Vito Whisper solvent traps & other "legal" machinegun parts?

[GunsNstuff]

As of today, April 2024, are solvent traps legal to own and eventually turn into a suppressor after approval? I was talking to someone earlier about how I wanted to eventually make my own suppressor on a form 1 or 4 or whatever the form is. He started telling me about solvent traps. I told him that I believe the ATF made those illegal. Maybe they are legal, but I'm not sure and I haven't found any good information on the subject, nor have I really looked too hard. I just recall hearing that they were illegal. So, he showed me some websites that are selling some really nice "solvent traps" made of stainless steel, titanium and aluminum. Some even come with pistol boosters and tri-lug quick attach adapters. I told him that I may be wrong and solvent traps may be legal, OR that's a website setup by the feds to entrap people (is there such a thing?) OR it's an illegal operation in another country and they don't really care if you go to prison for buying something that's illegal.

I looked at their address and it's in Hong Kong. Big surprise! I looked at their website more, trying to get some information on the legality of their product, but I didn't find that. What I did find for sale on their website are full auto Glock switchs, M16 auto-sears, lighting links, etc. Things that I know are not legal to import or buy, but the website promises free shipping to the US on orders of $199 or more. These machinegun parts even have lots of good 5 star reviews written in perfect English. I buy a lot of FPV drone parts from China, so I'm pretty good at spotting Chinese people that write in English very well, but aren't native speakers because they always screw some word or phrase up at some point. This website appears to be written and managed by a native English speaker and the reviews seem to be from native English speakers.

I've been aware of so-called solvent traps for a long time now. I've seen them at gun shows several years ago, so I was able to handle some, which is why I was never interested in building a suppressor out of one. They were made of soft 6061 aluminum and would not hold up to a 22lr for very long by my estimation.

I don't know if the ATF considers solvent traps, unregistered suppressors or not, but I'm pretty sure anything bought off of the website Vitowhisper dot com is not legal and will get a person put on a watch list at some US government office.

 

[dieselrealtor]

 

[BigRed]

Regardless of any of it, atf is the scum of scum.
Take an oath to protect and defend the constitution of the States; make a career out of raping and shredding it.
Now back to your regularly scheduled thread.

 

[2tonic]

Screwing an oil filter onto a firearm is begging for trouble from more directions than a cartographer can imagine.



ETA: Oh, by the way, any and all ATF guys monitoring this site (and we know you monitor this site)........yeah, we hate you all. Deserved or undeserved, if you can't bear our venom, do something to change it.
You could start by telling your fearless leader to f*** all the way off, and start upholding your oath to the Constitution.

 

[Vimace]

No bueno !

 

[BigRed]

Screwing an oil filter onto a firearm is begging for trouble from more directions than a cartographer can imagine.



ETA: Oh, by the way, any and all ATF guys monitoring this site (and we know you monitor this site)........yeah, we hate you all. Deserved or undeserved, if you can't bear our venom, do something to change it.
You could start by telling your fearless leader to f*** all the way off, and start upholding your oath to the Constitution.

atf,

There is worm ****.

You're around 7 levels below that.

Take an oath to protect and defend the constitution of the States; make a career from raping and shredding it.

 

[Cameramonkey]

No. Absolutely not. Full stop. Do not pass go, do not collect $200. RUN AWAY!!!!!!

There is a double edged sword here.

You cant possess something that could be a suppressor BEFORE it actually IS a suppressor. You either need to ask permission to build one from scratch THAT YOU DO NOT ALREADY OWN, or file to buy one from somebody permitted to build them for sale.

If you already have the "trap" (note the double entendre) you are already in violation of the law. And you cant retroactively fix violations within this legal space.

Some would argue that these solvent traps are primarily a manufactured for the purpose of luring folks into the trap of violating the law. Lots of responses to these in ads with "Not today ATF!!!"

 

[GunsNstuff]

If you already have the "trap" (note the double entendre) you are already in violation of the law. And you cant retroactively fix violations within this legal space.

