After further thought, I recommend you have a 15 minute conversation with an attorney who specializes in things like DUI, small possession and charges similar to that. Most attorneys will tell you the right guy/girl to talk with. Most will talk with you for 15 minutes. I got a WEALTH of info (mostly not good) from a brief conversation like that.
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Ok Officers I need some advice....Well actually ALL INGO...
- Thread starter edsinger
- Start date
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our township has a policy where if one runs a bus stop arm while its lit and out the driver has to get a description of the car and driver and the township police can issue a ticket based on that info. but the catch is the bus driver has to show up to the court hearing as well. not sure how well this would work out if challenged.
Why thank you but I must give the credit to my wife and HIM. Actually he has lied but nothing of this magnitude and I would have to really struggle to remember even a white lie. It just is not him.
Its a little under 3 actually, so lets say 32+ months. He will be 18 in two months.
not trying to be an ass, but this to me is an oxymoron.
It's possible, although not likely, that the bus driver was a moonlighting LEO.
Many Troopers that I have known have had part time jobs.
If you're innocent, fight the ticket!!
And if you're innocent, I hope you win.
Well, the info had a lot of value, it was simply not good for my son. At least we knew what we were dealing with and what it would take to fight the battle.
Look up "inculpatory evidence". It is pretty scary stuff to me. But that has nothing to do with the OP's case.
Look up "inculpatory evidence". It is pretty scary stuff to me. But that has nothing to do with the OP's case.
not trying to be an ass, but this to me is an oxymoron.
This is what I was wondering about. Maybe in court or in the preceedings of court some facts on who, what, when, etc can be laid out and it will either make more sense or be shown to make absolutely none and tossed.
I drive one of the real yellow ones, and just had a stoparm case in court last week. Anyone else, like a daycare, now has to have a real school bus rather than a van, and the driver have a CDL, BUT, they are NOT allowed to have the flashing lights and stoparms, and they have to be white. If they don't have the flashing lights and stoparms, they can't call you on passing them. They don't have the authority to stop you. Whether they pull into a driveway or not, they don't stop traffic. The cops are mistaken here.
This.
I am currently in my own mess and actually hired the lawyer I talked to. He said he could fight it but I know what I did and would rather get it all over with. He was much more useful than any research I did online.
emmitsmithxd9
Plinker
- Apr 16, 2009
- 92
- 6
Up until this point in my life I have dreamed to become a Narcotics Officer or a State Trooper, my dad has persuaded me to lean towards the sciences and engineering degrees, but its just not me. This incident has made me think about this choice, but made me want to persue my dream as a Narcotics officer. Though I would not be dealing with cases like these I want to see the system succeed and I know I would do my best to serve to the best of my ability.
Though throughout my entire encounter with this officer, he was very polite up until the point where he told me it was scary that I do not remember these events as if a was a wreckless teenager, but from what he knows I could have been which brings me to my point. How can he issue me a ticket without witnessing these events or even truly explaining to me what I did? I thought I was innocent until proven guilty? Or is that negated because I am underaged? Or he just thought I was ignorant to the law?
One other peculiar detail, the officer told me that this event occured on this monday, but the ticket says last monday..
Though throughout my entire encounter with this officer, he was very polite up until the point where he told me it was scary that I do not remember these events as if a was a wreckless teenager, but from what he knows I could have been which brings me to my point. How can he issue me a ticket without witnessing these events or even truly explaining to me what I did? I thought I was innocent until proven guilty? Or is that negated because I am underaged? Or he just thought I was ignorant to the law?
One other peculiar detail, the officer told me that this event occured on this monday, but the ticket says last monday..
Bunnykid68
Grandmaster
The officer cannot even get his story straight. Fight it for sure and good luck.
Heh, a wiley ambulance chaser could get you off on that alone.
cowgirl.sdm
Grandmaster
I can tell you that my best advice is to set up an appointment to talk with a lawyer. They will give you advice on whether you need them and if so how much it will cost. Usually they will do the first appointment for free. Also, some will go the extra mile and if you don't need them, then they will tell you their best guess of what will happen and what you need to point out. Good luck to you and your son. Please keep us updated to what happens.
And one other thing, why did the officer go to the school? Why not contact the parents etc? I mean if its 10 days later a phone call to the parents would have been nice dont ya think? I mean he pulled the plate and MY name is on it.
Officers? Any ideas on this one?
Officers? Any ideas on this one?
Hoosierdood
Grandmaster
If it were me, I would go down the road tomorrow morning and try to find said school bus. Observe whether it is properly marked with the correct paint scheme, equipped with flashing lights and a stop arm. Take note where this bus stops to pick up kids. Is it in the road or is it in the driveway. I was a bus driver in Michigan for a while and I drove the short bus. Many times, we were allowed to just use our Hazard lights rather than stopping traffic completely. Observe whether this particular bus uses amber/red flashing lights, or just his hazard lights if you can.
Second step - find the trooper who issued the citation. Ask him what the circumstances were. Find out the EXACT location of the violation. If he was not present, then there has to be a witness who filed a complaint. Find out if the bus driver has to authority to file an affidavit and have a ticket issued on his word alone. Take note of when the officer claims this violation occurred. If he accidentally put the wrong date on the citation, you can get the charges dropped on a technicality.
