The INGO Hardcore Weight Loss/Fitness Thread

[Hoosier8]

The goal isn't to perpetually reduce calories, it's to get to the point that 'reduced calories' is the maintenance caloric need. You get hungry running a calorie deficit eventually and nothing (other than drugs) is going to change that. You do get used to the new weight and needs. At my fattest of some 280-285, I would smash a Chinese buffet for at least 4 trips plus dessert. Now? 2 and I'm stuffed. Same food, big weight difference and years of training my body on what a normal portion is.



Sure, if the carbs you were eating before were from sweets and treats, I don't doubt your experience in the slightest. Heavily processed, refined, and sugary carbs =/= fiber, complex carbs, etc.

My breakfast today was 2 eggs and a 350 calorie rice/bean/cheese burrito. Roughly 500 calories, I'm 'full'. I would also be 'full' on the same amount of calories of all eggs and maybe on eggs and bacon. On pancakes with syrup? No way, I'd be smashing through 1500 calories easy. 500 calories of oatmeal and nuts with a little jelly swirled in? Stuffed. Pancakes are like tequila, portion control can be problematic...

Carbs act the same as sugar in the blood. They increase glucose level. Increased glucose triggers an increase in insulin. Insulin is used to direct removal of glucose into cells like muscles and fat for storage. Type 2 Diabetes is caused by the body unable to create enough insulin to handle the load so insulin needs to be supplemented with shots. Everyone is different but diabetes has exploded since the new dietary guidelines (80s I think) and it’s not just in overweight people but including experienced athletes.

Reduced mobility in older age is the primary reason I do exercise. I was out at Yellowstone recently and, given the season, it was heavily weighted toward retirement age folks in the park at the time. Kids are still in school, etc. so not nearly as many younger people. You could see a huge difference in ability among them. We got absolutely smoked by some 70-ish year old woman and her 40-ish year old presumable son. My wife thought they were German, I thought some Nordic country, but either way they were hustling along uphill and conversing with no issues. Meanwhile some people are winded just getting out of the parking lot. I know which I want to be.



True enough, but when you start giving advice to others I think it's important to provide other viewpoints as well, and "carbs cause metabolic disease" is worth addressing. I've repeatedly said a meat based diet can work, just disagreed that carbs are the evil that pop-sci says they are today. Carbs today are the 90's fat. Neither is problematic if used/consumed correctly and in proper portions.

My issues were exacerbated by exercise while younger. Some is genetics, some is overuse. Exercise is important but for the long run low impact is probably better.

The goal isn't to perpetually reduce calories, it's to get to the point that 'reduced calories' is the maintenance caloric need. You get hungry running a calorie deficit eventually and nothing (other than drugs) is going to change that. You do get used to the new weight and needs. At my fattest of some 280-285, I would smash a Chinese buffet for at least 4 trips plus dessert. Now? 2 and I'm stuffed. Same food, big weight difference and years of training my body on what a normal portion is.



Sure, if the carbs you were eating before were from sweets and treats, I don't doubt your experience in the slightest. Heavily processed, refined, and sugary carbs =/= fiber, complex carbs, etc.

My breakfast today was 2 eggs and a 350 calorie rice/bean/cheese burrito. Roughly 500 calories, I'm 'full'. I would also be 'full' on the same amount of calories of all eggs and maybe on eggs and bacon. On pancakes with syrup? No way, I'd be smashing through 1500 calories easy. 500 calories of oatmeal and nuts with a little jelly swirled in? Stuffed. Pancakes are like tequila, portion control can be problematic...



Reduced mobility in older age is the primary reason I do exercise. I was out at Yellowstone recently and, given the season, it was heavily weighted toward retirement age folks in the park at the time. Kids are still in school, etc. so not nearly as many younger people. You could see a huge difference in ability among them. We got absolutely smoked by some 70-ish year old woman and her 40-ish year old presumable son. My wife thought they were German, I thought some Nordic country, but either way they were hustling along uphill and conversing with no issues. Meanwhile some people are winded just getting out of the parking lot. I know which I want to be.



True enough, but when you start giving advice to others I think it's important to provide other viewpoints as well, and "carbs cause metabolic disease" is worth addressing. I've repeatedly said a meat based diet can work, just disagreed that carbs are the evil that pop-sci says they are today. Carbs today are the 90's fat. Neither is problematic if used/consumed correctly and in proper portions.

