When is it your reloading error vs a mechanical problem.

[JRHawkins1118]

As some of you know I’m new to reloading. I have been working a lot through trial and error along with help from you guys.

I have struggled quite a bit getting going. This past week I really took my time. Broke it up into several evenings. I measured every cartridge, inspected loads, paid attention to the amount of bell I was putting on, and then the seating. The seating took the most time.

I took just 100 rounds with me today to the range of my reloads. I was shooting a 124 grain bullet. Also took a box of 115 blazer brass with me.

In my 100 reloads I had 5 that failed to fire. You could see where the firing pin hit the primer but didn’t shoot. When I put them in the magazine a second time they fired.

The blazer brass all 50 fired fine.

In the meantime, I was wondering if my recoil spring could be the issue. The factor recoil spring is a 16lb spring, Cajun gun works also sells a 14.5 and a 13lb spring. I had recently put in the 13lb spring. I do have a 14.5 and a 16lb spring for it.

Using a CZ P-10f.

Is it possible that it’s my recoil spring weight and not my reload?

 

[Creedmoor]

The rounds that didn't fire the first time had primers that weren't seated all the way. the first firing pin hit seated them and the second time fired them is my guess.
What press are you using? and are you using the press to seat your primers?

 

[edwea]

Stock gun? I've never had any problems with any of my p10's. I'll second the primer seating as noted above as well.

 

[natdscott]

Is it possible that it’s my recoil spring weight and not my reload?

Think through this, mechanically, for a sec:

What about a recoil spring could possibly cause the firing pin--which DID make impact--to not ignite the primers?

Creedmoor /ended this thread.

When you prime, if you value the "bang", you need to physically check every round. MOST primers in MOST pockets need to be seated -0.002 to -0.005 (ie: 2-5 below flush) for the anvil to make good, solid contact with the bottom of the pocket.

You will be amazed, if you will simply start "swiping" a finger across the primer in the case, how accurate you will become in sensing relative depth.

In .223 casings, for example, I bet you I can tell within 0.001" how deep one of my primers is seated, without the mic.

Reps.

 

[indyblue]

The rounds that didn't fire the first time had primers that weren't seated all the way. the first firing pin hit seated them and the second time fired them is my guess.
What press are you using? and are you using the press to seat your primers?

This is one of the reasons I only use an RCBS hand primer. You can feel when they are seated very easily.

I don’t have a progressive press, but if I did, I would probably still hand prime. Just because I’m funny that way.

I’ve been reloading for a little over three years and produced about 1000 rounds and except for three squibs, they all fired. I corrected my reloading and inspection procedure and have not had another squib since (reloading trays are your friend so you can see every case has been properly charged before seating).

 

[JRHawkins1118]

Think through this, mechanically, for a sec:

What about a recoil spring could possibly cause the firing pin--which DID make impact--to not ignite the primers?

Creedmoor /ended this thread.

When you prime, if you value the "bang", you need to physically check every round. MOST primers in MOST pockets need to be seated -0.002 to -0.005 (ie: 2-5 below flush) for the anvil to make good, solid contact with the bottom of the pocket.

You will be amazed, if you will simply start "swiping" a finger across the primer in the case, how accurate you will become in sensing relative depth.

In .223 casings, for example, I bet you I can tell within 0.001" how deep one of my primers is seated, without the mic.

Reps.

I believe you are likely correct on this. I use the primer arm on my rock chucker. I often find that I have to work harder on some primers to get them to seat. So running my finger across it will most likely help.

The reason I thought recoil spring was because I had purchased my roil spring tuning kit from Cajun Gun Works. So originally I thought it must be associated with the spring. Then when I went to there site I found this statement from them:

A light recoil spring may cause the muzzle to rise too much, which can stress the slide stop pin. If the recoil spring is too light, the firing pin safety may drag on the FP, causing light strikes.

However, since i started reloading, immediately thought i must be making an error on my reloads.

I am considering getting a hand primer from RCBS. My concern was my arthritis in my wrist and how long i would last with that. But I’ll give this a shot. I think you’re right though on those primers probably not properly seated.

 

[JRHawkins1118]

The rounds that didn't fire the first time had primers that weren't seated all the way. the first firing pin hit seated them and the second time fired them is my guess.
What press are you using? and are you using the press to seat your primers?

I’m using a rock chucker. I’m using the primer arm to seat them.

 

[Creedmoor]

I’m using a rock chucker. I’m using the primer arm to seat them.

Ok, I would suggest when seating you push a bit harder on the handle.

Remember, this is a hobbie that's a lifelong learning experience.

