Negligent discharges and injuries/death

[rugertoter]

This question is "hairy". I like bacon a lot.

 

[Twangbanger]

I voted no, but am curious why to draw the line LTCH? Why not a requirement to purchase? You don't have to be a carrier to have an ND. Most people don't even carry.

 

[DadSmith]

the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

This sounds like infringement to force people to do something to be allowed to carry a firearm. Just like being forced to have a license to carry a handgun is an infringement.

 

[Cameramonkey]

I voted no, but am curious why to draw the line LTCH? Why not a requirement to purchase? You don't have to be a carrier to have an ND. Most people don't even carry.

Why stop there? Why not have a license to vote that requires a civics and basic economics training? (This is how government works, This is where all that .gov money they spend comes from and it isnt free money, what causes inflation, national debt, etc.)

 

[MCgrease08]

Freedom can be dangerous.

I think Ben Franklin said it well, "any society that will give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."

 

[Trapper Jim]

We had safety checks in the 60’s for cars mechanical condition. It was abused. Texas had training requirements to get a gun. I saw that abused. All these rules and programs are reactive. Meaning stupid people would be legislated to normalcy. This is abused every single day as we keep proving that you cannot legislate stupidity. We have texting laws. Not working. We have drivers training. Does not eliminate bad drivers.
We have work ethics. Abused.

We call this a clue as it is a people problem that bleeds over and affects the responsible person with more laws.

Another reason for me voting no to training mandates is I have seen thousands of “trainees” that “learned” nothing or worse.

Face it. People = Good, Bad, Evil, and Dangerous.

CYA and try to forge ahead by turning the poor gun handlers around. Save the ones you can. Distance the ones you can’t.

And more bacon please.

See you on the range

Trapper

 

[bwframe]

Massad Ayoob - How To Train A New Gun Owner - Critical Mas Episode 12 - Teaching Gun Safety

www.indianagunowners.com

 

[04FXSTS]

When Illinois got CCW I was a certified instructor and started all my classes saying "There should be no training requirement but since there is we will do what is legally necessary." Removed myself from the certified list about five years later because the state got more intrusive about the classes.
Even tho the training had to be done to the state standards it could be a learning experience or 16 hours of nothing useful. You could have the best and safest shooters in the world in a class and you had to do the full 16 hours. The Illinois State Police would send out ringers to take the classes to see if the full time was being done. Some instructors were caught not following the 16 hours and had their certification pulled. Then ALL students that took their classes had to retrain within 60 days or have their CCW revoked. All about the money and making it as hard as possible to get a CCW. Jim.

 

[LarryC]

NOT only NO but HELX NO. We have plenty of regulations now! IF it becomes a LAW the government will find ways to use it to restrict ownership in some way.

I was never "trained" by an official, my BIL taught me gun safety and marksmanship in the 1940's and 1950's. when he returned from WW2. He had 2 Bronze and 1 Silver star and a Purple heart for the bullet he carried between his heart and spine (he was buried with it!).

I am 80 years old, hunted a lot from about 14 years old to my 30's, still shoot target, never had a ND or AD in my life.
Youngest son and I collect firearms, have (and shoot) everything from 17HMR to 50BMG. I don't shoot much above .308 any more - hurts too much the next day :>).

 

[Bigtanker]

We had safety checks in the 60’s for cars mechanical condition. It was abused. Texas had training requirements to get a gun. I saw that abused. All these rules and programs are reactive. Meaning stupid people would be legislated to normalcy. This is abused every single day as we keep proving that you cannot legislate stupidity. We have texting laws. Not working. We have drivers training. Does not eliminate bad drivers.
We have work ethics. Abused.

We call this a clue as it is a people problem that bleeds over and affects the responsible person with more laws.

Another reason for me voting no to training mandates is I have seen thousands of “trainees” that “learned” nothing or worse.

Face it. People = Good, Bad, Evil, and Dangerous.

CYA and try to forge ahead by turning the poor gun handlers around. Save the ones you can. Distance the ones you can’t.

And more bacon please.

See you on the range

Trapper

Well said.

 

[KLB]

As if training means someone won't have a ND.

 

[Brad69]

Well I believe that you can’t train stupid out of some people.

I have witnessed a portion of our population that have passed a physical and intelligence test plus a back ground check. Fail at simple tasks such as safe weapons handling or qualifying with a weapon.

So a portion of the population is dumb. It’s not being mean it’s a fact. No matter the task they will find a way to $&#@ it up.

 

[DadSmith]

As if training means someone won't have a ND.

Just think military

 

[ancjr]

I'm just wondering if ND have become worse over time.

 

[Michigan Slim]

I always told my boys that if I was ever looking down the wrong end of their gun the beating would commence, without a spoken word

I did the same. It worked wonders.

 

[OkieGirl]

I voted NO because I do not want to give the .gov one more opportunity to overstep. Training means absolutely nothing if the trainer is negligent (no one needs to see the video of the trainer shooting himself in the foot again) and lets face it - there is a license and testing requirement to drive a car but people still manage to cause accidents, cause harm, or kill while operating in an unsafe manner.

The burden of education is on the person who chooses to carry. For us, we taught the kids young just like we were taught young. Kids are curious and if you want them to have safe handling habits you need to proactively teach them. We have firearms in our home so it was part of our burden of responsibility as parents. Another concern was if they were out in the world away from us we wanted to know they could handle themselves if (God forbid) they encountered an unattended firearm.

When one of my boys was in elementary school and on a required parenting time visitation with his father, the idiot handed my boy a loaded pistol showing off a new purchase. My son rendered the firearm safe just like we had taught him to do. He knew not to touch the trigger, he knew there would likely be a round in the chamber and cleared it, he returned the empty pistol to his biological father with the slide open and mag removed.

 

[Cameramonkey]

As if training means someone won't have a ND.

Technically I've had a ND. And I have had LOTS of training:

Appleseed shoot at HHRP in early spring years ago. So I had to wear mechanics gloves. (Renaud's syndrome) I had just reworked the trigger group on my 10/22 with new lighter springs. First time out with it.

During a string of prone fire mid morning, I was lining up on the target and had just started to slide my finger into the trigger guard and *BLAM!*. Oops. At least they had already given the start signal so I was the only one that knew it was a ND. And no harm because all of the rest of the rules were followed. Hell, It even made it onto the paper. LOL I just wasnt really ready to let it fly yet.

That night I changed out one of the springs to make it just a wee bit less touchy. Been fine ever since.

 

[ancjr]

I had a defective disconnector (Anderson Manufacturing parts kit) that would catch and then release the hammer at some random time in the future. I got rid of it in a hurry.

 

[ECS686]

The problem with mandatory training requirements is they usually come with “Minimum standards” so all one has to do is barely pass which doesn’t mean they are proficient. One needs to Look no farther than “that driver” on the road that passed (not by much) the state minimum to get their Operators License.

Training is great to have. Sound continuous routine practice is better and sadly most folks won’t (like the ones that think they are good drivers too)

 

[edporch]

Though I voted "No" to mandatory training to get a LTCH, I still think it's a good idea to get some instruction and practice on safely handling a handgun before you start carrying one.

IF mandatory training were required, it would be used by anti-2nd Amendment government officials to delay or block getting a LTCH.
"Sorry, all the training classes are full up...".