"flying trashcan" 12 gauge slugs?

[You'll shoot your eye out]

Ok, First thing is that I do know that 12 gauge slugs don't need any help with knockdown power. With that being acknowledged.......
`There is a guy who gets the 1 ounce 12 gauge slugs with the hollow bases and loads them upside-down. It is a hollow point that you can stick your pinkie finger into up to the knuckle. he has a display with slugs expanded out to about 2 1/2 inches diameter! His deal is to use these in home defense shotguns. He claims total energy transfer at about six inches of penetration. He says that it drastically reduces the chances of over penetration. he also claims that a shot to drywall leaves a hole about a foot in diameter but the slug will be found on the floor on the other side. this is backed up with photographs of his test shots, the slug travels about 8 feet beyond the wall having dropped to the floor.
`What do you guys think of his loads and his claims? The real deal? Complete crap? He is charging $2 a shot. Would this be effective or not?

 

[throttletony]

If you could experiment with a few rounds, that might be best. Sounds interesting for sure and I'd want to find out for myself... just don't drink the kool-aid.

 

[netsecurity]

I'd rather use a turkey load or 00 buck. You don't need to blow a man I'm half to stop him, and in the dark especially the spread is the only advantage a shotgun has over a pistol. I say not necessary or useful.

 

[BlueEagle]

Can we get a link to the source?

 

[You'll shoot your eye out]

I saw the guy at a gun show (maybe Tipton?). He had a table with a little display and was selling slugs in the 5-packs. I don't remember his name so if he is on the net I don't know about it. I was just thinking about him and his slugs and wondered what you guys would think of them.

 

[redpitbull44]

I'd rather use a turkey load or 00 buck. You don't need to blow a man I'm half to stop him, and in the dark especially the spread is the only advantage a shotgun has over a pistol. I say not necessary or useful.

I can not stress this enough. At typical in home distances, the spread on buckshot of any size is minimal.

The statistics say that you will be more likely to kill an intruder with a shotgun than you will with a pistol. This is obviously due to the massive amount of tissue damage buckshot does (due to multiple projectiles in a relatively small area) as compared to a typical handgun cartridge.

Slugs are a poor choice for home defense. Especially in instances where more than one person lives within the home being defended, or there are homes nearby.

 

[drifter197]

i say way over kill! 00 buck is about all the stopping power anyone needs from a shotgun. turning the slug around backward sounds like maybe major prison time? it would be if i were on jury.

 

[ArmedProgrammer]

i say way over kill! 00 buck is about all the stopping power anyone needs from a shotgun. turning the slug around backward sounds like maybe major prison time? it would be if i were on jury.

Bovine Excrement. Why prison time for turning a slug around. If a person was "worthy" of stopping with a pistol, they're "worthy" of stopping with a shotgun, or a machine gun , or a chainsaw or a tank for that matter. Weapon is irrelevant. I call BS. i also note that your post count around here is low. Do you really mean that???

 

[netsecurity]

I prefer a 9mm anyways, it plenty lethal, especially with hollow points, is easier to hide and provides better mobility indoors.

 

[Robjps]

spread is the only advantage a shotgun has over a pistol. I say not necessary or useful.

So you are saying pistol firepower is superior to 3inch slugs or buckshot?

A shotgun is putting at least x2 and up to x4 lead downrange each pull of the trigger right?

 

[trinitrotoluene85]

Bovine Excrement. Why prison time for turning a slug around. If a person was "worthy" of stopping with a pistol, they're "worthy" of stopping with a shotgun, or a machine gun , or a chainsaw or a tank for that matter. Weapon is irrelevant. I call BS. i also note that your post count around here is low. Do you really mean that???

I was warned multiple times by police and lawyers that for the purposes of self or home defense, to only use factory loads. The reasons explained to me were that a DA could try to spin the reloads into something like "killer bullets" and convince a less-gun-knowledgeable jury that you had no intent to simply stop an attacker or intruder, your intent was to kill the attacker/intruder. Basically the DA could try to discredit your self-defense claims because you had an intent to kill (attempted murder/premeditated murder/murder by opportunity).

"The defendant lured the victim into his home by leaving a door unlocked/flashing his money around/showing off his TV by not closing the blinds, just so he could be justified in using his super high power, extra deadly bullets against a home invader who didn't know he'd been lured into a trap. A death house. The defendant wasn't content enough just to stop the intruder from taking his stuff, he wanted him dead, and he wanted to shoot him with the most deadly bullets he could create (or find from another like minded death dealer)."

I fear the Hornady Zombie Max might end up in a similar fate if someone ends up having to use it in self defense. An over zealous, under-educated DA could easily spin that for a jury.

