pro-gun bumper sticker as probable cause for pat down

[BigMatt]

 

[Timjoebillybob]

I have a small (2"x3") safety yellow sticker on my drivers door that has a depiction of a 1911.
Below is the following text,

Notice

Driver is loaded

The owner of this vehicle is licensed to carry a concealed weapon.

Use appropriate caution

I might change that to Driver is armed. Unless you have swallowed some ammo, or inserted them another way. Usually when someone is referred to as being loaded, it means intoxicated.

LOL @ author of this article...He actually used "probable cause" and pat down in the same sentence. Ive been a LEO for 5 years.....Probable cause is not needed for a terry frisk.......The guy told him he had a license to carry hard to make out in the audio but its there..For their own protection, police may perform a quick surface search of the person’s outer clothing for weapons if they have reasonable suspicion that the person stopped is armed......I introduce to you terry vs..Ohio...

That being said the guy took a confrontational standpoint..Your stopped for an infraction and you choose to exercise your right to remain silent?..If I were that officer based off that guys behavior he comes off as a sovereign citizen type nut=most dangerous type of person.

If the guy would have just told him he had a gun and and permit the stop probably would have lasted about 6 minutes. I see that pink peace of paper and my mindset totally changes. 98% of permit holders=law abiding citizens....probably more apt to get a warning to...


Just my ..02

I'll agree that in this situation probable cause was probably not the best choice of words.

I introduce you to Terry v Ohio. Specifically the two words you failed to mention, those being "and dangerous". There have been several court cases that enforce those last two words. Including one recent IN Court of appeals decision. Just RAS or even admitted possession of a weapon is not just cause for a terry search. Without RAS that the person is dangerous.

In that case the person told the officer that they were armed, where it was and had a LTCH, the officer had them step out of the car and retrieved the firearm from under the seat. When he did so he found a baggie of marijuana. The court ruled that although the officer knew the person was armed, he didn't have RAS to assume he was dangerous and therefor the search was unlawful. Sorry I don't have the name of the case or link to it at the moment but if you want I'll try to find it. Or I'm sure a dozen other people on this site have it handy.

What worries me is that you state you are an LEO but you consider a person exercising their rights as being confrontational. If you asked someone for consent to search their car or home and they refused, by saying "I don't consent to any searches" would that be confrontational?

IMO he did so in a polite and non-confrontational manner. Now if he had said "It ain't none of your MFing business what I got in this MFing car you MFing Jackbooted Pig" That I probably would consider confrontational not to mention impolite. But he didn't all he said was he chose to exercise his right to remain silent. In those words as best as I can tell from the video. He didn't do so angrily just matter of factly.

As a matter of fact I'm pretty positive that the courts have ruled the same as my opinion. That exercising ones rights does not constitute RAS or PC. Try getting a judge to sign a seach warrant just based on a persons refusal to consent and see what your told. I think and really really really hope you would be shot down in a heartbeat. And hopefully get one heck of an earfull.

 

[HICKMAN]

On my truck I have:

NRA sticker
Jump wings sticker
Hydrocarbon eco-vehicle sticker
Denver Broncos hitch cover

I wonder what kind of probable cause that creates?

Don't ask, Don't tell

 

[ironhorsemanfxsts]

My bumper sticker came from a SEAL team at Atterbury thats says "God bless our troops and especially our snipers". And I truly have that prayer for those boys.

 

[dross]

Lie to me about your weapons and you will have problems.

Don't ask questions that are none of your business and you won't get lied to.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Don't ask questions that are none of your business and you won't get told to mind your own business.

FTFY

 

[serpicostraight]

i thought there was physical standards to be a cop? they just started a new program for us csa 2010 might be something to look at for le

 

[Redemption]

If citizens respect the law, the law will respect them. Lie to me about your weapons and you will have problems.

^^^^ Push citizens around because of ego and receive trouble.

 

[Keyser Soze]

i thought there was physical standards to be a cop? they just started a new program for us csa 2010 might be something to look at for le

Yes that was the first thing I noticed in this video. The guy looked like a soup sandwich. Ive been cutting/bulking for the past two years...trying to look as fit as possible. You would be surprised how many people change there mind about resisting.

Your right about the physical standards...but you only have to meet them ONE time.....they are somewhat of a joke to.

At the same time there are older officers who cant meet the standards but have forgot more about LE than I have learned. These are the guys who can use wisdom to handle most situations, so not really fair to them to impose physical testing once a year so they can keep their job.

 

[Keyser Soze]

^^^^ Push citizens around because of ego and receive trouble.

Dont believe everything the media tells you...he is dead on. You only hear about bad cops in the news.

 

[MACHINEGUN]

If citizens respect the law, the law will respect them. Lie to me about your weapons and you will have problems.

 

[littletommy]

.he is dead on.

He is not a cop, he's just a morbidly obese loser living with his mom, looking to stir the pot.

 

[dhdoug]

If citizens respect the law, the law will respect them. Lie to me about your weapons and you will have problems.

show respect and get respect. act like prick, expect the same. i'm legal and am in no hurry.

 

[serpicostraight]

He is not a cop, he's just a morbidly obese loser living with his mom, looking to stir the pot.

him and dredd are starting to sound like gecko45 and his buddy.

 

[navarre1095]

Not the Gecko!

 

[IndyGunner]

I didnt get searched, but this is why I took the patriots logo off my impala. Someone keyed from the front driverside to the truck driverside then dented to fist marks in the hood. Im not sure if it was a personal attack or just a jealous colts fan... regardless, I try and keep my car as stock as possible to deter unwanted attention. I take out my modificantion fix on my motorcycle

 

[ThrottleJockey]

I don't put stickers on my cars, I don't put flashy wheels on them, I don't put big speakers and amps in them. I learned from living in bad parts of town that it is best to just blend in and not draw attention. A car, much like a gun is just a tool to me, a way to get from one place to another, not a fashion statement, billboard or status symbol. If it doesn't make it run better, use less gas, or go faster then it really is nothing more than trouble IMHO. I once knew people that would sit in parking lots waiting for the bumping stereo with flashy rims to drive by so they could follow it home only to steal the "flashy" or "bumps" at 2:am.

 

[HICKMAN]

2nd Amendment Support Decal

Buddy of mine runs a small side biz to promote 2A and raise money for the NRA.

He started out to promote concealed carry, but moved more towards 2A when he moved to Tenn, where they can open carry as well.

Cool little decal concept.

Legally Concealed - Decal

 

[Que]

Very nice and unassuming.

 

[HICKMAN]

just met him this week, we been talking guns/2A/shooting sports for the last couple of hours. Former Army Ranger and all around great guy.

Figured his cause was worth promoting and a cool way to raise awareness and funds for the NRA (even if I don't agree with them all the time).