I no longer count calories because I don’t need to. I am almost never hungry and when I am, I no longer crave certain foods. Mind you I am experimenting on myself.

 

[bwframe]

I'll add some more complication to the whole argument. I had breakfast yesterday at 6:00pm. Will do the same today, if I don't "push through" a few more hours to do OMAD.

I do "dirty keto," don't count calories or macro's or anything. Eat till I'm full every time.

Yep, still miss potatoes and bread. I'm far enough away from those carbs that if I cheat at the occasional dinner party, I feel the bad effects later.

 

[tim87tr]

Rounded five years last February.

I'll add some more complication to the whole argument. I had breakfast yesterday at 6:00pm. Will do the same today, if I don't "push through" a few more hours to do OMAD.

I do "dirty keto," don't count calories or macro's or anything. Eat till I'm full every time.

Yep, still miss potatoes and bread. I'm far enough away from those carbs that if I cheat at the occasional dinner party, I feel the bad effects later.

Edit...you posted while I was typing. So some of the questions are answered to an extent. I also read all your posts where you mentioned keto.

With that eating type longevity, curious if you are strict keto and what your main food items are, or anything not standard? Greens or low carb fruits such as blueberries?

I'm familiar with this eating style, keto food types and my intake is "keto friendly" whole foods type diet for many years now. I just haven't gone strict but have considered moving that direction to get leaner. I typically am not more than 5 to 10 lb over ideal weight but with "stricter" keto I think I'd miss the variety of foods.

Sorry in advance for multiple questions but your years of keto have advanced information. Does your weight stay fairly consistent? Typically....Do you eat in an 8 hr window (time restricted), how big of meal and how many times a day since you may not be as hungry? Since reading the warrior diet years ago I've been a fan of feast and famine type meals, intermittent fasting 16:8 (usually 11a to 7p on avg) and feel best with 2 meals a day with dinner being the largest.

Variety non-strict example...I just made some pork chop beef jerky that is probably not keto due to the cup of brown sugar in the marinade.

 

[bwframe]

Edit...you posted while I was typing. So some of the questions are answered to an extent. I also read all your posts where you mentioned keto.

With that eating type longevity, curious if you are strict keto and what your main food items are, or anything not standard? Greens or low carb fruits such as blueberries?

I'm familiar with this eating style, keto food types and my intake is "keto friendly" whole foods type diet for many years now. I just haven't gone strict but have considered moving that direction to get leaner. I typically am not more than 5 to 10 lb over ideal weight but with "stricter" keto I think I'd miss the variety of foods.

Sorry in advance for multiple questions but your years of keto have advanced information. Does your weight stay fairly consistent? Typically....Do you eat in an 8 hr window (time restricted), how big of meal and how many times a day since you may not be as hungry? Since reading the warrior diet years ago I've been a fan of feast and famine type meals, intermittent fasting 16:8 (usually 11a to 7p on avg) and feel best with 2 meals a day with dinner being the largest.

Variety non-strict example...I just made some pork chop beef jerky that is probably not keto due to the cup of brown sugar in the marinade.

The "Keto cult" is all over the place on specifics. Tons of overlapping info out there on what is keto and what is not.

I can't (and won't) afford a lot of the expensive stuff. No "grass fed" anything for me. I'm fairly good about most other given low carb keto whole foods. Quite careful about no added sugars and starches. No grains or seed oils either.

I do push the limits with some of the garden stuff I grow. Strawberrys and blueberrys are certainly not keto, but they still grow in my garden. There is a lot of argument that the reds and purples are positive things in seasonal moderation. The garden itself is a seasonal increase in exercise.

Always a moving target, but I try to react on weight variations and other body stuff that changes. Little things like diet additions of bone broth and fermented foods can be answers to issues, along with the obvious of more exercise.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I'll add some more complication to the whole argument. I had breakfast yesterday at 6:00pm. Will do the same today, if I don't "push through" a few more hours to do OMAD.

I do "dirty keto," don't count calories or macro's or anything. Eat till I'm full every time.

Yep, still miss potatoes and bread. I'm far enough away from those carbs that if I cheat at the occasional dinner party, I feel the bad effects later.

Which kind of goes back to my over 5 years the people staying Keto approaches zero. Maybe some variation, but actual Keto? No. It's too restrictive.

