The news has finally caught on to the heroin problem in Bloomington

[Denny347]

was this epic picture from his audition for Most Interesting Man in the World?

Thanks, he was, in many ways.

 

[Denny347]

Denny, don't get discouraged at a time like this. While I am pretty well set in my belief that protecting the stupid from themselves is a fool's errand predestined to failure, you are an intelligent and thoughtful person, and you are bringing good points to the table. I will add to that you are among a relatively small group responsible for persuading me to rethink my position on law enforcement which was no small accomplishment, especially given some of my really bad past experiences. You are a good man and a good officer, and it shows.

I'm good. It's just time to switch gears a bit and find new ways to challenge myself. I appreciate the kind words. I believe that most of the distrust of my profession stems from lack of understanding. People see us work and without the proper knowledge, make assumptions that are not accurate. I find that I can correct these assumptions by dropping knowledge bombs. I do it a lot on Facebook and here at times. I rather enjoy it.

 

[public servant]

While I understand where you are coming from, it is a bit more complicated than that.

http://www.nahu.org/legislative/policydocuments/NAHUWhitePaperCost.pdf

I know Denny. I just get frustrated busting my ass to keep my head above water while everyone else gets tossed a lifeline.

 

[CHCRandy]

So would depression

should we make a list of self-destructive addictions we're going to stop treating? Smoking? Drugs? Eating too much? Porn addiction?

show me someone who got themselves off heroin (including methadone/suboxone) and is living clean and you can bet they have more grit than most

i bet these municipalities waste WAY more money on stupid crap than they pay for narcan and EMS runs

How do you "treat" smoking or overeating?

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

I know Denny. I just get frustrated busting my ass to keep my head above water while everyone else gets tossed a lifeline.

Exactly .

 

[hoosierdoc]

How do you "treat" smoking or overeating?

Smoking: counseling, patches, gun, chantix for smoking. Then there's COPD and the myriad of diseases downstream from it.

overeating: counseling, nutritionists, meal planning, gastric bypass surgery. And all the downstream diseases

 

[CHCRandy]

Smoking: counseling, patches, gun, chantix for smoking. Then there's COPD and the myriad of diseases downstream from it.

overeating: counseling, nutritionists, meal planning, gastric bypass surgery. And all the downstream diseases

Is it fair to say if the patient don't want to quit.....treatment is useless from a doctors view? I wish there was a magic pill for stopping smoking, I would take it in a heartbeat...but I like smoking and really don't want to quit, and therefore I honestly doubt there is any hope until I decide to make myself quit. Like an alcoholic....you can never make em quit, unless they want to quit. Think same goes for drug addicts and such.

 

[hoosierdoc]

Definitely cannot force someone to change, but you can help them change.

We see people with frequent visits for COPD exacerbations who continue to smoke. They know the problem, but they love smoking and count on us to fix the current problem so they can go home and smoke again. Really irritating.

 

[WebSnyper]

show me someone who got themselves off heroin (including methadone/suboxone) and is living clean and you can bet they have more grit than most

How about those that just never start? What about getting through life without that crutch? Who are boringly dependable and show up for work and take care of our kids, etc...

my point is how do you take someone with a physical and mental addiction, that we classify as a disease and admit that they are addicted, meaning their body and mind craves it now, and tell them "sorry", we're going to let you die now.

a town in OH wants to do a three strikes and you're out policy with narcan. If dispatch determines it's your fourth time they will not send medics.

yet these same conservatives whined about obama's death panels

I am not for socialized medicine. I have made employment and other choices that have forgone some other benefits to be able to provide health care of my kids and a wife who has a serious heart condition... I'm not interested in someone negating those decisions based on some politician's ideas. I'd love to see health insurance not be a function of employment (would make for a more mobile and agile workforce, etc), but I am not at all interested in socialized medicine.

I'm also not at all interested in supporting someone's addictions, etc.

Obviously you are more well versed than I on what a disease is, but I tend to think that classification seems to take away some of the personal responsibility aspects of drug addiction.

