Any Trapdoor Springfield experts?

[Slow Hand]

I’m a sucker for crusty old guns and just picked up a pair of Trapdoors! I’ve got some questions and may need some help. I have Poyer’s nook on them and will be referencing it a bunch. The long one seems to be late production and is missing it’s rear sight. The finish is kind of rough but the bore looks good and I’m assuming it’ll be a good shooter once I get a sight for it.

The cut down one is very rough and may just be a wall hanger but it’s pretty cool. It has 1864 stamped on the lock plate and a very low serial number. Unfortunately the bore is pretty much smooth and the Trapdoor is very loose. If anyone has any good reference websites or articles, I’d love to hear about them!

 

[Mongo59]

Great find! These are easy fixer uppers. Always take the action out of the stock before trying to punch the pivot pin to remove breech, you will blow a chunk out of your stock if you don't.

If it is truly an 1864 then it should be an Allin conversion. (.50 cal) The 1873 is the most common one out there. Neither had much in the way of lands coming from the factory. They would put a hickory stick with the groves carved into them inside the barrel and run them through a hammer mill to impress the groves and raise the lands. The old timers in these parts used them as .410s and the shot wouldn't spread and eventually the lands went away.

If you get them shootable do not use brass clad projectiles. The brass is too hard for the soft metal barrel and is actually the wrong diameter.

Both of those are great candidates for a stabilization (see my Winchester 1897 redo). My two looked almost as rough and turned out nicely...

 

[Mongo59]

Google "1864 Allin conversion trapdoor" for more info on the carbine.

Type in 1873 Springfield and there will be pages of sites...

 

[Slow Hand]

Well, the ‘carbine’ has been cut down. According to my book by Poyer, it was early 1873. A buddy looked it up in another book and it shows 1879, but that seems late give the 35xx serial number. It does appear to be a 45/70, not a 50/70. I’ll do some soaking and more scrubbing but I’m pretty sure it won’t shoot. Also, the breech block on that one is pretty loose. I’ll have to figure out what kind of rear sight the uncut one should be and get it sorted out. I have high hopes for it being a good shooter. Not sure what I’ll do with the other one. It’s pretty rough, may just be a ‘wall hanger’ Even though I don’t have a good place to display it.
As to shooting them, I’ve got a decent amount of real Goex BP and molds for a 300 and 425 gr bullets I can cast out of 20-1 to grab those s shallow grooves!

 

[Mongo59]

If you can read the cartouche on the left side of the stock on the 1873 it will have the manufacture date. The good thing about so many 1873's is there are so many parts out there.

The cut down may be a Bannerman Special, I wouldn't give up on it.

On the late run model they used any old part they had on hand just to get it down the assembly line. So much so they don't even have actual production numbers, just quesstimates. Breech blocks and pins are plentiful, the ejectors have become scarce and pricey. From what I see in the pics both warrant a new lease on life. Start with the one that will be easiest (for the reward) and do the harder one later on, but definitely do it...

 

[Slow Hand]

With some more looking and research, I realized the uncut one is a Cadet Rifle. My buddy said it was shipped to Baylor University which adds to the interest. I’m looking for old pictures of their military cadets and rifle teams but everything so far comes back with modern pictures! Regardless, it is neat knowing some of the history of the rifles and makes you wonder how it made it back to Indiana!

 

[rob63]

This is the website you want. Al Frasca knows everything there is to know about trapdoors and is a super nice guy as well.

The U.S. Springfield Trapdoor Rifle Information Center

THIS SITE SPECIALIZES IN: (1) TRAPDOOR SPRINGFIELD RIFLES & CARBINES, 1865-1893; (2) INDIAN WAR & SPAN-AM WAR: U.S SPRINGFIELD TRAPDOOR ARMS; (3) 1865-1893 MILITARY: BAYONETS, KNIVES, ENTRENCHING TOOLS/TROWELS, MILLS & PRAIRIE BELTS, MCKEEVER / DYER POUCHES & CARBINE BOOTS.

www.trapdoorcollector.com

 

[Slow Hand]

This is the website you want. Al Frasca knows everything there is to know about trapdoors and is a super nice guy as well.

The U.S. Springfield Trapdoor Rifle Information Center

THIS SITE SPECIALIZES IN: (1) TRAPDOOR SPRINGFIELD RIFLES & CARBINES, 1865-1893; (2) INDIAN WAR & SPAN-AM WAR: U.S SPRINGFIELD TRAPDOOR ARMS; (3) 1865-1893 MILITARY: BAYONETS, KNIVES, ENTRENCHING TOOLS/TROWELS, MILLS & PRAIRIE BELTS, MCKEEVER / DYER POUCHES & CARBINE BOOTS.

www.trapdoorcollector.com

Yes sir, I have looked through his site a good bit. Lots of info, much of it for the advanced collector.

 

[Dog1]

I love my Trapdoor carbine...its fun to shoot.

Al Fresca was very helpful in researching mine. Mine was issued to the 5th Calvary, Southwest Department

 

[Dog1]

A few more pictures

 

[Mongo59]

A few more pictures

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Nice keyhole butt plate. I have never found one that had the extractor still in it. I guess we can thank the 7th Cav for that mod...

 

[Dog1]

Nice keyhole butt plate. I have never found one that had the extractor still in it. I guess we can thank the 7th Cav for that mod..

Thanks! I bought this two years ago at a civil war artifacts shop in Gettysburg called the Union Drummer Boy.

It was sitting there sandwiched in between a Sharps Cavalry carbine and a Spencer carbine. Both of them were in pretty rough shape. But this one caught my eye because of its condition. It had been sitting for over seventy years in a closet and when the owner died the shop bought his entire Civil War and Indian War collection.

It has a fantastic bore and it is so much fun to shoot. I cast pure lead bullets and I use trapdoor safe smokeless loads

 

[BGDave]

Nice keyhole butt plate. I have never found one that had the extractor still in it. I guess we can thank the 7th Cav for that mod...

I think it was National Geographic that went through the Custer battlefield after a wild fire cleared the brush a found numerous 45/70 cases with knife marks on the rims.
Major bummer for some poor troupers.

 

[Dog1]

I think it was National Geographic that went through the Custer battlefield after a wild fire cleared the brush a found numerous 45/70 cases with knife marks on the rims.
Major bummer for some poor troupers.

It was those damn copper shells.