Help with first reloads.

[vvet762]

I completed my first reload ever last week and have some issues (maybe)...(possibly)...(I think so). I loaded 50 rounds of 40 cal for my Glock 23 and things just don't seem right. My am using a Lee single stage press, RCBS powder uniflow measure. Using a Frankford Arsenal DS-750 scale. Tight group at 4.3 grains and Berrys 180g roundnose bullet.

The scale varies anywhere from 3.8g to 4.7g of the Titegroup in the supplied pan. I believe the RCBS is dropping powder within .3g variation. Maybe the scale isn't as good as the reviews claim. What is a good scale about $100?

Lee manual said to keep the min OAL to 1.125 but I can't find info on max length. The diagram of the 40 round shows 1.135 but what does that mean? My max length is 1.145. Quite a few didn't fit into the Wilson guage but went into my Glock barrel ok. Another thing, I measured finished cartridges and found variances of over 7 grains! I visually checked each brass case for like powder levels and all seemed ok.

I have tied hundreds of fly fishing flies but if they aren't perfect, I don't worry about blowing my hand off. I think I'll shoot left handed tomorrow at Hillside.

Any ideas??

 

[ScouT6a]

I don't load .40 S&W but been loading 20+ years. First thing that caught my eye was your scale variance. My Hornaday GS-1500 claims a tolerance of +/- 0.1 grain. It cost $30. I am curious as to why you think the powder measure is dropping within .3 grains but you think your scale is off that much? Does your scale have a check weight? What are you basing the powder measure tolerance off of?
Second, the 1.135" is the max OAL. You said your reloads are running 1.145" which probably explains why they don't fit in the Wilson gauge.
Sounds like you weighed loaded rounds? Wouldn't be concerned about a 7 grain variance in pistol rounds. You could get 4-5 grain differences in the bullets alone, depending on manufacturer. Powder and cases variances could make up the difference.

 

[1775usmarine]

I also found out that you should 5 loads before loading a bunch so if you have issues you didn't waste your time.

 

[vvet762]

I brought the powder measure to the kitchen tonight and dropped powder into the pan of the scale. I dropped over 50 loads and found the variances. I would zero the scale with pan on it and it seems that the rcbs is dropping the .3g difference. Yes, I weighed completed cartridges for the 7g difference so now that you said that may be ok I'll try them tomorrow. I loaded the rounds last week in my garage and the temp was about 42 deg. That could have some effect on the scale. I am thinking about getting a RCBS 505 scale for accuracy. What do you think? Thanks for your service (CIB) I was 11B also, in Vietnam.

 

[JStang314]

Are you making sure the "locknut" on the powder measure is staying tight? Sometimes I have had mine back out leading to some higher charges. Also did you run a full hopper of powder through the measure before starting to throw actual loads? I'm assuming it's new equipment Not sure if it helps but these are the two things I can think of.

 

[Broom_jm]

The uniflow is not necessarily the best tool for really small powder charges. Are you using the small drum and a baffle?

 

[RMC]

I double tap my RCBS on both ends of the stroke and get very consistent loads.

 

[trophyhunter]

The uniflow is not necessarily the best tool for really small powder charges. Are you using the small drum and a baffle?

Second this, if using the larger drum one will never get reasonably consistent drops for most popular pistol loads.

 

[vvet762]

Well, I made it back from the range safely today without injury, but I did fire the first few rounds left handed. I was very worried about the 50 .40 I made last week so they are now on the shelf ready to be redone. This morning I loaded 25 and it went pretty well. I brought the scale inside for the night thinking the cold garage may have made it unstable. Much better! All 25 shot just like factory with no problems. Yes the lock nut on the measure is tight. The length is a consistent 1.130 with 4.3g (+/-.3g) of Titegroup. I did take your advise and ordered the small drum and a baffle. A few cart. didn't pass the Wilson gauge test but fit in a Glock barrel all the way. It isn't the length of the round but the width that stops the round from seating all the way in. I guess a second pass with the sizing die is in order. Thanks guys

 

[Woobie]

I double tap my RCBS on both ends of the stroke and get very consistent loads.

I agree. I use an RCBS as well. My method is to double tap as well at the top and bottom of each stroke. Specific method isn't critical, but doing the same thing every time is. It's good to make sure you are getting a consistent fill in each stroke by tapping a couple of times or so at the top, then making sure you're getting it all out at the bottom of each stroke. Also, I don't know if others have had this experience, but we had a lot of static buildup with titegroup. We actually grounded our powder measure, and saw some improvement. Great powder though. I use an RCBS 1010 scale and really like it. A lot of what your looking for is the precision at the point of balance, and not all are created equal.Yours may not be faulty though. Just set it, zero it out, if you move it, rezero. If you doubt its accuracy, you can check it with a standard. But even if it is off, if you use it right, it should be consistent within a decent tolerance. Not surprised that your glock will chamber something that is out of spec. A lot of mfg do that to accommodate the unknown of differing ammunition brands and lots.

