Recommendations for a new hunting long gun

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  • Walking Bear

    Marksman
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Mar 21, 2017
    156
    43
    Floyds Knobs
    I got a Ruger 450 Bushmaster American rifle and it will drop deer dead out to 250 yards. The problem I see is the 450 was developed for the AR platform so the Hornaday factory is fine. I have been reloading for 40 plus years and work up a load with 300 XTP and Lil Gun that is awesome. I went with the 450 because the property I hunt in Orange Co. backs up to the Hoosier NF and its not like a wall or markers are up.
     

    Hookeye

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    4   0   0
    Dec 19, 2011
    15,115
    77
    armpit of the midwest
    Buds i know have had great success w .350 Legend. Buy then they know how to shoot and hunt.

    How much of the bad press is from newbs? How many running the cheaper fmj on the deer ? ( Dunno but nothing would surprise me ).
     

    Mgderf

    Grandmaster
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    43   0   0
    May 30, 2009
    18,063
    113
    Lafayette
    Hell a coworker lost 2 w a
    3006 and another guy 2 w a 6.5 creedmoor.

    Both supposedly of some experience.

    Bad shootin is bad shootin.
    Regardless,
    O.P. you mentioned that you only hunt private land, and you don't reload.
    With those two things in mind, I would suggest a bolt gun in one of 4 easy to find calibers.
    These would be,
    .30-06 Springfield
    .308 Winchester
    .30-30 Winchester
    .243 Winchester

    Any one of these are generally found in abundance when a lot of the other stuff, ie. .350 Legend, .450 Bushmaster, .300 Blackout, 6,5 Grendel, 6.5 Creedmoor... are scarce as hens teeth.

    All of the above mentioned rounds will be effective on a whitetail, but if you can't source the ammo...

    Whatever you decide, be sure to sight-in with the ammo you intend to use during the hunt.
     

    Hookeye

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    4   0   0
    Dec 19, 2011
    15,115
    77
    armpit of the midwest
    Funny, 350 legend was available in hunting type after all the .308 ,.243 and .44 mag stuff was gone.

    Even up to recent, when dang near everything was gone, .350 legend target ammo was several boxes deep at my LGS

    BTW .243 is still nowhere to be found.

    .308 and .3006 is, fmj and hunting, but price is a bit high. Some places have it at almost reasonable.
     

    Bigtanker

    Cuddles
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    24   0   0
    Aug 21, 2012
    21,688
    151
    Osceola
    Funny, 350 legend was available in hunting type after all the .308 ,.243 and .44 mag stuff was gone.

    Even up to recent, when dang near everything was gone, .350 legend target ammo was several boxes deep at my LGS

    BTW .243 is still nowhere to be found.

    .308 and .3006 is, fmj and hunting, but price is a bit high. Some places have it at almost reasonable.
    I have seen and bought .243 at Walmart several times this year. I've even passed it up the last few times.
     

    Bigtanker

    Cuddles
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    24   0   0
    Aug 21, 2012
    21,688
    151
    Osceola
    Buds i know have had great success w .350 Legend. Buy then they know how to shoot and hunt.

    How much of the bad press is from newbs? How many running the cheaper fmj on the deer ? ( Dunno but nothing would surprise me ).
    QFT

    My coworkers dad bought a .450 for deer in Michigan. Shot 2 at less than 100 yards and both ran off. He was questioning the "knock down power" of it. Yeah. I just smiled and said got to hit where you're aiming. He agreed.
     

    Hookeye

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    4   0   0
    Dec 19, 2011
    15,115
    77
    armpit of the midwest
    I dont shop walmart. Two gunshops i frequent, no .243.

    Saw some .308 and
    3006 at RK, Norma stuff.
    Gone now but they got two types of 7mm 08.

    LOL

    .30-30 and .243 ......none Ive seen for a while.

    Eh, i have no love for the .30-30.

    And beans too tall now so a box of WW 80gr SP .243 isnt a priority.
     

    JEBland

    INGO's least subtle Alphabet agency taskforce spy
    Rating - 100%
    9   0   0
    Oct 24, 2020
    1,979
    113
    South of you
    .308 and .3006 is, fmj and hunting, but price is a bit high. Some places have it at almost reasonable.
    I don't think that premium hunting ammo for big game is so expensive, all things considered (how many times do we plan on missing, right). This is especially true if paying to hunt on private land. If only hunting once a year with it and using FMJ for off season fun, expensive hunting ammo is still relatively cheap per pound of whitetail. IIRC, I pay ~$170 for the out of state license in WV (where my family is) to have the opportunity of one antlered and one antlerless deer. So even at $3/round for the premium hunting ammo, it's a tiny addition to the cost per pound on a whitetail. Heck, even at $5/rd, it's a pretty cheap price for the whole animal.

    As for which cartridge for the OP... any of the standards for whitetail will work with a decent projectile and placement. I'd probably go with something like .350 legend of .450 BM or .458 SOCOM if you own an AR as BT suggested just to keep it Indiana legal for public land. A lever gun can also be pretty nice... A .44 mag in a carbine is pretty soft shooting compared to my .270 and .308 IMO, and if you've got a revolver in .357/.44, then choosing something in the same caliber might be worthwhile to you. I've not shot a Legend/Bushmaster/Socom, so I can't compare them.
     

