Talk me into a 45-70 single shot.....

[Creedmoor]

That's what I wanted to hear. Just wanted to be sure about this, also why I've been putting it off until I found out more about it.

And thats just my uneducated opinion here. I'm just not a fan of the lower end firearms.
I managed to blow up a steel monster of a pistol, I have been told by many if that was a Model 29. It would not have ended so well for me and my bil that was standing next to me.
I'm glad they are available, so all can afford to buy one if so desired.
That stuff is just not in my wheelhouse.

 

[DadSmith]

And thats just my uneducated opinion here. I'm just not a fan of the lower end firearms.
I managed to blow up a steel monster of a pistol, I have been told by many if that was a Model 29. It would not have ended so well for me and my bil that was standing next to me.
I'm glad they are available, so all can afford to buy one if so desired.
That stuff is just not in my wheelhouse.

I don't think you can buy those high pressure 45-70 loads. Maybe Underwood not sure if they do or not.
I've just seen some Mighty loads looking through the reloading manual for the 45-70.

 

[Mij]

And thats just my uneducated opinion here. I'm just not a fan of the lower end firearms.
I managed to blow up a steel monster of a pistol, I have been told by many if that was a Model 29. It would not have ended so well for me and my bil that was standing next to me.
I'm glad they are available, so all can afford to buy one if so desired.
That stuff is just not in my wheelhouse.

Respectfully, Just myself of course, but I‘ve never owned a hi end firearm. But I also don’t know what that means.

I do own several Ruger and quite a few Smith & Wessons. I’ve loaded my own and run a lot of factory loads for the brass. I’ve shot and hunted with cheap guns and the same with expensive guns. In all my years I’ve never blown a gun up.

I guess my point is, do you consider the fragmented black hawk to be hi end? And if so, what happened to make it fragment? What firearm would have been up to the task, if not the black hawk?

I would have to look on the label of the last box of loads I built to tell you what I loaded for my 45-70, it’s not hot I’m sure. Probably just a hunting load I worked up from an old loading manual for accuracy. And the only gun in that caliber I own. It is by all reasonable definition lower end. As stated up thread it’s a handi rifle. I’m certain it would be a safe load in any modern firearm. I’m just as certain it will shot the same distance with the same terminal effect as any other 45-70.

It’s not like these things are laser beams, no matter the velocity.

 

[STopaz1982]

I don't think I've seen the Henry single shot mentioned. Made in USA break-open and not a bad looking gun. Available in 45-70 along with several other chamberings. I would take one

 

[Creedmoor]

Respectfully, Just myself of course, but I‘ve never owned a hi end firearm. But I also don’t know what that means.

I do own several Ruger and quite a few Smith & Wessons. I’ve loaded my own and run a lot of factory loads for the brass. I’ve shot and hunted with cheap guns and the same with expensive guns. In all my years I’ve never blown a gun up.

I guess my point is, do you consider the fragmented black hawk to be hi end? And if so, what happened to make it fragment? What firearm would have been up to the task, if not the black hawk?

I would have to look on the label of the last box of loads I built to tell you what I loaded for my 45-70, it’s not hot I’m sure. Probably just a hunting load I worked up from an old loading manual for accuracy. And the only gun in that caliber I own. It is by all reasonable definition lower end. As stated up thread it’s a handi rifle. I’m certain it would be a safe load in any modern firearm. I’m just as certain it will shot the same distance with the same terminal effect as any other 45-70.

It’s not like these things are laser beams, no matter the velocity.

I will have to say that high end to me will be whats the high end of ones budget for said firearm. When I was ordering a few Cooper Rifles each year they were 900 to 1200 dollars for each rifle in the beginning. Over the next ten years they doubled in price. Now the base price is above $3,000 dollars.
At that time I easily could have ordered a new 700 or a Savage bolt for half or less that I was buying Coopers. They were high end to me, but they weren't Dakotas or others on that level. I would rather save and spend twice my money on a Sig over a Glock, Smith or Ruger.