Also, I think there is a difference in being compassionate/charitable and funding things with tax dollars. Government has its place, and many of the areas that people try to insert government is not the the right place. I'm not against other charitable organizations, etc being involved, but not interested in government and tax dollars being the answer.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Also, I think there is a difference in being compassionate/charitable and funding things with tax dollars. Government has its place, and many of the areas that people try to insert government is not the the right place. I'm not against other charitable organizations, etc being involved, but not interested in government and tax dollars being the answer.

It is always refreshing to be reminded that there are people who understand that charity and redistribution are two entirely different things!

 

[hoosierdoc]

How about those that just never start? What about getting through life without that crutch? Who are boringly dependable and show up for work and take care of our kids, etc...

and the soccer players, don't forget about them

should suicide be legal?

should physician assisted suicide be legal?

when a person is standing on a ledge should we let them have their independence of choice?

I fear the day when our society gives up on each other and actively allows someone to die when they had a chance to save them. That's a much bigger threat to our nation that some of the cultural rot we are seeing IMO

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/890342

people will press the pleasure lever until they die. It's how many of us are wired. Some have addictive personalities and smoke, drink, gamble, etc. do you have a habit you haven't been able to break? Now try breaking that habit when your brain craves it above all else.

It's not just a simple choice to use again. it's an inner drive, a need to use

 

[hoosierdaddy1976]

Yes, suicide (both assisted and independent) should be legal, imo.

 

[hoosierdoc]

Yes, suicide (both assisted and independent) should be legal, imo.

so we should not intervene when someone is depressed and wants to die? Gosh that would make my ER shifts a lot easier

coukd we then license human extermination permits for those who are too chicken to pull the trigger themselves? And if they have no next of kin we can take the jewelry and gold crowns and sell them. We'll pile it up and take black and white pictures of them.

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

so we should not intervene when someone is depressed and wants to die? Gosh that would make my ER shifts a lot easier

Letting folks live and die with the Consequences of THEIR actions Would make this nation stronger and get the government outta my wallet .

 

[hoosierdaddy1976]

so we should not intervene when someone is depressed and wants to die? Gosh that would make my ER shifts a lot easier

coukd we then license human extermination permits for those who are too chicken to pull the trigger themselves? And if they have no next of kin we can take the jewelry and gold crowns and sell them. We'll pile it up and take black and white pictures of them.

Boy, that slope got slippery!

 

[WebSnyper]

Letting folks live and die with the Consequences of THEIR actions Would make this nation stronger and get the government outta my wallet .

And it is called freedom...

 

[WebSnyper]

so we should not intervene when someone is depressed and wants to die? Gosh that would make my ER shifts a lot easier

coukd we then license human extermination permits for those who are too chicken to pull the trigger themselves? And if they have no next of kin we can take the jewelry and gold crowns and sell them. We'll pile it up and take black and white pictures of them.

"We" does not equal government intervention... sorry. I somehow think you are misunderstanding me, I'm not saying make it illegal to intervene... Quite the contrary, I'm espousing that it is not the place of government to do so or mandate it.

As far as your argument... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reductio_ad_absurdum

 

[WebSnyper]

and the soccer players, don't forget about them

I'm missing the reference.

 

[BigBoxaJunk]

and get the government outta my wallet .

That's just downright cute.

 

[hoosierdoc]

Letting folks live and die with the Consequences of THEIR actions Would make this nation stronger and get the government outta my wallet .

It would definitely get the government out of your wallet. No Medicare, Medicaid, no Social Security, no food stamps, no probation. Some of those would be OK. The problem is you are trying to decide which actions lead to lack of support. How do you determine which drug user is evil and should be allowed to die in which one should be saved? Because you have sometimes about three minutes to make that decision and you better not be wrong.

Did you know that sometimes drug addicts pass out or lose a pulse for non-drug related issues? How are you going to diagnose the cause of their emergency on the phone? I see people all the time who are giving a pill from a friend. They are told is one thing and it nearly killed them because it is actually something else.

The moral high ground is a comfortable position until you are forced to deal with the consequences.

And don't think for a minute that the government will ever be out of your wallet. That has nothing to do with drug users. The bulk of that is simply people who choose not to try in life and politicians using them to stay in power.