My wife is making chicken stock tomorrow from a bunch of rotisserie chicken bones. I'll smoke some beef on Friday and we'll end up with a home made beef stew, which I'll parcel out into 400-500 calorie containers. Chili will come on to the rotation soon as well, as winter sets in.

Anyhoo, hit 1300 calories burned today at the park. Chicken taco time.

My goal is 190 +/- 5 lb for the Bataan Memorial Death March in the middle of March 2024.

My issues were exacerbated by exercise while younger. Some is genetics, some is overuse. Exercise is important but for the long run low impact is probably better.

I no longer count calories because I don’t need to. I am almost never hungry and when I am, I no longer crave certain foods. Mind you I am experimenting on myself.

We're built to run and it's not high impact if it's done naturally and at a reasonable body weight. My knees ache if I sit in the recliner more than they do if I run 5k-10k a day. I've injured myself with weight training way more often than running, but I do primarily run trails and don't bomb the downhills. I'm very conscious of foot placement, focusing on a mid foot strike on declines and a fore foot strike on inclines. I get not everyone is going to run, but I guarantee you if you increase your walking to 15k-20k steps a day (outside of rest days) you'll lose weight and feel less tired in your daily routine. Maintaining mobility, flexibility, enough strength and dexterity to stop a fall, etc. matters more and more in those later years. It's incredible how many people are in nursing homes due to a fall, particularly women, or just the lack of strength to do routine activities. Got to stockpile it while you're younger to stave off decline later.

I count calories intermittently, whenever I change 'the menu rotation' I mentioned above or when I'm trying to achieve a certain protein goal. I know, with some options, what I'm going to eat every day except Saturday before the week even starts. But I don't routinely count calories.

 

[bwframe]

Which kind of goes back to my over 5 years the people staying Keto approaches zero. Maybe some variation, but actual Keto? No. It's too restrictive.

...

Whatever you say sir.

 

[chipbennett]

Maybe a hot take, but: nobody should do the same thing, all the time, without fail - regardless of what that thing is. The human body was designed for adaptability, and functions at peak performance when actually having to engage in that adaptation.

I mix up my fasting routine for exactly that reason. I vary what I eat, at least on occasion, for exactly that reason. I stay mostly carnivore - say, 70 - 80%. But also mix in some strict keto and whole-foods paleo. And at least once or twice a year, I intentionally engage in a carb feast - such as our vacation to Alaska last month. I spent the better part of two weeks eating breads and carbs ad libitum - and then jumped back into alternate-day fasting and carnivore as soon as I got home.

The nearest thing to a universal rule, I think, is to eat primarily real, whole foods and to avoid overly processed foods. But even then, every once in a while: eat the dang birthday cake.

We are designed for periods of feeding and fasting - and of famine and feast.

 

[Hoosier8]

Maybe a hot take, but: nobody should do the same thing, all the time, without fail - regardless of what that thing is. The human body was designed for adaptability, and functions at peak performance when actually having to engage in that adaptation.

I mix up my fasting routine for exactly that reason. I vary what I eat, at least on occasion, for exactly that reason. I stay mostly carnivore - say, 70 - 80%. But also mix in some strict keto and whole-foods paleo. And at least once or twice a year, I intentionally engage in a carb feast - such as our vacation to Alaska last month. I spent the better part of two weeks eating breads and carbs ad libitum - and then jumped back into alternate-day fasting and carnivore as soon as I got home.

The nearest thing to a universal rule, I think, is to eat primarily real, whole foods and to avoid overly processed foods. But even then, every once in a while: eat the dang birthday cake.

We are designed for periods of feeding and fasting - and of famine and feast.

I would say avoid sugar and processed food as a start. Whole foods I agree with.

We are designed to store energy as the fat you can see but with the explosion of obesity most have internal visceral fat which is bad for your body. Designed to store energy for times of starvation. Of course we no longer have starvation.

Once I get to my target weight I will introduce other foods and see what happens.

 

[Hoosier8]

Weight day. 224, down 0.8 lbs this week.

 

[Leo]

Chipbennett and Hoosier8 talked about our bodies proper use of fat, and how our prosperity does not always work with our natural systems very well.

The traditional Jewish people for multiple centuries routinely fasted once a week. They observed this from sundown one day to sun down the next. Basically only missing breakfast, lunch and snacks from one day, and eating supper slightly later. The Jewish people were traditionally healthy. Between that and the sanitation practices they obeyed as part of the Mosaic law, they were so much healthier than other peoples, they were accused of poisoning the gentile cities during the Plague.

