[FEELER 2] June 2013 Youth Day @ Winamac DNR Range

[jedi]

DNR Winamac replied to my initial proposal for the Youth Day they wish for us to help hold and we got a better understanding of the direction they wish for us to take.

--BACKGROUND THREADS---
Link to old feeler thread here
Link to proposal I sent them here
(Edit to remove potential sponsors as they have NOT confirmed yet)
--END BACKGROUND THREADS---

--EMAIL EXCHANGE--

Hi Mr. Despot,

Back in September of this year at the Winamac range you introduced yourself to our group, NorthWest Indiana Indiana Gun Owners social group (NWI INGO), about the new rule changes for the range as well as an idea you had on doing a youth day at the range next year.

Well our 2012 NWI INGO Meet & Shoot season came to a close for us in November and we have since then devoted our time in determining if we could help you with the event. Based on member feedback we do have the manpower and equipment to host the event for you. Please see the attached document showing our proposal for the event to help start a dialog if you are still interested in doing the event.

Our membership does have some questions about the event which I was not able to answer which I am hoping you could after reading our proposal.

1) Date of the event (NWI INGO is available to hold it on a weekend in April , May or June of 2013)
2) Age of children
3) Cut off age of children
4) Presence of parents at event (NWI INGO may not have manpower to teach/cook **AND** also do childcare)
5) Liability waivers
6) What demographic/children are we targeting? (first time shooters, single parent homes, etc.)

Our current discussion on this topic can be found here:
https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/break_room/238623-feeler_youth_day_winamac_dnr_range.html

Hope to hear back from you soon.

Replay from DNR Winamac

Thanks for getting the ball rolling on this. Looks like you have a bunch of members that would be willing to help out - that's great. I know I was vague & did not give you much direction when we talked before about holding a shooting event. What I would like to have is an event that kids could come and shoot several different types of guns / archery / crossbows in a safe, teaching environment. This would be to just introduce kids to a wide variety of equipment and stress safety, proper shooting form (as much as possible for young kids), and just making it fun so that kids might get interested in shooting.

Kingsbury FWA has hosted a big shooting event for several years now (120 - 150 kids) put on by the local NWTF Chapter. They have stations set up where kids can file through and shoot a few clay pigeons with shotguns, .22 cal rifles, bows, BB guns for little guys, etc. and it is structured but the kids can kind of pick and choose what they want to try. They can get back in line and shoot several times on one station if that's what they want to do. They have their range closed down for this event from 8 am to 1 pm - then it is opened back up for the public - so basically they run the event from 8 am to noon and then they clean up by 1 pm. They hold a raffle for donated door prizes at around noon (this keeps the kids around for the entire event).

I am not looking to have that big of event - particularly for the first year - but I think the format sounds like it would be good for kids. We have found that extended periods of anything (fishing, hunting, shooting, hiking, etc.) tends to loose kids interest. Its best to have several activities and keep things fairly short and sweet.

We have several 20 ga shotguns, 20 ga shells and clay targets with two throwers, we will also have a couple of crossbows & crossbow targets. I'm sure I can get some other archery equipment from the 4-H shooting sports program. It sounds like you have plenty of .22's to choose from. Kingsbury said they use spinning targets and that way they save time from having to replace paper targets. I think it would be nice to have a couple of muzzleloaders for kids to shoot too, but that may be too much of a hassle. Handguns were tried at Kingsbury, but they have moved away from them now - I guess it was a little too stressful to keep the muzzle pointed in the correct position in the hands of kids. They also tried rifles like .223's but said they were just too loud. That may not be as much of a factor at the Winamac range (Kingsbury's range is closed in with concrete buffers).

I know I'm rambling, but I hope I'm kind of giving you a better idea of what kind of event I was thinking about hosting. We don't have to do this exactly like Kingsbury does their event, but they have done this for several years and have figured out things that work well and thing that don't work so well just by trial & error. The other thing that could be scaled back would be cooking lunch. If it is going to be too costly or if in this format it would be too difficult to judge how many kids would attend, then we could always just provide some snack cakes and drinks and call it good. I would rather concentrate more on getting kids shooting than providing lunch (if lunch would take too many volunteers or funds).

The gentleman that oversees Kingsbury's shooting event is Rick Glassman XXXXXXXXX. I would not hesitate to call and talk with him to get more details of how they set up their shoot. Like I said, we do not have to do everything they do - but it might be a real good starting point to go from.

To answer some of your questions:
1. The month of June would be best for us. I would say mid June would be good, but the volunteers could decide when in June would be best for them.

2. No real age limit, but would be designed for kids 8-16. Real small kids could shoot BB guns.

3. At least one parent or guardian would be required to supervise their children - will not be able to just drop off kids at the range unsupervised.

4. IDNR would require signed liability waivers from participants and volunteers - we have the liability waivers.

5. This would be primarily targeting any youngster, but could also include any inexperienced shooter (women or men that have very limited shooting experience) in order to provide a safe & fun shooting experience in order to possibly provide a spark of interest in shooting / hunting / outdoor related activities.

