For those who feel that punching justifies deadly force...

[Bushido Devil Dog]

So if you're looking at (2) get into a fish fight...

Fish fights....VERY scary stuff!!

[video=youtube;j7Rc8xP03B4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7Rc8xP03B4[/video]


...but after seeing this vid, I can see how easily it would be to get hooked...



...on the sport!

Sorry..couldn't resist...just had to do it for the halibut!

 

[BehindBlueI's]

http://www.cnn.com/2013/05/05/us/utah-soccer-death

http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=news/local/orange_county&id=7144631

http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2013/feb/04/man-dies-after-being-punched-face-barbecue/

http://www.wbtv.com/story/12336001/man-dies-after-getting-punched-in-face-suspect-charged

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2012/10/highland_man_dies_after_gettin.html

http://www.dreamindemon.com/2011/06/09/man-dies-after-being-sucker-punched-by-stranger/

http://www.wkyt.com/home/headlines/A-punch-to-the-face-leaves-man-dead-another-behind-bars-214146481.html


I can do this all day.

I will tell you regardless of your feelings or mine, the Marion County Prosecutor's Office does not agree. While a tiny percentage of blows to the head can be fatal, and as I often say every situation is going to be very fact dependent, shooting someone to prevent a punch to the face will get you prosecuted here. If there's a great disparity of force, if you're on the ground being pummeled, etc, that's not the same thing.

If a simple punch were sufficient for deadly force, you could shoot anyone who squares up with you to prevent that punch. I think we'd see the angry mob with torches if police started shooting anyone who swung at them or squared off because some folks somewhere were killed by a single blow to the head.

 

[searpinski]

I don't know if someone said this, but while punching to the face may not be deadly, you can be punched in the throat and be killed. You can also be knocked out and strangled. IMHO, if you are going to lose a fight and are afraid for your life, you are justified in shooting the other person. That's just me though.

 

[Jack Burton]

A few years back I was in a minor altercation with an urban thug who was in his late teens. He bragged to me that "I studied boxing, I'm a good boxer", thinking that it would influence my behaviour. It certainly did, but not in the way he was hoping. I have a herniated disc in my neck and I cannot take any hard blows to the head without great risk. I knew from that point on that what ever I needed to do to stop him was going to be done the moment he raised a fist.

Prior understanding of the capabilities of your opponent is a gift that can keep on giving.

 

[PapaScout]

Like I tell my children : "You have every reasonable expectation to be safe from others hurting you. If someone starts hurting you - make them stop."

If someone resorts to violence against me I will do what I feel necessary to limit it.

 

[Redhorse]

Well I know how to fight although I think fighting is really stupid and uncivilized. Ill fight back but if it gets out of hand and I can't handle the other guy (I.e. he gets the bright idea to kill me or leave me in a coma) things might get nasty.

 

[eldirector]

Just because the Marion County Prosecutor filed charges in this case, doesn't mean we should not longer defend ourselves from attackers.

If someone attacks me, I have the right and responsibility to defend myself and end the attack as quickly as possible. Indiana law provides me with a defense for exactly this scenario. Ideally, the prosecutor would know that ahead of time. Less ideally, I can bring it up in court.

 

[jbombelli]

I will tell you regardless of your feelings or mine, the Marion County Prosecutor's Office does not agree. While a tiny percentage of blows to the head can be fatal, and as I often say every situation is going to be very fact dependent, shooting someone to prevent a punch to the face will get you prosecuted here. If there's a great disparity of force, if you're on the ground being pummeled, etc, that's not the same thing.

If a simple punch were sufficient for deadly force, you could shoot anyone who squares up with you to prevent that punch. I think we'd see the angry mob with torches if police started shooting anyone who swung at them or squared off because some folks somewhere were killed by a single blow to the head.

I would have no trouble articulating how a reasonable person would be in fear of his life or serious bodily injury from being punched in the head. I can find hundreds, if not thousands of instances nationwide where someone got punched and either died or slipped into a coma as a result, and I can parade trauma surgeons and neurologists through court as expert witnesses who would all corroborate that. Dying or slipping into a coma after being punched is not that rare a thing. I've seen it happen myself with my own two eyes.

I'm in my late 40s. I've got bad knees and bad ankles, and a shoulder that gives me no end of problems due to having severely broken it a number of years ago. I can't really run anymore, so that's out. I'm not about to engage in a fist fight and end up smacking my head on the pavement, so that's out too. That only leaves shooting or knifing.

I'll do what I have to do at that moment, and whatever happens later happens later. And if I can't convince the prosecutor, I'll have to convince the judge and/or jury. But at least I'll be alive to make the effort. I'm quite sure my wife and children would rather me alive and broke, or alive and imprisoned, than dead or in a vegetative state.

