Justified Shooting reference FAQ/Q&A. (Shoot or Don't Shoot) Self defense, IN.

[ChevyNova1970]

"You can not just shoot someone unarmed for being in your house. "
As far as I'm aware of, actually you can. At least in Indiana. Someone breaking into your house is covered under the Castle Doctrine for Indiana, correct? Whether they're unarmed or not appears to not matter, as it is assumed if someone is unlawfully entering your abode, they may also cause you harm.

Yes, you can shoot an unarmed burglar in your home, however, they have to attack you. If you discover them in your house and they are stealing your property, you can't shoot them. You may use non-lethal force to stop them. (Tackle,punch,kick, joint locks,etc.)

 

[mainjet]

Yes, you can shoot an unarmed burglar in your home, however, they have to attack you. If you discover them in your house and they are stealing your property, you can't shoot them. You may use non-lethal force to stop them. (Tackle,punch,kick, joint locks,etc.)

If they manage to escape your grip and get out of your house are you allowed to drag them back in and shoot them before calling the police?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Yes, you can shoot an unarmed burglar in your home, however, they have to attack you. If you discover them in your house and they are stealing your property, you can't shoot them. You may use non-lethal force to stop them. (Tackle,punch,kick, joint locks,etc.)

Case where homeowner was convicted for shooting burglar in the act? Not fleeing, but still in progress.

Does this look familiar:
b) A person:
(1) is justified in using reasonable force, including deadly force, against another person; and
(2) does not have a duty to retreat;
if the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent or terminate the other person's unlawful entry of or attack on the person's dwelling, curtilage, or occupied motor vehicle. - See more at: http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/incode/35/41/3/35-41-3-2#sthash.H2X5Chwr.dpuf

 

[T.Lex]

Good luck in your endeavors.

Yes, you can shoot an unarmed burglar in your home, however, they have to attack you.

This is where the experience issue comes into play. KF or Fargo may have a different perspective, but I've known prosecutors to specifically not file charges where a homeowner shot an unarmed intruder just because they were in the residence. At least one even shot through an exterior door and killed someone trying to get in - the homeowner had not been attacked.

 

[ckcollins2003]

Yes, I am majoring in criminal justice for an associate's degree and then pursuing law enforcement. I want to be a difference in our society and show to the community and public that police officers aren't here to hurt you. Law enforcement is to protect and serve you. I want to dedicate my career to helping others in need.

"Does distance matter when I shoot someone?

Actually, yes it does. If you shoot someone threatening to kill you with a knife in their hand from over 50ft away, this would not be a lawful self-defense. The threat is too far away to be used for deadly force. You have to be in arms length for a knife to be used effectively."

So as a police officer, if a person is threatening you with a knife from 50 ft away, are you willing to wait until he is within arms length to shoot?

Personally I find this hard to believe. While I may not shoot right away, if he charges at me, I'm shooting before he gets within the distance to slash/stab me. I wouldn't expect an officer to wait either. Whoever stated this hasn't been in a self defense situation against someone within arms length with a knife. I'm not a lawyer, or a criminal justice major, but I know the difference between life and death and what happens when you hesitate.

 

[SSGSAD]

So as a police officer, if a person is threatening you with a knife from 50 ft away, are you willing to wait until he is within arms length to shoot?

Personally I find this hard to believe. While I may not shoot right away, if he charges at me, I'm shooting before he gets within the distance to slash/stab me. I wouldn't expect an officer to wait either. Whoever stated this hasn't been in a self defense situation against someone within arms length with a knife. I'm not a lawyer, or a criminal justice major, but I know the difference between life and death and what happens when you hesitate.

THE 21 foot rule ..... This is why LEO, qualify at 7 yards .....

 

[Kirk Freeman]

This is where the experience issue comes into play. KF or Fargo may have a different perspective, but I've known prosecutors to specifically not file charges where a homeowner shot an unarmed intruder just because they were in the residence. At least one even shot through an exterior door and killed someone trying to get in - the homeowner had not been attacked.

Fact sensitive but a Tippecanoe County jury is going to be hard pressed to convict on a true burglar. Heck, the guy that shot the burglar with a gauge that the stripper set up was acquitted in under an hour.

You go to some place like White County and expect even faster acquitals AND the jury passes the hat for more ammunition.

At least one even shot through an exterior door and killed someone trying to get in - the homeowner had not been attacked

Remember I've had those go both ways. If you are talking about my guy on Wabash Avenue that killed the guy through the door who came back for the stolen, er, borrowed shotgun, then jury acquitted of Murder but convicted of Manslaughter. Got my plea from the jury, not the prosecutor.

 

[T.Lex]

Fact sensitive but a Tippecanoe County jury is going to be hard pressed to convict on a true burglar. Heck, the guy that shot the burglar with a gauge that the stripper set up was acquitted in under an hour.