6. Unfortunately, we can not use any target holder at our range that moves the target away from the base of the backstop and closer to the shooter. We may be able to move the shooters closer to the backstop for this event (not sure yet). Our range directives are to not put targets anywhere except at the base of the backstop in order to keep bullets from skipping and exiting the range. The new ranges at Roush Lake, Atterbury, & Kingsbury have overhead baffles that prevent this, so they are allowed to use moveable target holders, but ranges like Winamac, J-P, & Willow Slough are not permitted to use those.

Please feel free to e-mail or call me anytime to discuss this further or if you have any other questions that come up. Thanks again for you organizational skills and the willingness of the NW Indiana Gun Owners group to volunteer their time and equipment to put on this event. I'm sure together we can get this planned out and put on a really fun and safe shoot.

--END EMAIL EXCHANGE--

So that gets us to this feeler #2 thread with a poll of pick the date in JUNE plus to start the discussion on how to do this.

The time frame we can say is 8-noon (shooting time), lunch at noon to 1pm and then cleanup/collapse of stuff to 25 yard range*

Our initial proposal (and this concern was brought up by our own volunteer instructors) was too heavy on shooting hours and too structured. What is envisioned is booths where kids can come and try out the weapon at the booth. Think of an expo like event. So the kids get in line and get to shoot say for example 10 mins or 100 rounds etc... and then get to try a different booth.

On the 25 yard we would have iron sights 10/22s along with ARs in .22.
On the 50 & 100 yard we would have 10/22s with scopes, ARs in .223, AKs in 7.62x39 and Mosins for the bigger kids in any.
Jedi Comment: Concern on ammo cost/availability of bigger calibers

In addition the shotgun range would be used with 20 ga shotguns for clay pigeon shooting.
Jedi Comment: We need some additional 20 ga shotguns and clay thrower as well. If you have please post.

Comments, Questions, Suggestions?


*NWI INGO WILL NOT be hosting an offical Meet & Shoot in JUNE 2013 since we will be doing the Youth Day event however the Youth Day event is until 1PM and the range is open until 7PM so we could stay after the event and shoot ourselves on the 25 yard like we do in order months. For this reason I say cleanup/collapse all the stuff on the 100 yard and 50 yard to the 25 yard range (home base) once the range opens back up to the public.



---UPDATE---
DNR has enough youth shotguns, throwers and bow & arrows so they can handle that portion equipment wise. We will just need manpower for the trap area.

We have 15 youth shotguns and 3 adult 20 ga shotguns and 2 clay target throwers with the ability of getting a couple more if needed along with the clay targets - so that's covered. The archery equipment won't be a problem either - I'll be able to line that up.

I think it sounds like we got enough firearms and archery equipment to make a good event. It might be nice to have a few "booths" or tables with info from groups like NRA, NWTF, IN State Trappers Asso., INGO to share what the organizations are about and maybe some stuff for kids and or parents to see. We can talk about that later. Thanks for the help.

 

[jedi]

Tenative Instructors
1. repeater1977
2. gunbunnies
3. auntiebellum
4. kjf40
5. actaeon277
6. actaeon277's dad
7. daddymikey1975
8. snooploggydog
9. melensdad
10. cabel
11. ghostofwinter
12. sadclownwp
13. ChrisK


Tenative Cooks
1. Jedi
2. lonehoosier
3. klb
4. melensdad
5. Mrs. kjf40 (Amy)

Photographer
1. nipprdog

Equipment Lenders

Iron-Sights
1. 10/22 (Jedi)
2. 10/22 (gunbunnies)
3. 10/22 #1 (auntiebellum)
4. 10/22 #2 (auntiebellum)
5. 10/22 #3 (auntiebellum)
6. 10/22 (actaeon277)
7. 10/22 #1 (melensdad)
8. 10/22 #2 (melensdad)
9. 10/22 (snooploggydog)
10. 10/22 (sacrifice_me)
11. 10/22 (ChrisK)

Scopes
1. 10/22 #1 (gunbunnies)
2. 10/22 #2 (gunbunnies)
3. 10/22 #3 (gunbunnies)
4. 10/22 (sacrifice_me)
5. 10/22 (jofra)
6. 10/22 (kjf40)
7. 10/22 #1 (nipprdog)
8. 10/22 #1 (nipprdog)

Rifles
ARs in .223


AKs in 7.62x39


Mosin in 7.62x54r


Others

20 ga. Shotguns
1. Andy219
2. Joe


AMMO
.22lr total = 1575
1. actaeon277 (525 .22lr)
2. kjf40 (525 of .22lr)
3. jedi (525 of .22lr)

 

[jedi]

Donations we need for shooting

• ammo in .22lr
• ammo for 20g trap shooting
• [STRIKE]earplugs (disposable type)[/STRIKE] GhostOfWinter
• eye protection (left at booth shared by each shooter)
• clay pigeon thrower
• clay pigeons

Donations we need for eating

• hot dogs
• hot dog buns
• ketchup
• mustard
• relish
• pop
• water
• plates
• napkins
• Kol-aid mix for 5 gallon water coolers

 

[Andy219]

I can help with shotgun/clays. I have a 20 guage a lot of 20 guage ammo and a couple cases of clays. I can also bring a good amount of disposable hearing protection, and may be able to get the railroad to donate a few boxes or more of safety glasses. I'll check on that and get back.