Some would argue that these solvent traps are primarily a manufactured for the purpose of luring folks into the trap of violating the law. Lots of responses to these in ads with "Not today ATF!!!"

I don't have a solvent trap and have never owned one. However, if it is/was legal to turn one into a suppressor, that is the route I'd go, to buy one and convert it, assuming I could get one made of stainless and titanium. Like I say, the only ones I've seen in person were all soft aluminum and would not make a good start for a suppressor.

Since I'm uncertain of the current laws/rules regarding solvent traps, I don't plan to ever get one. Better safe than sorry. As far as having materials that can be used to build a suppressor, that's a funny thing. There are a couple reasons I'd want to build my own suppressor.

#1, to save money. Factory built tubes with baffles in them are grossly over-priced for what they are.
#2, I build things for a living. Making things is something I've been doing since I was a kid.
#3, I have enough metal, carbon fiber, etc to build a suppressor. Never in my adult life have I not owned raw materials that I could turn into a suppressor. I own lots of tools for my work, including taps and dies, a mill, a lathe, welders, a forge, etc.

I work in the race industry, so I get lots of scrap titanium, various steels, and carbon fiber. I don't own these materials for the purpose of, or with the intent to, build a suppressor. I just own them because I like to make things, so when we are throwing out cut offs or damaged parts of racecars, I grab it and take it to use at work, or for a project at home. As dumb as I think the laws on suppressors are, I'm not willing to go to prison because I decided to make something that I'm not allowed to make. Especially when getting permission to build one isn't that hard to do and it only costs $200.

I own oil filters because I own a few cars. Lets hope that owning a gun and a car isn't considered intent to construct an NFA regulated device.

 

[gassprint1]

In the beginning, atf said those that had traps must file for a stamp and if you want to turn into suppressors. Then they renigged on that and said any and all had to be turned in or destroyed becaused they contained nfa parts or such. Last i seen, a Washington state lawyer was working a case for someone. Thats all i remember.

 

[patience0830]

atf,

There is worm ****.

You're around 7 levels below that.

Take an oath to protect and defend the constitution of the States; make a career from raping and shredding it.

You still here?

 

[GunsNstuff]

In the beginning, atf said those that had traps must file for a stamp and if you want to turn into suppressors. Then they renigged on that and said any and all had to be turned in or destroyed becaused they contained nfa parts or such. Last i seen, a Washington state lawyer was working a case for someone. Thats all i remember.

I wonder what the ATF thinks about golf ball launchers. All it needs are baffles and an end cap and it's a suppressor. Golf ball launchers are legal. I also wonder what the ATF considers materials that can be turned into a suppressor. Aluminum cans can be melted down and cast into shapes that can be used to not only make suppressors, but you can make a machinegun out of aluminum that is melted down and cast into shapes.

So is the determination of what materials that can be used to make an NFA item made by the particular guy or gal that happens to be looking at the materials? So, an agent that knows how to build things will look at a rack of metal bar stock and tubing and just see materials used for all kinds of items for all kinds of industries. Another agent that knows nothing about tools or how to make things sees some fence post and they think that's the start of a suppressor because suppressors look like tubes and he sees racks of conduit.

 

[GunsNstuff]

I bought a muzzle device that looks like the Noveske flaming pig. I already have one of these knock-offs, but the threads for the one I have are 1/2x36 and my new barrel needed 1/2x28. So I bought a cheap one off of Ebay that is 2 pieces. I picked that one because it's cheap and because the part that threads to the barrel is steel. It's outer tube piece is aluminum. I just thought that I can remake the outer piece in steel or titanium for weight savings. Anyway, when I looked up the thread size for the outer tube, it's 13/16 x 16. I already have a couple taps in that size in my tap & die sets. What I did not know at the time is that a lot of oil filters use the 13/16 x 16 thread pitch. Just Googling 13/16 x 16 threads showed results for oil filters. I've changed a lot of oil filters in my life, but I never knew what the thread pith was for them.

Now this has be concerned. After hearing from you all about the ATF calling things that can be turned into a suppressor, a suppressor, I'm wondering if I need to get rid of this $38 muzzle device that I bought.