 

[IndyGlockMan]

When using a powder like TiteGroup, it's very important that the the charge weights are precise.
TiteGroup is not very forgiving and is a hot powder. It's not the powder I would recommend a beginner to start with.
Power Pistol has a much wider Min to Max load variance so if you are off a little, it's not going to be quite as critical.

Since TiteGroup is what you have, then you will have to weigh every load to make sure it's right.
Make sure you use the same motion and speed every time when throwing the powder charge. This will help make consistent powder drops a lot.
Only weigh the powder charge on your scale in the little dish. Don't weigh it in the brass case because they can vary in weight even if they are the same brand.
Re-zero the scale every time to make sure it's weighing the same way every time.

Once you are sure the charge weight is right, pour it into the case and continue on.
After the round is complete, measure the OAL and make sure the crimp is not too tight or too loose.
The case should be crimped enough to straighten out the belling, and not much more.

Check each round slips in and out of your case gauge with ease. If it sticks or hangs up, set that round aside and check it for crimp, proper bullet seat, bulged brass, etc...
If you find a .40 with a bulged case that won't fit in the case gauge, don't use it!

Following those steps should help you quite a bit.
It's a slow process, but in the end, you will have some good quality ammo there.

 

[Woobie]

If you're not using an electronic scale, I wouldn't waste the time rezeroing every time, unless the scale had been bumped. I weigh every charge loading for precision rifle, but it's too time consuming for pistol. My SOP for pistol charges is to weigh each one initially. Once I am satisfied the measure is being consistent, I will only weigh every 5 or 10. Eventually the charge weight will change though, which is why you have to continue checking. The baffle will help control that, too, as mentioned above. Just take steps to ensure yourself that you are getting a consistent charge. As the above poster mentioned, pistol powders, and especially titegroup aren't nearly as forgiving as rifle powders in regards to charge variance.

 

[vvet762]

I loaded another 50 rounds today and it went pretty smoothly. I checked each piece of brass for bulge and tested each one with the gauge. I double checked each powder was at the same height in the brass and measured every fifth drop for weight. All within .3g of 4.3g of Titegroup. Next I checked every finished shell to see if it would do the gauge test and all passed with ease. Now I wonder if maybe they are crimped too tight. The small drum and baffle should be here next Friday from Midway and I will feel better using them because of your suggestions. Thanks.

 

[Woobie]

.3g is a lot of variance for titegroup. Are you saying your loads range from 4.0 to 4.6g? I don't have a manual in front of me, but is one of those below min or above max? If I couldn't get my measure to throw closer than that, I would weigh every charge, as much of a waste of time it normally is.

 

[vvet762]

I didn't trust the digital scale so I bought a Dillon balanced scale (just like the RCBS but cheaper). I dropped 25 loads with the RCBS powder measure and checked the Dillon against the Frankford Arsenal digital. I did get a small barrell and powder baffle for the measure. Now I feel that I can drop consistent loads from the RCBS powder measure. The Dillon scale varied by only one grain and the Frankford varied 3-4 grains. I'll use the Dillon from now on and feel comfortable that the powder measure is very accurate at dropping a near perfect load each time. Thanks, guys, for the help with this. You know what you are talking about.

 

[slowG]

I use a digital scale not sure what's not to trust. I use a lee perfect powder measure while tapping at the end of each stroke and it's spot on 4.0 almost every time.

 

[vvet762]

I don't trust the digital scale. It shows a variance of .3 to .4 grains and the Dillon balance scale only varies by one grain on the same physical charge. This tells me that the RCBS is throwing accurate and consistent powder charges each time and that I can be comfortable with it. I have 5 lbs of the stuff and now don'and t worry too much about hot or too light loads. Indyglockman is correct about Titegroup being a powder that must be accurate because the range is 4.2 to 4.7 grains, per Hodgdon data. I put the powder charge at 4.4g for the 40 S&W round know that it is within safe limits. Thanks guys.

 

[BeDome]

I double tap my RCBS on both ends of the stroke and get very consistent loads.

This has worked for me for many years using many varied cartridges. The RCBS powder measure I own is not bad at all.

Any problem with a powder charge varying by 7 grains, in some cases could mean the difference between a bullet not exiting the barrel and a severely destroyed weapon and even possibly a trip to the hospital.

Not wanting to exaggerate much, but it would depend on the powder and the caliber. I use some powder charges that are smaller tan 7 gr.