Anyway ill be there to help anyway I can.

 

[GhostofWinter]

I've got the ear protection covered Jedi. If you reread the letter Jedi you will see where he states that they have several 20 gauge shotguns, ammo, clays and two throwers. How many more do you think they are going to need besides what they already have?

 

[jedi]

I've got the ear protection covered Jedi. If you reread the letter Jedi you will see where he states that they have several 20 gauge shotguns, ammo, clays and two throwers. How many more do you think they are going to need besides what they already have?

Forgot to include in my original post the email I sent him with additional questions. I do not yet have a reply for this.

Thank you for the reply and for giving me a better idea of what you are looking for.
Let me go back to the group with what you have given me to see what we can come up with.
Now that we know June is the target date I can poll them to see what Saturday in June works best.




I'm thinking keep the 10/22 (iron sights) on the 25 yard and add ARs in .22 as well.

Use 10/22 scoped along with ARs (in .223) on the 50 yard.
For the bigger kids we can do ARs and Mosins on the 100 yard (I know we have a handgun of Mosins as well in the group).


How many shotguns in 20 ga do you have?

We can add to that number but not sure by how many (will ask the group). I do know we have at least 2 clay throwers in the group.


In terms of bow and arrow I'm at a loss as I think we have only 2 members with equipment.


In terms of food don't worry about it we easily feed 70 adults in July (our biggest month when we get together) so feeding the kids hot dogs is no issue. I am already getting inquiries from our southern members (INDY area) on how they can donate for this event. So food/ammo we got covered. Plus we have more than enough instructors as well.
We have some members who are not comfortable teaching but want to help set-up, cook, etc.


Looks like Kingsbury does something similar to what IL State Rifle Association use to do at the KanKakee Range a few years ago. Basically each booth had a different type of firearm (handguns, rifle, shotgun) and adults were able to try any of them they just had to buy tickets for ammo that the range provided. It was a good way to try out various guns at the adult level.

Just want to ensure we have enough equipment in case their breaks/can't be used for whatever reason.

 

[nipprdog]

I voted for the 22nd since I'll be fishing in Minnesota the 8th and 15th.

 

[geronimojoe85]

after the event and shoot ourselves on the 25

Can't we just do the kool-aid thing.

I can give up a 20ga shotgun and probably make it out there, wherever you need me.

 

[jedi]

I voted for the 22nd since I'll be fishing in Minnesota the 8th and 15th.

think of the children!!! the children.

 

[Wild Deuce]

PM sent

 

[jedi]

Updated OP with last reply from DNR.
They have enough shotguns youth 20g so we just need manpower and supplies (ammo and clay piegons) for the trap area.

Also anyone have contacts with

NRA, NWTF, IN State Trappers Asso

Probably also boy scouts, girls scouts, Indiana Rifle Association.
Hum.. perhaps the MODs show up from INGO?

I do have a contact or two with NRA. We did have the NRA out there last time and I know of another local NRA guy that mans the Cabela/Bass Pro tables as well.

 

[actaeon277]

Jedi, I can kick in some ear and eye pro also.
And a few bricks of .22.
I'll have to vote when I've had time to look at my calendar.

 

[kjf40]

I can bring a box of .22.....i think we will probably have plenty but i'll bring a box of 500/550.

 

[ChrisK]

Jedi, my 10-22 is scoped, I can bring my Lever Action Henry with irons.

 

[jedi]

Jedi, my 10-22 is scoped, I can bring my Lever Action Henry with irons.

Ok will update please bring both so the kids can handle a lever action as well. Those are so cool to shoot.

 

[daddymikey1975]

Jedi,

I have 2 scoped bolt action Savages in .22 w/ ten round mags, I also have a GSG-522 w/ red dot that I can bring.

I will also bring 3 or 4 boxes (at least) of green box Remington .22 as well.

I see we're trying to stick with the ruger platform, but I'm willing to bring my 3 rifles if you believe it would be ok.

As a side note.. (Shhh.. my older 2 boys don't know they're getting the Savage's for christmas either LOL)

 

[jedi]

Thanks actually based on my last talk with winamac we are not trying to stick with ruger platform but have a slew of rifles in .22 primarly that the kids can try both on scope and iron sights so your additiond will help.

 

[jedi]

Poll closes in a few days!

 

[jedi]

SAT 15 JUNis the winner!!!

 

[nipprdog]

I voted for the 22nd since I'll be fishing in Minnesota the 8th and 15th.

SAT 15 JUNis the winner!!!

I won't be able to make it then.