I used to observe the Hebraic day fast once a week for Spiritual reasons, and it gave a side benefit in health. I never had weight problems and was pretty healthy when I did that. I have read about new recommendations for "intermittent fasting" with positive reviews. Some things just always work, whatever the motivation.

 

[chipbennett]

Chipbennett and Hoosier8 talked about our bodies proper use of fat, and how our prosperity does not always work with our natural systems very well.

The traditional Jewish people for multiple centuries routinely fasted once a week. They observed this from sundown one day to sun down the next. Basically only missing breakfast, lunch and snacks from one day, and eating supper slightly later. The Jewish people were traditionally healthy. Between that and the sanitation practices they obeyed as part of the Mosaic law, they were so much healthier than other peoples, they were accused of poisoning the gentile cities during the Plague.

I used to observe the Hebraic day fast once a week for Spiritual reasons, and it gave a side benefit in health. I never had weight problems and was pretty healthy when I did that. I have read about new recommendations for "intermittent fasting" with positive reviews. Some things just always work, whatever the motivation.

It's almost as if our Creator knew what He was doing in making some of the rituals in the Old Testament/Torah...

 

[Hoosier8]

Chipbennett and Hoosier8 talked about our bodies proper use of fat, and how our prosperity does not always work with our natural systems very well.

The traditional Jewish people for multiple centuries routinely fasted once a week. They observed this from sundown one day to sun down the next. Basically only missing breakfast, lunch and snacks from one day, and eating supper slightly later. The Jewish people were traditionally healthy. Between that and the sanitation practices they obeyed as part of the Mosaic law, they were so much healthier than other peoples, they were accused of poisoning the gentile cities during the Plague.

I used to observe the Hebraic day fast once a week for Spiritual reasons, and it gave a side benefit in health. I never had weight problems and was pretty healthy when I did that. I have read about new recommendations for "intermittent fasting" with positive reviews. Some things just always work, whatever the motivation.

If you fast for 48 hours you go into ketosis which means you body starts burning your own fat for energy. That is why fasting works. Eating a low carb diet does the same thing, puts you in ketosis, and since you don’t feel like eating as often it is like intermittent fasting. You would already be in ketosis so your body naturally burns your own fat for energy.

Your body will produce the glucose you need from the ketones but it does not work the other way. By staying in ketosis your blood glucose level stabilizes.

A Jewish friend of mine, now passed, was overweight but he loved his cookies.

 

[JTKelly]

I don't even get on a scale any more except for at the Dr. office during regular diabetic checks.

ALL my weight problems started in 1977 when I became friends with a fatty I worked with and every break he wanted to get on the scale. I'd have never even looked at a scale back then but noooo...

I wore a size 36 waist back then and weighed about 200# and I laughed at him stepping on the scale every day.

 

[chipbennett]

If you fast for 48 hours you go into ketosis which means you body starts burning your own fat for energy. That is why fasting works. Eating a low carb diet does the same thing, puts you in ketosis, and since you don’t feel like eating as often it is like intermittent fasting. You would already be in ketosis so your body naturally burns your own fat for energy.

Your body will produce the glucose you need from the ketones but it does not work the other way. By staying in ketosis your blood glucose level stabilizes.

A Jewish friend of mine, now passed, was overweight but he loved his cookies.

Fasting involves so much more than merely inducing ketosis:

1. Fasting directly addresses hyperinsulinemia, which ketosis alone cannot do. If you eat low carb, but you do it continuously for 16 hours a day, you will still have elevated insulin in response to the continuous intake of food. Even a true keto diet (i.e. very high fat, moderate protein, little/no carb) will have some insulin response - but most people doing "keto" are eating higher protein (a good thing!), which will still produce a continuous, if moderate, insulin response.
2. Related to the above, fasting allows the body to cycle between states of metabolic digestion and rest, which is critical to proper functioning of the liver.
3. Fasting will enable the body - particularly the liver - to preferentially utilize/release visceral fat.
4. Fasting will turbocharge production of BDNF during sleep.
5. Fasting allows the body to ramp up autophagy.
6. Fasting turbocharges HGF production and AMPK production.
7. Fasting helps reset the gut microbiome.
8. Fasting of sufficient duration (72 hours) will reset the immune system.

There's plenty more; that's just off the top of my head.

