsons. i think a ppsh 41 would be sweet to..

 

[VUPDblue]

At this stage of the game, I'd only look seriously into SMG's that have a reliable .22lr kit available if it were MY first MG.