And if it was ME on the jury, and someone ELSE on trial for shooting somebody who tried to punch them out, they would NOT be convicted.

 

[CathyInBlue]

I have a history of neck injuries myself. I know what a neurological insult to the cervical spinal column feels like. If I get a jab in the head, feel my body tingle, and still have motor neuron comms with my right arm, I'll definitely be drawing. If my assailant doesn't look to be backing away, I'll feel it necessary to prevent further trauma to myself by any means both necessary and at my disposal. And, like so many these days, I'm too fat and out of shape to run away.

 

[KG1]

Threadjack Alert: What if a beatdown is eminent, or has actually begun with a punch being thrown without provocation and you draw with a stern warning to cease and desist but the potential attacker doesn't heed that warning and continues to advance? Then what?

 

[Hornett]

http://www.cnn.com/2013/05/05/us/utah-soccer-death

http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=news/local/orange_county&id=7144631

http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2013/feb/04/man-dies-after-being-punched-face-barbecue/

http://www.wbtv.com/story/12336001/man-dies-after-getting-punched-in-face-suspect-charged

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2012/10/highland_man_dies_after_gettin.html

http://www.dreamindemon.com/2011/06/09/man-dies-after-being-sucker-punched-by-stranger/

http://www.wkyt.com/home/headlines/A-punch-to-the-face-leaves-man-dead-another-behind-bars-214146481.html


I can do this all day.

And then there are these people
[video=youtube_share;yV_nr9AFyZc]http://youtu.be/yV_nr9AFyZc[/video]

Also, I believe that this is the reason you are hearing so much UNARMED TEEN Trayvon Martin over and over in the media.
To further this "only getting punched, a gun is not the answer' agenda.

Punching someone is serious.
If you don't think so, then go ahead and punch someone in Marion Co and see what the Prosecutor does.

 

[cosermann]

It's interesting to note that more people were killed from 2007-2011 with personal weapons, that is hands, fists, feet, etc., than were killed with rifles, shotguns, or "other guns" (non-handgun), by strangulation, or blunt objects (clubs, hammers, etc.).

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr...e-data-table-8

Depends on the circumstances. Lawyers like that word, "depends."

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Do whatever you want, I've yet to recommend a course of action and certainly never said you can't defend yourself. I put the information out there for the sole purpose of people making an INFORMED decision, and to be able to think about it prior to the incident. You can stack the deck whichever way you want in a hypothetical, in a real shooting its going to boil down to the facts as you reasonably perceived them. The simple fact that while its possible to die from a punch, that doesn't mean you are automatically covered by self defense statutes in Indiana if you shoot someone squaring up with you.

I think we instinctively realize that if your attacker is an 80 year old granny off her meds trying to punch you vs Evander Holyfield trying to punch you warrants a different "reasonable" reaction. There is no one size fits all answer here. Trying to simplify it down as far as some here are going for, one way or the other, can cause issues down the road for the uninformed or misinformed.

 

[DragonGunner]

Punch me once and if I am still standing prepare for a barrage of fists and feet coming back at you.

Jump me and drive me to the ground pummeling me mercilessly will get you at least clubbed with my handgun if not shot.

Yup....in the OP's case it was probably getting hit and knocked down.....but then the slugger stopped, but the shooter shot anyway. In that case he could of pulled his gun for defense, but if the threat stopped or and backed off then their would be no reason to shoot for fear of your life. And thats probably what the police saw or heard from others there. But somebody attacks you for any reason or is beating you, you have have a right to defend your self an use deadly force to STOP that threat if you are in fear of your life. If I'm in fear of my life that last thing I'm going to have on mind is what the OP has said. And ya if you find out who I am bring it up in court....I'll just get Fargo to defend me....lol.

 

[Fargo]

I never would have thought that a thread posted specifically to warn about the dangers of posting certain things on the interwebs would simply provoke a majority of respondents to post those very things...

 

[mrjarrell]

I never would have thought that a thread posted specifically to warn about the dangers of posting certain things on the interwebs would simply provoke a majority of respondents to post those very things...

The mind boggles.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I never would have thought that a thread posted specifically to warn about the dangers of posting certain things on the interwebs would simply provoke a majority of respondents to post those very things...

Don't think of pink elephants!

Don't think of evidentiary harpoons!!!

 

[Spike Jones 5 2002]

An for Boilan's stupidy. he paid for his life.
Hicks did not get off his seat and go to Boila. Hicks did not touch Boilan.
Hicks should sue Boilan's estate to recover for Boilan's problem.

 

[KG1]

I get the point of the OP. As for me, I would give the puncher a flower.

 

[cobber]

Can I have another, sir?