Finally - DOCUMENT EVERYTHING!!! Every time you talk to someone, write down their name, the time of the conversation, and what was said. It may help in court. Write down the days that you followed the bus and what exactly you observed. You can NEVER present too many details.
Judging from what you and your son have both presented, if it comes to court, it will be your son's word against that of the bus driver. The bus driver already has the advantage of credibility simply based on his position. You need to present facts that turn the tables and make your son sound more credible than the bus driver.
Good luck, and keep us posted.
Second step - find the trooper who issued the citation. Ask him what the circumstances were. Find out the EXACT location of the violation. If he was not present, then there has to be a witness who filed a complaint. Find out if the bus driver has to authority to file an affidavit and have a ticket issued on his word alone. Take note of when the officer claims this violation occurred. If he accidentally put the wrong date on the citation, you can get the charges dropped on a technicality.
Finally - DOCUMENT EVERYTHING!!! Every time you talk to someone, write down their name, the time of the conversation, and what was said. It may help in court. Write down the days that you followed the bus and what exactly you observed. You can NEVER present too many details.
Judging from what you and your son have both presented, if it comes to court, it will be your son's word against that of the bus driver. The bus driver already has the advantage of credibility simply based on his position. You need to present facts that turn the tables and make your son sound more credible than the bus driver.
Good luck, and keep us posted.
Already on it. I told my son he needs to get the camera and take pictures of the bus/s for that exact reason. There can be only one house and I know which one it is.
Thank you, VERY good advice.
I know that most of the advise here says fight the ticket. I have been stopped and cited when I was a teenager. The defferal program was my savior. I was actually guilty so, I did not mind paying the slightly higher fine and I am well aware that you are not.
I would suggest fighting the ticket and hoping that the justice system prevails. However, if it fails you, I highly recommend the program. It does cost a little more right off the bat but, it stays off your record and saves you huge insurance money. After 12 months of no citations, it goes away. It's not a bad deal. Sure you pay a little more money to the system that failed you but, I am a bottom dollar guy not a principal guy when it comes to my money. Hopefully one day I will be wealthy enough to be able to afford some principals!
I would suggest fighting the ticket and hoping that the justice system prevails. However, if it fails you, I highly recommend the program. It does cost a little more right off the bat but, it stays off your record and saves you huge insurance money. After 12 months of no citations, it goes away. It's not a bad deal. Sure you pay a little more money to the system that failed you but, I am a bottom dollar guy not a principal guy when it comes to my money. Hopefully one day I will be wealthy enough to be able to afford some principals!
Freedom_Bound
Plinker
Make your case in court. Sounds like there are quite a few discrepencies.
IC 9-21-12-1
Arm signal device; duty to obey; presumption
Sec. 1. (a) A person who drives a vehicle that:
(1) meets or overtakes from any direction a school bus stopped on a roadway and is not stopped before reaching the school bus when the arm signal device specified in IC 9-21-12-13 is in the device's extended position; or
(2) proceeds before the arm signal device is no longer extended;
commits the offense described in section 9 of this chapter.
(b) This section is applicable only if the school bus is in substantial compliance with the markings required by the state school bus committee.
(c) There is a rebuttable presumption that the owner of the vehicle involved in the violation of this section committed the violation. This presumption does not apply to the owner of a vehicle involved in the violation of this section if the owner routinely engages in the business of renting the vehicle for periods of thirty (30) days or less.
As added by P.L.2-1991, SEC.9. Amended by P.L.127-1993, SEC.2; P.L.1-2005, SEC.104.
IC 9-21-12-1
Arm signal device; duty to obey; presumption
Sec. 1. (a) A person who drives a vehicle that:
(1) meets or overtakes from any direction a school bus stopped on a roadway and is not stopped before reaching the school bus when the arm signal device specified in IC 9-21-12-13 is in the device's extended position; or
(2) proceeds before the arm signal device is no longer extended;
commits the offense described in section 9 of this chapter.
(b) This section is applicable only if the school bus is in substantial compliance with the markings required by the state school bus committee.
(c) There is a rebuttable presumption that the owner of the vehicle involved in the violation of this section committed the violation. This presumption does not apply to the owner of a vehicle involved in the violation of this section if the owner routinely engages in the business of renting the vehicle for periods of thirty (30) days or less.
As added by P.L.2-1991, SEC.9. Amended by P.L.127-1993, SEC.2; P.L.1-2005, SEC.104.
I am not familiar with the laws regarding passing a school bus when stopped. I am however familiar with people calling in plates just because they are having a bad day. I drive for a major medical equipment company and of course have a "how is my driving" sticker on the back. I do not get calls very often but every single time that I have it has been incorrect information. Sometimes people just have a bad day and see that and it is a chance for them to take out their problems on somebody else. Lucky for me the boss's that I have had have gotten to know and trust me so it never cause's an issue for me besides getting out my route sheet and showing where I was. Some people are just mean and spiteful and this very well could be the case.