Because WHAT IF an agent decided he didn't like me very much & therefore wanted to find anything that could be twisted into a criminal charge. Theoretically he could call my muzzle device an "adapter" designed to attach oil filters to the muzzle of a gun. Then go on to tell the judge that the US has a huge problem with gang bangers making machineguns and turning oil filters into silencers. If the judge doesn't know any better, he or she may buy that idiotic argument.

This whole suppressor regulation thing is so stupid. The only reason silencers are regulated is because of movies and the common misconceptions the public has because of movies. The public thinks or thought silencers make a gun silent. Books also contributed to this nonsense by pretending that silencers are assassin tools. A lot of people tell me that 22lr pistols are assassin tools because the bullet bounces around in the human body like a pinball machine. This lie came from a popular science fiction book published in the 1960s or 1970s. People read the book, then told other people about what a 22lr does to the body because they wanted to pretend to be smart and a know-it-all when it comes to guns and assassins.

A guy I worked with told me how pissed he was because he spent a lot of money on a 22 silencer for his Ruger 22 pistol. It was several hundred dollars and he had to wait several months to get it and when he finally took possession of it, it didn't sound a damn thing like it did in the movies. He was upset that his pistol was still loud. He had bought the silencer because he wanted to kill the raccoons that were getting into his trash and not disturb the neighbors at night. He was getting tired of trapping the coons and having to drive them out to the woods to dispatch them. He'd rather just shoot it in the back yard and put it in the trash. I had to laugh at him for thinking the silencer was going to make the gun silent.

 

[gassprint1]

I wonder what the ATF thinks about golf ball launchers. All it needs are baffles and an end cap and it's a suppressor. Golf ball launchers are legal. I also wonder what the ATF considers materials that can be turned into a suppressor. Aluminum cans can be melted down and cast into shapes that can be used to not only make suppressors, but you can make a machinegun out of aluminum that is melted down and cast into shapes.

So is the determination of what materials that can be used to make an NFA item made by the particular guy or gal that happens to be looking at the materials? So, an agent that knows how to build things will look at a rack of metal bar stock and tubing and just see materials used for all kinds of items for all kinds of industries. Another agent that knows nothing about tools or how to make things sees some fence post and they think that's the start of a suppressor because suppressors look like tubes and he sees racks of conduit.

As far as i could tell, it was any part that was a piece of a suppressor.

 

[Cameramonkey]

I bought a muzzle device that looks like the Noveske flaming pig. I already have one of these knock-offs, but the threads for the one I have are 1/2x36 and my new barrel needed 1/2x28. So I bought a cheap one off of Ebay that is 2 pieces. I picked that one because it's cheap and because the part that threads to the barrel is steel. It's outer tube piece is aluminum. I just thought that I can remake the outer piece in steel or titanium for weight savings. Anyway, when I looked up the thread size for the outer tube, it's 13/16 x 16. I already have a couple taps in that size in my tap & die sets. What I did not know at the time is that a lot of oil filters use the 13/16 x 16 thread pitch. Just Googling 13/16 x 16 threads showed results for oil filters. I've changed a lot of oil filters in my life, but I never knew what the thread pith was for them.

Now this has be concerned. After hearing from you all about the ATF calling things that can be turned into a suppressor, a suppressor, I'm wondering if I need to get rid of this $38 muzzle device that I bought.

Because WHAT IF an agent decided he didn't like me very much & therefore wanted to find anything that could be twisted into a criminal charge. Theoretically he could call my muzzle device an "adapter" designed to attach oil filters to the muzzle of a gun. Then go on to tell the judge that the US has a huge problem with gang bangers making machineguns and turning oil filters into silencers. If the judge doesn't know any better, he or she may buy that idiotic argument.

This whole suppressor regulation thing is so stupid. The only reason silencers are regulated is because of movies and the common misconceptions the public has because of movies. The public thinks or thought silencers make a gun silent. Books also contributed to this nonsense by pretending that silencers are assassin tools. A lot of people tell me that 22lr pistols are assassin tools because the bullet bounces around in the human body like a pinball machine. This lie came from a popular science fiction book published in the 1960s or 1970s. People read the book, then told other people about what a 22lr does to the body because they wanted to pretend to be smart and a know-it-all when it comes to guns and assassins.