 

[mike4sigs]

Hold on HERE! Now people we have drifted off the O.P.'s original question !!
To me it sounds like an over kill and as somebody else already stated ! I WOULD Not use an un tested load for Home secuirity and or personnel Def.
and while we are talking about over kill if we all stop and think about. God for bid we ever have to, but in the middle of the night we pull the trigger on a Shotgun, any gauge towards a intruder they we will probably be falling down because they are slidding in their own *****.
Just my opinion !

 

[melensdad]

I'd rather use a turkey load or 00 buck. You don't need to blow a man I'm half to stop him, and in the dark especially the spread is the only advantage a shotgun has over a pistol. I say not necessary or useful.

At typical in home self defense ranges of 12' or so, how much spread do you get? I figure no more than about 2" so aim is actually critical.

Further, wouldn't you have significantly more energy with the shotgun over the pistol? You claim spread is the 'only advantage' but a load of 9 32 caliber 00 Buck is significantly more power transfer than a single pistol round from most typical defensive handguns.

i say way over kill! 00 buck is about all the stopping power anyone needs from a shotgun. turning the slug around backward sounds like maybe major prison time? it would be if i were on jury.

I'd have to raise the BS flag on this post too. Why would turning the round backwards be prison time? It, if it performs as claimed (and I am not saying it does), would enhance safety to all your family members as it would prevent over-penetration so you would have a dramatically reduced chance of killing a family member in an adjacent room. For that matter a traditional shotgun slug can actually penetrate exterior walls of your home so if it performs as claimed it would protect your neighbors too.

 

[ArmedProgrammer]

I was warned multiple times by police and lawyers that for the purposes of self or home defense, to only use factory loads. The reasons explained to me were that a DA could try to spin the reloads into something like "killer bullets" and convince a less-gun-knowledgeable jury that you had no intent to simply stop an attacker or intruder, your intent was to kill the attacker/intruder. Basically the DA could try to discredit your self-defense claims because you had an intent to kill (attempted murder/premeditated murder/murder by opportunity).

"The defendant lured the victim into his home by leaving a door unlocked/flashing his money around/showing off his TV by not closing the blinds, just so he could be justified in using his super high power, extra deadly bullets against a home invader who didn't know he'd been lured into a trap. A death house. The defendant wasn't content enough just to stop the intruder from taking his stuff, he wanted him dead, and he wanted to shoot him with the most deadly bullets he could create (or find from another like minded death dealer)."

I fear the Hornady Zombie Max might end up in a similar fate if someone ends up having to use it in self defense. An over zealous, under-educated DA could easily spin that for a jury.

TNT - I agree that an overzealous DA _could_ try to spin it. And I would tend to only use factory loads for that reason. But drifter197 said that he would vote for a longer sentence "if he were on the jury"... THAT is what I had heart burn over. It's one thing for Jane Q. Public to be swayed by an argument that is obviously BS. But for a responsible gun owner???

Sorry for the threadjack, and now back to our regularly scheduled flamethrowing....

 

[Mr Evilwrench]

Wait, what if you're firing something like hexolit? This is a nasty load that'll de-snot anybody you shoot with it, but it's just as factory as any 00 buck.

 

[Shootin'IN]

I was warned multiple times by police and lawyers that for the purposes of self or home defense, to only use factory loads. The reasons explained to me were that a DA could try to spin the reloads into something like "killer bullets" and convince a less-gun-knowledgeable jury that you had no intent to simply stop an attacker or intruder, your intent was to kill the attacker/intruder. Basically the DA could try to discredit your self-defense claims because you had an intent to kill (attempted murder/premeditated murder/murder by opportunity).

"The defendant lured the victim into his home by leaving a door unlocked/flashing his money around/showing off his TV by not closing the blinds, just so he could be justified in using his super high power, extra deadly bullets against a home invader who didn't know he'd been lured into a trap. A death house. The defendant wasn't content enough just to stop the intruder from taking his stuff, he wanted him dead, and he wanted to shoot him with the most deadly bullets he could create (or find from another like minded death dealer)."

I fear the Hornady Zombie Max might end up in a similar fate if someone ends up having to use it in self defense. An over zealous, under-educated DA could easily spin that for a jury.

I have been told the same thing from local uniformed buddy's.
To only use factory loads for home defense or personal protection because of the spin the DA puts on the reason you chose to use a hand loaded round over a factory load.
But the backwards slug should be good for close range deer hunting......Deer don't have lawyers! Yet!

 

[williamnewman1]

agreed that could make a decent close range deer slug , because in indiana 12g deer slugs don't travel very far and are therefore safe to hunt , whereas rifle rounds will go for miles and kill anyone in a 5 mile radius

 

[Bill B]

I have been told the same thing from local uniformed buddy's.
To only use factory loads for home defense or personal protection because of the spin the DA puts on the reason you chose to use a hand loaded round over a factory load.
But the backwards slug should be good for close range deer hunting......Deer don't have lawyers! Yet!

You mean something like these?