    Ggreen

    Person
    Rating - 100%
    49   0   0
    Sep 19, 2016
    3,686
    77
    SouthEast
    So just to address the anemic straight walled modern rifle cartridges. 450, 458, 50beo, 350 legend all have sub optimal energy transfer. The only thing any of the thumpers truly succeeded at was with the coast guard to put holes in drug vessels. 350 legend in particular has a ton of video evidence online of projectiles not expanding, which is a common failure of big diameter rounds cut down to fit into an ar-15. A good kill isn't from the initial hole, it's the displacement of soft tissue from energy transfer. Thumpers failing to expand means they go in and right out, wasting all of that energy, my 13.7" grendel turned everything above the diaphragm into jello. Stopping power isn't about diameter, it's about energy transfer. 350legend just doesn't have it.

    Ammo being available isn't necessarily a good thing either. 350leg had so many issues that it wasn't even selling during the height of the pandemic. That to me says more than anything. If we learned anything over the last 2 years it's to buy quality ammo when you can.
     

    BigRed

    Banned More Than You
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    7   0   0
    Dec 29, 2017
    19,347
    149
    1,000 yards out
    So just to address the anemic straight walled modern rifle cartridges. 450, 458, 50beo, 350 legend all have sub optimal energy transfer. The only thing any of the thumpers truly succeeded at was with the coast guard to put holes in drug vessels. 350 legend in particular has a ton of video evidence online of projectiles not expanding, which is a common failure of big diameter rounds cut down to fit into an ar-15. A good kill isn't from the initial hole, it's the displacement of soft tissue from energy transfer. Thumpers failing to expand means they go in and right out, wasting all of that energy, my 13.7" grendel turned everything above the diaphragm into jello. Stopping power isn't about diameter, it's about energy transfer. 350legend just doesn't have it.

    Ammo being available isn't necessarily a good thing either. 350leg had so many issues that it wasn't even selling during the height of the pandemic. That to me says more than anything. If we learned anything over the last 2 years it's to buy quality ammo when you can.

    I can only imagine how much venison I could have harvested had I known this before simply hunting with an old model 1894.
     

    two70

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Feb 5, 2016
    3,751
    113
    Johnson
    So just to address the anemic straight walled modern rifle cartridges. 450, 458, 50beo, 350 legend all have sub optimal energy transfer. The only thing any of the thumpers truly succeeded at was with the coast guard to put holes in drug vessels. 350 legend in particular has a ton of video evidence online of projectiles not expanding, which is a common failure of big diameter rounds cut down to fit into an ar-15. A good kill isn't from the initial hole, it's the displacement of soft tissue from energy transfer. Thumpers failing to expand means they go in and right out, wasting all of that energy, my 13.7" grendel turned everything above the diaphragm into jello. Stopping power isn't about diameter, it's about energy transfer. 350legend just doesn't have it.

    Ammo being available isn't necessarily a good thing either. 350leg had so many issues that it wasn't even selling during the height of the pandemic. That to me says more than anything. If we learned anything over the last 2 years it's to buy quality ammo when you can.
    Although I'm generally a proponent of smaller and faster, there's no reason any of the cartridges you downplay won't work well given proper bullet selection. Hell, bullet selection is not even that hard for the .350 and especially the .450. When you push a bullet designed for normal handgun velocities over 2000 fps, then lack of expansion is not going to be a common problem. In any case, failure to find a deer shot through and through is primarily either a failure in shot placement or a failure in tracking regardless of bullet performance.
     

    two70

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Feb 5, 2016
    3,751
    113
    Johnson
    I have seen and bought .243 at Walmart several times this year. I've even passed it up the last few times.
    Availability of .243 ammo is far less of a problem than availability of quality .243 hunting ammo. Most commonly available .243 ammo is not suitable for hunting deer.

    My coworkers dad bought a .450 for deer in Michigan. Shot 2 at less than 100 yards and both ran off. He was questioning the "knock down power" of it. Yeah. I just smiled and said got to hit where you're aiming. He agreed.
    I hope he actually looked for the deer instead of just assuming that he missed since they ran off. I'm not sure why but a lot of people seem to have the idea that any deer shot with a rifle should immediately drop, even though it is very rare for a deer to drop immediately without a CNS hit.
     

    snapping turtle

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Dec 5, 2009
    6,519
    113
    Madison county
    One tell tail sign on a whitetail boiler room hit is the back leg kick. I think it must be a reaction that is involuntary. (Than again if you are using a 12 power scope in a round that kicks a lot you most likely can not see the legs kick)
     

    Hookeye

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    4   0   0
    Dec 19, 2011
    15,115
    77
    armpit of the midwest
    Im cool w DRT....but also am cool with following barn paint for a bit.

    LMAO bud has killed his last 2 bucks w a .270 win and both went about 75 yards.

    Am not lazy, color blind or a poor shot.
    DRT or DROT is fine
     
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