A guy I worked with told me how pissed he was because he spent a lot of money on a 22 silencer for his Ruger 22 pistol. It was several hundred dollars and he had to wait several months to get it and when he finally took possession of it, it didn't sound a damn thing like it did in the movies. He was upset that his pistol was still loud. He had bought the silencer because he wanted to kill the raccoons that were getting into his trash and not disturb the neighbors at night. He was getting tired of trapping the coons and having to drive them out to the woods to dispatch them. He'd rather just shoot it in the back yard and put it in the trash. I had to laugh at him for thinking the silencer was going to make the gun silent.

First, I wouldnt worry about the adapter unless you leave it attached to an oil filter. What are the odds they put two and two together? But you do you. At less than $40 lost, pitching it wouldnt be a huge loss.

As to your friend, he was probably still using high velocity ammo. a bolt action 22 with a suppressor is just as quiet as a pellet gun. A semi auto is a bit louder since the action doesnt stay closed. But as I recall, still hearing safe.

Using HV ammo totally defeats the purpose of a silencer because you'll still have the crack of it breaking the sound barrier.

 

[HoughMade]

"The terms “firearm silencer” and “firearm muffler” mean any device for silencing, muffling, or diminishing the report of a portable firearm, including any combination of parts, designed or redesigned, and intended for use in assembling or fabricating a firearm silencer or firearm muffler, and any part intended only for use in such assembly or fabrication."

18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(25).

So, when I hear a person say: " I was talking to someone earlier about how I wanted to eventually make my own suppressor on a form 1 or 4 or whatever the form is. He started telling me about solvent traps." It concerns me if they possess "any combination of parts, designed or redesigned, and intended for use in assembling or fabricating a firearm silencer or firearm muffler..."

 

[HoughMade]

As to your friend, he was probably still using high velocity ammo. a bolt action 22 with a suppressor is just as quiet as a pellet gun. A semi auto is a bit louder since the action doesnt stay closed. But as I recall, still hearing safe.

Using .22 shorts and hand cycling- not fast, but movie quiet.

 

[Aszerigan]

Read this from a shooter's perspective, NOT a suppressor salesman:

I've purchased and registered "fuel filters" to use as suppressors. Yes, registered through the ATF, serialized, model number, etc. They're cool, kinda, but their suppression isn't all it's supposed to be. We had four, registered them all, shot them, then used a grinder to cut them up and dropped them from the registry. The only nice thing is that you can choose the aperture hole in the front cap.

They're cheap, not well built, and basically a shrapnel grenade for the inexperienced user. For 22, they were fine. Big ones were good on 9mm. But for 556, we tested five rounds and decided we'd rather stay intact than press our luck. Also there weren't suppressor height sights tall enough anywhere to use the 9mm can on a pistol.

 

[Aszerigan]

Using HV ammo totally defeats the purpose of a silencer because you'll still have the crack of it breaking the sound barrier.

Well, kinda. We have to use HV in our Tippmann MG, and it's much nicer with a suppressor. It takes the pop out of it, and makes it hearing safe.

 

[1nderbeard]

Well, kinda. We have to use HV in our Tippmann MG, and it's much nicer with a suppressor. It takes the pop out of it, and makes it hearing safe.

yes. Hunting without a can last year (because I forgot to bring the can when I was zeroing) was a big mistake. One shot without and my ears rang the rest of the day. With the can, even with HV ammo, it is not all that noticeable.

I wouldn't shoot all day without ear pro, but for hunting it def reduces the noise. It's also nice not to get every living thing's attention within a mile of your shot.

 

[2tonic]

..... I had to laugh at him for thinking the silencer was going to make the gun silent.

He forgot the other half of the device that makes a semi-auto suppressed .22 movie quiet.

Your thumb.


That and subsonic ammo.