To me, Ruger revolvers are just work horse guns. I don't remember what I paid for it over a Smith 29??
On that Blackhawk that I blw up, the jury is still out. I had it with me 2 years ago at a Tipton show to let a known vendor see it, many people always want to hold it and see the carnage, lol.
For many years I was of the understanding that with me loading those 44's it was a compressed charge of 2400 with a my cast 240 Keith bullet on top.
It was cold that morning it blew up on the farm and I left the gun in the car and took the ammo in the house. In the morning as I was walking across the first field I loaded the pistol and fired the first shot. The pistol went left instead of up and left, with that I realized it had blown up.
It was sent back to Ruger with two rounds in it because I couldn't get the cylinder out to remove them. Ruger mailed me a letter saying it was not under warranty due to an over load of bullseye powder.
I sent a letter back making the statement it was a compressed load of 2400 and quite safe and for them to simply pull the two rounds apart and see for themselves.
I then received a letter that they would replace it for their cost, 120 bucks as I recall, I said nope ship it back to me. I eventually got it back.
Back to the Tipton show, A man watching his brothers tables asked me to see it while I was walking around. He told me that he worked his career for the company that made the heat treatment machines that Ruger and others used with manufacturing firearms. Then he said for a few years they had loads of problems with some of there castings having failures like what happened to mine.
For 30+ years I always thought with after reading PO Ackleys books that with me loading on a Dillon 450 when pushing the powder drop I just didnt push it in all the way and got a short charge of slow burning powder and the pressures just went through the roof and the pistol just failed.
The 450 was a full manual machine. Its an easy machine to make a mistake on.
This man said, you told me it blew up on the first round of that cold day right?
And I said yes, he said how many rounds were in the box you loaded? I said fifty. He said what are the odds that you had the bad round that ended up being the first one that was shot that day. I said thank you sir.
I still haven't done anything with it and Ruger.

On loading, most rifle loads are nothing spectacular. My pistol loads are generally warm, like +P or +P+ warm with autoloaders. When my sons are home they shoot +P, at work thats what they shoot, so thats what we shoot at home.
I think the cheapest AR I have is 1200 buck Rock River, then add a rail and a ACOG, next are fay barreled high power rifles to BCM's with ACOGs.

I believe the most lower end that I own is a Taurus G3C and a Taurus stainless 38 revolver that came along in a larger purchase as a gift. Can one buy a cheaper 9mm that those at 225 bucks?
I have shot the crap out of the G3C and it works, but Ive never shot the revolver. The trigger in it is just horrendous.

With your Handi rifle, everything I read is they don't like any bullets over 300-325 grains. Not that one needs heavier for most of whats shot in North America. but thats were the other more expensive come into play at 300 to 540 grain bullets.

I need a nap after all that typing, sorry for all my proper grammar...

 

[Mij]

I will have to say that high end to me will be whats the high end of ones budget for said firearm. When I was ordering a few Cooper Rifles each year they were 900 to 1200 dollars for each rifle in the beginning. Over the next ten years they doubled in price. Now the base price is above $3,000 dollars.
At that time I easily could have ordered a new 700 or a Savage bolt for half or less that I was buying Coopers. They were high end to me, but they weren't Dakotas or others on that level. I would rather save and spend twice my money on a Sig over a Glock, Smith or Ruger.

To me, Ruger revolvers are just work horse guns. I don't remember what I paid for it over a Smith 29??
On that Blackhawk that I blw up, the jury is still out. I had it with me 2 years ago at a Tipton show to let a known vendor see it, many people always want to hold it and see the carnage, lol.
For many years I was of the understanding that with me loading those 44's it was a compressed charge of 2400 with a my cast 240 Keith bullet on top.
It was cold that morning it blew up on the farm and I left the gun in the car and took the ammo in the house. In the morning as I was walking across the first field I loaded the pistol and fired the first shot. The pistol went left instead of up and left, with that I realized it had blown up.
It was sent back to Ruger with two rounds in it because I couldn't get the cylinder out to remove them. Ruger mailed me a letter saying it was not under warranty due to an over load of bullseye powder.
I sent a letter back making the statement it was a compressed load of 2400 and quite safe and for them to simply pull the two rounds apart and see for themselves.
I then received a letter that they would replace it for their cost, 120 bucks as I recall, I said nope ship it back to me. I eventually got it back.
Back to the Tipton show, A man watching his brothers tables asked me to see it while I was walking around. He told me that he worked his career for the company that made the heat treatment machines that Ruger and others used with manufacturing firearms. Then he said for a few years they had loads of problems with some of there castings having failures like what happened to mine.
For 30+ years I always thought with after reading PO Ackleys books that with me loading on a Dillon 450 when pushing the powder drop I just didnt push it in all the way and got a short charge of slow burning powder and the pressures just went through the roof and the pistol just failed.
The 450 was a full manual machine. Its an easy machine to make a mistake on.
This man said, you told me it blew up on the first round of that cold day right?
And I said yes, he said how many rounds were in the box you loaded? I said fifty. He said what are the odds that you had the bad round that ended up being the first one that was shot that day. I said thank you sir.
I still haven't done anything with it and Ruger.

