Auditory exclusion

[Excalibur]

I was talking to a buddy of mine about a gun fight in doors and how loud it can be and it would hurt your ears because a gun shot in doors is really loud.

My buddy was in the Marines and was a police officer and told me during a gun fight, your body protects itself from the loud noise called auditory seclusion or I think he was referring to auditory exclusion and your ears protect itself and shuts down a bit and you're not going to lose your hearing.

Can anyone explain to me more about this and how different calibers and different guns will affect your hearing differently indoors or outdoors.

 

[88GT]

Tagging for interest.

I certainly can't say for sure, but my guess is that's it's perception, not reality. The decibels don't change and the body can't filter them on its own. But the flight-or-fight response may render the effects of concussive/extraordinarily loud sounds less influential in affecting the individual's response. It's probably the brain's ability to limit the inputs of stimuli that impede a survival response.

 

[remauto1187]

I have to agree. The ears/body cannot muffle sounds. Ear plugs/muffs can only do that for the human ear. Once the damage is done to the ear drum, it is permanent. But certianly the brain can and does limit input from nerves to protect during many different situations along the lines of extreme heat/cold, etc. But this trait of course has limits. Human "shock" has its ups and downs. It can be the key cause of us surviving a serious injury but it can also be the key factor as to why we did not survive a serious injury also.

 

[actaeon277]

On Combat talks about 3 physiological effects.
Auditory Exclusion
Temporal Distortion
and (can't remember the term) a deadening of the sense of touch.

 

[actaeon277]

Maybe ill explain more when I'm at a computer.

 

[Denny347]

Tagging for interest.

I certainly can't say for sure, but my guess is that's it's perception, not reality. The decibels don't change and the body can't filter them on its own. But the flight-or-fight response may render the effects of concussive/extraordinarily loud sounds less influential in affecting the individual's response. It's probably the brain's ability to limit the inputs of stimuli that impede a survival response.

From one of the articles.

The researchers concluded the blood rushing through the eardrums at that speed actually creates noise that cancels out what the person is hearing.


http://www.samatters.com/understanding-stress-part-6-auditory-exclusion/


Physiology of Close Combat - Lieutenant Colonel Dave Grossman, Author

 

[remauto1187]

From one of the articles.

The researchers concluded the blood rushing through the eardrums at that speed actually creates noise that cancels out what the person is hearing.


http://www.samatters.com/understanding-stress-part-6-auditory-exclusion/


Physiology of Close Combat - Lieutenant Colonel Dave Grossman, Author

The sound may very well be "canceled out" but the sound wave is still there along with the excessive pressure on the ear drum which causes loss of hearing or deafness.

 

[BrewerGeorge]

You might not hear it, but that doesn't mean it won't be damaging. Hearing is accomplished by sensing the movements of stereocilia that move when vibrated. When exposed to overpressure from too loud a shock wave, they are damaged. Ringing in you ears is caused by the tips of some of these cilia breaking off. If they grow back, the tinnitus goes away. If the sound is too loud, or with repeated damage, the tinnitus can become permanent or the sound go away entirely.

 

[ModernGunner]

The concussion from the pressure wave is the same, regardless of what the brain is doing.

Hearing loss (regardless of amount) is not only permanent, it's cumulative. Whether you're a year old or 90 years old, once that 'percentage' of hearing is gone, it's gone.

Such occurrences, in addition to others mentioned ('tunnel vision', fine motor skill dissipation, etc.) is why it's beneficial to train (combat training) with someone who has 'been there / done that'. Now, that viewpoint isn't very popular on INGO, but that doesn't diminish the fact that trainers who have actually been involved in such scenarios can provide a perspective that no 'theoretician' can provide.

 

[88GT]

From one of the articles.

The researchers concluded the blood rushing through the eardrums at that speed actually creates noise that cancels out what the person is hearing.


http://www.samatters.com/understanding-stress-part-6-auditory-exclusion/


Physiology of Close Combat - Lieutenant Colonel Dave Grossman, Author

Yes, that's a physiological way of reducing the input to the brain. It doesn't in any way reduce the actual sound wave.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Actually, your ear can protect itself for short periods of time from loud noise. It's got a process where muscles change tension on membranes and the location of the little bones in your ear. It doesn't react fast enough for that first gun shot, though, and the muscles that pull the membranes and stirrup get tired and relax limiting how long it will last.

The Ear's Protective Mechanisms

That's a completely separate thing from auditory exclusion, though, which is a mental affect. Your brain just doesn't bother to process it, because it's working on other things.

The biggest caliber I've fired indoors with no hearing protection was a .357 magnum. It let my ears ring for a bit, but my next hearing test showed no changes.

 

[Ericpwp]

Ever forget your hearing protection indoors? I did, but didn't hear the shot. Just silence and ringing in my ears.

 

[Excalibur]

Well thanks for all the discussion. We need to go indepth into this more often since rarely do I see instructors talk about your hearing during combat.

 

[actaeon277]

Hearing loss is not going to occur from one fight.

Its cumulative.

 

[USMC-Johnson]

Hearing loss absolutely can absolutely be connected to one incident. It depends what that incident is but to think that it takes multiple times to cause permanent damage is just wrong.

 

[actaeon277]

Hearing loss absolutely can absolutely be connected to one incident. It depends what that incident is but to think that it takes multiple times to cause permanent damage is just wrong.

Most hearing loss is not tied to single gunshots, unless the gun is up against the ear, as if someone else is firing near your ear.
Im not including grenades and explosions

 

[USMC-Johnson]

Most hearing loss is not tied to single gunshots, unless the gun is up against the ear, as if someone else is firing near your ear.
Im not including grenades and explosions

It all has to do with what gun. generally one single shot wont do too much damage but it aint good. I thought you said gun fight but i may have misread.

All i can say is wear the best ear protection you can afford. Being deaf or close to it SUCKS

 

[Lectric102002]

I have been around gunfire for a large portion of my adult life (military, combat, a stint as a deputy, deer hunting) and now frequent range time. I've got a good case of tinnitus. Are they related ?

 

[Who Dares Wins]

I keep some Pro-Ears in my bedroom in case I need them in a hurry. Any shooting indoors will be very loud and if you have intruders you need all of your senses.

 

[Denny347]

Yes, that's a physiological way of reducing the input to the brain. It doesn't in any way reduce the actual sound wave.

Not scientific but I nor those I know who have experienced this phenomenon do not even have ringing in the ears afterwards. It is as if no shots were even fired in the first place. Strange feeling. I am talking about instant gun battles where the duration of the shots fired is very very short. Protracted gun fire would be different because the body's reaction to it would be different.