minimum wage argument

[ViperJock]

I have heard people say that minimum wage earners shouldn't expect to be able support a family on the jobs they have. If they want a better income, get a better job. Then they turn around and defend welfare in the same breath. All in the name of workers rights. Apparently, the concept doesn't seem ironic to them.

Theorem: Welfare reciepients should never make more than someone can on minimum wage. Defend or refute.

Yes the poll is weighted, but if you choose yes, you can write in your own answer. Also, if you think that the answer to THIS question is to raise minimum wage, please offer a reasonable method.

 

[Pyroponce]

What about those of us that think that there should be no welfare or minimum wage?

However, even in that scenario, welfare received wouldn't exceed the minimum wage. I believe your theorem is valid on that front. Even so, what about those earning minimum wage who aren't even full time? How do you account for that?

 

[IndySSD]

Minimum wage is just that.

There is absolutely NO reason for welfare payouts to match or exceed minimum wage earnings.

I can tell you that 12 years ago, I was living on 6.50$ an hour and it was tough, I had to have a roommate but it was doable. Are you going to have a house to yourself, a new car and the newest iPone if you make minimum wage (Now 7$+/hour) No.... but people should not EXPECT to have all those things, they are earned through hard work and dedication.

 

[bigg cheese]

Minimum Wage jobs are primarily entry level jobs taken by teenagers. They have little experience, and should be paid as such.

While I don't like the idea of welfare as extremely broad as it is now, I do recognize that there are people who need assistance, and if it exists, they should be able to pay their bills. That said, if anyone is on welfare, they need to be getting regular drug tests, and not paying for luxuries like cable or cell phones.

Short answer, welfare should get more than minimum wage.

 

[Kitty]

At least people earning minimum wage are actually working. I work with people with disabilities and many of them would rather bag groceries, wash cars, janitorial, - whatever, than live on a hand out. Yet I see the minimum wage worker struggling to just survive while their neighbor, on welfare, has a new Escalade and flat screen with PS3.

It's wrong.

 

[Westside]

I voted for the first no.


But personally I believe there should be no minimum wage and no Federal Welfare system. Lets bring back states rights and let each state determine it's own welfare system.

Also churches have food pantries and mine, I don't know about any others haven't done the research, also has a fund to help members pay their bills in a time of need. My church also has a free/low cost clinic to help people with medical and dental procedures. (we're not talking surgery, think minute click with a few more options)

I am not saying this is the perfect answer but by raising the minimum wage all you are doing is creating inflation. a loaf of bread used to costs a nickel now it cost at least $1.50, that was the cheapest I saw at Walmart this past weekend.

Business is all about supply, demand, and cost curves (where the supply demand and sales all meet). If the costs go up, what they have to pay employees, then the prices go up to cover the cost. Therefore creating no net increase in wages.

 

[shooter1054]

At least people earning minimum wage are actually working. I work with people with disabilities and many of them would rather bag groceries, wash cars, janitorial, - whatever, than live on a hand out. Yet I see the minimum wage worker struggling to just survive while their neighbor, on welfare, has a new Escalade and flat screen with PS3.

It's wrong.

THIS! pretty much explains it all. I would also add that minimum wage is not meant to support a family of 4. It is meant, as stated up thread, for entry level workers with minimum experience.

 

[Garb]

I voted that welfare spending should be lowered to be below minimum wage. I think both should be completely eliminated though.

 

[pinshooter45]

did not cast a vote for your poll because there was not a place for my answer. Raising the minimum wage COSTS JOBS! By doing so you increase the employers costs and it forces him or her to cut back labor cause they can't always just raise prices to cover the increase. Market forces drive wages. I remember working at White Castle as a teen. They paid .20 cents more the minimum to try to attract better people. (this was in 1975) And now most FF restaurants pay over a dollar more that min wage now, because the market dictates it. No one is willing to do that work for min wage so they have to pay more. And min wage is completely arbitrary. Where do you set it? If the current wage is not fair what is fair, is $9.00, $10.00 more fair? In that case why not increase it to $15.00 or even $20.00? You see where this is going? An employer pays exactly what the market dictates a job is worth. Besides I hate having the government set any wage! Because what will stop them from setting a MAXIMUM WAGE? Do you really want that? If you disagree and want more info I'll dig up my paper I wrote on the subject in college a few years ago. Hopefully the articles i use in my research are still around for you to read!

 

[bigg cheese]

a loaf of bread use to cast a nickle now it cost at least $1.50, that was the cheapest I saw at Walmart this past weekend.

My wife regularly gets bread from walmart for less than 90 cents. Kroger has it at about a buck (she uses coupons too), and County Market has sales with bread for ~88 cents.. We buy the CHEAP stuff .