On loading, most rifle loads are nothing spectacular. My pistol loads are generally warm, like +P or +P+ warm with autoloaders. When my sons are home they shoot +P, at work thats what they shoot, so thats what we shoot at home.
I think the cheapest AR I have is 1200 buck Rock River, then add a rail and a ACOG, next are fay barreled high power rifles to BCM's with ACOGs.

I believe the most lower end that I own is a Taurus G3C and a Taurus stainless 38 revolver that came along in a larger purchase as a gift. Can one buy a cheaper 9mm that those at 225 bucks?
I have shot the crap out of the G3C and it works, but Ive never shot the revolver. The trigger in it is just horrendous.

With your Handi rifle, everything I read is they don't like any bullets over 300-325 grains. Not that one needs heavier for most of whats shot in North America. but thats were the other more expensive come into play at 300 to 540 grain bullets.

I need a nap after all that typing, sorry for all my proper grammar...

No problem.

My first thoughts were, to much crimp. Now

All of my guns are work horse guns, that’s why I got’em, to do the job.

Don’t have to worry about proper grammar with me, it’s a lot easier to read than hi school text messages I see sometimes.

IIRC my old 45-70 loads are about +300 gr. only got 4 down stairs on the mantle. Just in case.

 

[Mongo59]

High end doesn't mean head shots? Durn!

 

[Nazgul]

All my loads are in the 85-90% range max. There is no use, to me, of getting near max pressure on anything, rifle or pistol .

Even the 458 Winchester Magnum with 500 gr steel jacketed solids get less than max pressures.

The only thing I do with higher pressure is a 357 Ruger Bakckhawk. The cylinder/barrel on it is the same size as the 44 and 45 revolvers. So lots of extra meat on them.

It loves a 180 gr cast flat nose bullet at nears max pressure.

Don

 

[Michigan Slim]

I'm too frail for max loads in a .45-70. I've tried them and no thank you very much!

 

[DadSmith]

I'm too frail for max loads in a .45-70. I've tried them and no thank you very much!

I want to try a 500gr maximum load in a 45-70 at least once

 

[Michigan Slim]

I want to try a 500gr maximum load in a 45-70 at least once

Go to the wood shed and have someone swing an axe into your shoulder.

 

[warren5421]

I shoot 536 gr postals in my .45-70 single shoots and 405 gr in the custom Marlin lever gun. My trapdoors all shoot and hit at a 1000 yards if I can see the target. I like 100-400 yards as I can see targets using the sights put on the guns in the 1870-80's. Full case of FFg is softer on the shoulder than smokeless down loaded shooting a 300 gr bullet.

 

[Creedmoor]

I want to try a 500gr maximum load in a 45-70 at least once

Usually I carry along with what I'm going to shoot that day a few smokeless 520gr Postells with me for those that say, I would love to shoot that. Be it a 1885 or a 86 lever. I always say sure thing, sit right down an I'll load you one up.
They never ask again. Those 1886's with the steel butt plates are a bitch.

 

[Expat]

My gun dealer showed me a Cyclops today… a little single shot pistol… I gotta think that would an interesting one.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

My gun dealer showed me a Cyclops today… a little single shot pistol… I gotta think that would an interesting one.

While I'm sure it would be brutal, I don't think it would be as brutal as one might think. With that short little barrel, there's not a lot of time for pressure (recoil) to build up. At least that's my theory.

 

[Warrior1354]

I do enjoy my 45-70 firearms. I currently own one model 1877 carbine, two documented trapdoor rifles to the 20th kansas, one really late made model 1884, and my personal favorite the 1885 Remington Naval contract.

 

[Magyars]

Well if you still need convincing. Your shoulder will be a beautiful bluish hue!

 

[Max Volume]

Yeah, my trapdoor kicks like a mule with black powder loads.