 

[Nacho Man]

Started Oct 2021 with struggling to do 20 pushups and 20 situps, took like an hr.
Im up to 133 pushups and 60 situps in a set max.
Waist was 38 and now 34.
Ive never been this lean, workout 6 days a week. The journey has been fulfilling at age 43, the odds were stacked against me but I kept showing up and pushing forward.
"With great sacrifices come great rewards."

 

[Leo]

Started Oct 2021 with struggling to do 20 pushups and 20 situps, took like an hr.
Im up to 133 pushups and 60 situps in a set max.
Waist was 38 and now 34.
Ive never been this lean, workout 6 days a week. The journey has been fulfilling at age 43, the odds were stacked against me but I kept showing up and pushing forward. No booze and stay away from toxic people.
View attachment 303713

good job!

 

[JTKelly]

When ever you find yourself in a Dr office or waiting room for any thing medical, just take a good long close look around the room and see if there is anything most of the people in there have in common.

 

[Hookeye]

My dad liked sweets and carried an extra 50 lbs.
Became Type 2.
Didn't exercise or watch his diet.
Was 80 yrs old before heart attack took him out.
They were gonna start chopping soon, so he got lucky.

Im 6 ft and 60 yrs old. 183#.
Never been a breakfast person, and think of food like gas.
Its fuel.
Odd, since gallbladder removed, I'm hardly ever hungry or thirsty.
Have to force myself to eat/drink.

I like a big lunch and smaller dinner.
Try to eat at noon and 6.
Sometimes eat late but try to avoid it.
Thats always been my normal routine.

Growing up my mom was a lousy cook. That mighta helped.

Avg one 20 oz Cherry Coke a day.
Sometimes less, sometimes more.

Meat and veggie dude, bread is boring.
Have always been wired this way.

Injury and sickness did reduce activity and I got to 198 fully clothed.
Healed up and weight just dropped off.

Never did the sit around and eat a lot of food thing.
Did eat a ton when younger and super active.

 

[Hookeye]

Deer season will have me lose at least 5# just from dealing w cold and stress.

 

[Hoosier8]

My dad liked sweets and carried an extra 50 lbs.
Became Type 2.
Didn't exercise or watch his diet.
Was 80 yrs old before heart attack took him out.
They were gonna start chopping soon, so he got lucky.

Im 6 ft and 60 yrs old. 183#.
Never been a breakfast person, and think of food like gas.
Its fuel.
Odd, since gallbladder removed, I'm hardly ever hungry or thirsty.
Have to force myself to eat/drink.

I like a big lunch and smaller dinner.
Try to eat at noon and 6.
Sometimes eat late but try to avoid it.
Thats always been my normal routine.

Growing up my mom was a lousy cook. That mighta helped.

Avg one 20 oz Cherry Coke a day.
Sometimes less, sometimes more.

Meat and veggie dude, bread is boring.
Have always been wired this way.

Injury and sickness did reduce activity and I got to 198 fully clothed.
Healed up and weight just dropped off.

Never did the sit around and eat a lot of food thing.
Did eat a ton when younger and super active.

You can get away with a lot when young. Out of high school I was 6 ft and 140 lbs. Grew another 3 inches after HS. When I first decided to lose weight I was in my late 40’s. Up until 40’s I was more like you and I never was much of a desert or bread person and weight stable, never really gained weight before my 40’s. 50’s and 60’s I ate more of both and started drinking more. That put on a lot of weight. One thing that put on the most was a bowl of ice cream every night.

As far as insulin goes you would die without it. A low carb diet stabilizes insulin levels. Sugar and carbs raises insulin levels much more and that eventually levels off until the next high carb meal. For most this up and down can lead to insulin resistance which can then lead to type II diabetes even in people that are not overweight (athletic people). Not seen previously even children as young as 11 are showing up with type II diabetes.

Like I said before this is an experiment on myself. So far I have lost 22 lbs in about 2 1/2 months and my knee pain (tendon inflammation) has reduced by ~90% and that is without exercising. I hate taking medications so rarely, if ever, take ibuprofen or aspirin. I want to get off blood pressure meds so check my pressure to track how it goes. I am on the lowest dose and without it I am stage 1 hypertension.

I can’t stop aging but I can control what I eat. So far I feel much better than before I started this. No longer get a bloated feeling, no longer sluggish when I wake up in the morning. Time will tell. Getting older doesn’t make anything better. LOL