 

[Arm America]

I'm okay with minimum wage and less than 40 hour work weeks.
It is minimum wage for minimum skills. Nothing more, nothing less.

Now welfare, thats really messed up.
It should not be more than minimum wage at 40 hours,
and it should be a tier pay system.

First 3-months, full unemployement payment,
Next 3-months, reduced by 25% to encourage seeking out a job,
Reduced again by 25% after 6-months of not finding some type of job.

I also feel that if your drawing unemployment,
you should be doing some type of Community Service.

Picking up trash from the side of the road,
Housekeeping or cleaning of Government Buildings, (includes schools)
Painting of curbs and fire hydrants in local areas.

And of course, Pass a drug test!

 

[bigg cheese]

Don't forget that unemployment is not the same as welfare. Unemployment is a required insurance policy that you and your employer pay already. You're owed that.

 

[Westside]

My wife regularly gets bread from walmart for less than 90 cents. Kroger has it at about a buck (she uses coupons too), and County Market has sales with bread for ~88 cents.. We buy the CHEAP stuff .

Notice I said cheapest I saw not cheapest there was. There is a wonder outlet down the street from there I am sure is a lot cheaper as well.

 

[SemperFiUSMC]

86 the minimum wage. It's inflationary and ineffective. The market will decide what it's worth to empty trash cans. All that the minimum wage does is incentivizes the elimination of low level jobs. Even McDonald's uses robots now.

I'm marginally OK with welfare programs, run and funded at the state level and using eligibility criteria that does not include ca$h for babies. People that need a hand need a hand.

 

[GBuck]

I'm fine with the minimum wage, it is not meant to raise a family on. I do not think that Welfare should make more than minimum wage. I think it should be harder to get welfare. Pretty simple isn't it?

 

[rjstew317]

I don't believe in a "minimum wage", I think it should be up to private business owners to determine what they are willing to pay for any given job. If they try and pay too little they won't attract the people they need and will have to correct wages accordingly.

I don't believe in a government sponsored welfare either, it makes people dependent and lazy. I do believe in helping out my fellow man with charitable acts ad I give money to those causes, I just don't like the idea/ implementation of the government forcing me to do so by taking my money without consent.

 

[IndySSD]

86 the minimum wage. It's inflationary and ineffective. The market will decide what it's worth to empty trash cans. All that the minimum wage does is incentivizes the elimination of low level jobs. Even McDonald's uses robots now.

This is a good idea but it only works if you eliminate illegal working relationships (cash paid under the table).

 

[buford t justice]

I believe there should be welfare,but nothing that resembles what we now have.

It should be a system with a life time cap on benefits,and once you have reached that cap your done.

Anyone can fall on hard times,and anyone with ambition can dig themselves out.

 

[Harry2110]

I voted for the first no.


But personally I believe there should be no minimum wage and no Federal Welfare system. Lets bring back states rights and let each state determine it's own welfare system.

Also churches have food pantries and mine, I don't know about any others haven't done the research, also has a fund to help members pay their bills in a time of need. My church also has a free/low cost clinic to help people with medical and dental procedures. (where not talking surgery, think minute click with a few more options)

I am not saying this is the perfect answer but by raising the minimum wage all you are doing is creating inflation. a loaf of bread use to cast a nickle now it cost at least $1.50, that was the cheapest I saw at Walmart this past weekend.

Business is all about supply, demand, and cost curves (where the supply demand and sales all meet). If the cost go up, what they have to pay employees, then the prices go up to cover the cost. Therefore creating no net increase in wages.

I make minnium wage part time but i have housing paid for right now. I would keep it the same unless inflation demands to raise it as just raising it will cause in inflation to happen faster.

Now its not just for unskilled teenagers but also for skilled positions. I work for my college as a assistant for the main IT faculty support in one building. Basically I am one of 2 people that work on all faculty computers in the building. Now i dont hate my job one bit in fact I love it and cant wait for work. I took the job as it was only one of 2 out of 30 or so interviews and resumes to return to me. I usually get turned away because having to ride a bike because no DL and from them thinking because i have bad eyesight i cant do anything. Walmart even turned me down. The other job was for maybe .50 more but would have looked a lot worse on a resume as when i graduate I hope to not only have a bachelors in computer networking but also 4 years experience in the field doing my job and the possibility that I may have a decent paying job when i graduate by just moving to another position in the company.

Now i dont do anything with welfare but it should be more based on situation minimum wage while showing looking for a job and submitting applications less when not and more if supporting a family.

 

[eldirector]

A) Minimum wage should be abolished. Let employers and employees work out the value of a job. Artificial wage inflation does NOTHING but drive costs and unemployment UP.
B) Welfare paid by the State should be abolished. The truly destitute can be served better by charities. The "mooches" can go get a job or rot - their choice.
C) So, to answer your poll, Welfare should "pay" less than minimum wage.