 

[JRHawkins1118]

I’ve decided to get a separate device. Would you suggest handheld or bench mounted?

 

[Creedmoor]

I would suggest that you master what you have first.
And then buy a Dillon 550 machine to put next to your Rock Chucker.

 

[natdscott]

Benchmount. Because of your arthritis, and because all the rest of us are stupid and are GOING to get carpal tunnel and arthritis from the repetitions, you should avoid handheld.

Look at the Lee, RCBS, and Forster bench primers. They have almost no small-motor skills needed, on the ram stroke.

 

[jcj54]

If you have arthritic hands a bench type might work better, you just have to develop a feel for it. I have a bit of arthritis in my hands from 48 years a a toolmaker, but am still able to use a lee autoprime well. I can easily feel the primer seat to depth.

 

[Chewie]

I have a lee loadmaster as well and I use it to load and seat my primers as well. I had the same issue for awhile until I did a youtube search and found a video on setting up the primer feed/seating station. Haven't had the issue since with about 10k rounds loaded since I followed the directions.
I reload 9, 40, 45 on the lee, everything else is done on a rockchucker and hand prime with rcbs.

 

[dieselrealtor]

I have "overseated" primers while learning, semi-flattening them (they fired fine) however I have never detonated a primer on the press. It can be done, there is an old thread of that here but I can't remember if it was while seating or if it was another issue.

You will get the feel for it after a bit, military brass (WCC & others) if primer pockets are unswaged will be some of the more challenging to do but it can be done if you take it slow.

 

[Hawkeye7br]

Benchmount. Because of your arthritis, and because all the rest of us are stupid and are GOING to get carpal tunnel and arthritis from the repetitions, you should avoid handheld.

Look at the Lee, RCBS, and Forster bench primers. They have almost no small-motor skills needed, on the ram stroke.

What Nate said.
Also seat the primers firmly. Swipe your finger over the primer, if you feel a bump, seat it again.

 

[natdscott]

What Nate said.
Also seat the primers firmly. Swipe your finger over the primer, if you feel a bump, seat it again.

Oh!

And I forgot. ("And one more thing, whippersnapper!!!")

If you wander if your primer is flush, or below flush, just stand the case or round up on any flat surface. ANY amount of high primer will rear it's head, because it won't stand up straight.

And, if not already clear, do NOT EVER try to reseat a primer in a loaded round.

 

[2tonic]

Not specifically addressing your problem; more of a 30,000 foot view of your initial question.....

Reloading problem:
1. Gun blows up in your hand, or blows mag out.....double/over charge.
2. Bullet lodges in barrel....under/missed charge. (squib)
3. Bulged barrel....usually occurs on shot following #2 above.
4. Failure to fully chamber....incorrect OAL.
5. Failure to fire...primer seating depth/not fully seated.

Mechanical problem:
1. Stovepipes or erratic ejection pattern....incorrect recoil spring weight
for chosen load, (also possible limp wristing) extractor profile or
tuning, ejector length.
2. Inconsistent accuracy....poor barrel lockup, could be due to poor fitting,
weak/erratic recoil spring, or chamber ramp profile (after ruling out
#4 above.
3. Ignition failure...weak firing pin spring or pin hanging up, if little or no
dent on primer. (after ruling out #5 above)


Just a short list of common gremlins.

 

[natdscott]

4. Failure to fully chamber....incorrect OAL.

And/or occasionally case/headspace issue. Lots-o common in rifle. Not so common in pistola.

 

[JRHawkins1118]

Not specifically addressing your problem; more of a 30,000 foot view of your initial question.....

Reloading problem:
1. Gun blows up in your hand, or blows mag out.....double/over charge.
2. Bullet lodges in barrel....under/missed charge. (squib)
3. Bulged barrel....usually occurs on shot following #2 above.
4. Failure to fully chamber....incorrect OAL.
5. Failure to fire...primer seating depth/not fully seated.

Mechanical problem:
1. Stovepipes or erratic ejection pattern....incorrect recoil spring weight
for chosen load, (also possible limp wristing) extractor profile or
tuning, ejector length.
2. Inconsistent accuracy....poor barrel lockup, could be due to poor fitting,
weak/erratic recoil spring, or chamber ramp profile (after ruling out
#4 above.
3. Ignition failure...weak firing pin spring or pin hanging up, if little or no
dent on primer. (after ruling out #5 above)


Just a short list of common gremlins.

I’m going to have to print this. Thank you!

 

[2tonic]

I’m going to have to print this. Thank you!

I feel important, now!
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