You go to some place like White County and expect even faster acquitals AND the jury passes the hat for more ammunition.

Remember I've had those go both ways. If you are talking about my guy on Wabash Avenue that killed the guy through the door who came back for the stolen, er, borrowed shotgun, then jury acquitted of Murder but convicted of Manslaughter. Got my plea from the jury, not the prosecutor.

That's been my observation. Some prosecutors have lost the "unarmed burglar" cases and tell other prosecutors to the point that prosecutors who haven't had one will still avoid filing. Unless there are text message (or tweets) inviting the "burglar" over - or in other words, as long as there's evidence of unauthorized entry - a prosecutor is going to be very reluctant to file.

Does that make it "justified"? Well, at that point, let's argue about how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. No charges is effectively the same as legally justified.

 

[indiucky]

What is considered to be a justified shooting?

These?

[video=youtube;zP7e5NQgwXw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zP7e5NQgwXw[/video]

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Unless there are text message (or tweets) inviting the "burglar" over - or in other words, as long as there's evidence of unauthorized entry - a prosecutor is going to be very reluctant to file.

Those are not allowed under the INGO Rules of Evidence. I'm going to strike this sentence from the record and admonish the jury.

 

[T.Lex]

But I strenuously object.

 

[chipbennett]

Does distance matter when I shoot someone?

Actually, yes it does. If you shoot someone threatening to kill you with a knife in their hand from over 50ft away, this would not be a lawful self-defense. The threat is too far away to be used for deadly force. You have to be in arms length for a knife to be used effectively. Now, if this person has a firearm in their hand, this changes the whole scenario. You can shoot this person if draw or raise the firearm they making threats with.

As per the Teuller drill, 21 feet represent a reaction time of 1.5 seconds. 50 feet would be a bit more than 3 seconds. So, I would say that it depends. If someone is running at you with a knife, threatening to kill you, there is no reason that 50 feet is absolutely unreasonable. I would rely on ability, opportunity, and jeopardy to make the decision.

Okay, so if I am at home and some one breaks in, Can I shoot them?

Yes, you can with a limit however. There has to be some type of contact. I would give sometime of command at first contact with the suspect. (Freeze, stop, hands, don't move,etc) You can not just shoot someone unarmed for being in your house. Always try to de-escalate the scenario. I know it sounds crazy, but you would not get away with shooting someone point blank in your house. Now, if the have a gun, knife, etc, you can use deadly force. Another one too is, if you use commands to stop,freeze, etc. and the suspect still comes towards to attack you, you may shoot them. You do not have to retreat in our state inside of your dwelling. What i mean by this, is in some states you have to try to retreat or escape away from the threat. In Indiana, you do not have to do this.

I don't see these stipulations specifically in the IC (35-41-3-2(d)):

A person:
(1) is justified in using reasonable force, including deadly force,against any other person; and
(2) does not have a duty to retreat;
if the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to preventor terminate the other person's unlawful entry of or attack on theperson's dwelling, curtilage, or occupied motor vehicle.

What is required is a reasonable belief that the deadly force was necessary to terminate the unlawful entry.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

But I strenuously object.

You did not Ron Paul object and as Ron Paul is the answer to every question, my ruling stands.

 

[indiucky]

You did not Ron Paul object and as Ron Paul is the answer to every question, my ruling stands.

Whew...I thought you were going to go with the "Chewbacca Defense."

[video=youtube;xwdba9C2G14]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwdba9C2G14[/video]

 

[ckcollins2003]

THE 21 foot rule ..... This is why LEO, qualify at 7 yards .....

21 foot rule is exactly what entered my mind when I read his OP about it. Waiting for the attacker to be within arms length has to be the dumbest thing I've heard.

 

[rhino]

Bwahahahaha

Valpo?

Ooh! What you did there? I saw it!

I'm going to out on a limb here (a very sturdy limb), but I predeict that this "FAQ" is not going to get stickied.

 

[TaunTaun]

21 foot rule is exactly what entered my mind when I read his OP about it. Waiting for the attacker to be within arms length has to be the dumbest thing I've heard.

I was thinking the same thing. The wife prefers knives for protection. It took her awhile to get it through that if you have a gun, letting someone get into knife range is stupid, even if you have a knife as well.

If the person attacking you with a knife is within arms length, and you haven't even realized you need a weapon yet, Bad Thing.
If the person attacking you with a knife is within arms length, and you haven't even drawn your weapon yet, Bad Thing.
If the person attacking you with a knife is within arms length, and you have already drawn your sidearm, Bad Thing.
If the person attacking you with a knife is within arms length, and you haven't emptied the mag so that you can use the weapon as a club, Bad Thing.
If the person attacking you with a knife is within arms length, and you haven't started your KAMEHAMEHA blast, Bad Thing.

 

[Hammerhead]

Whew...I thought you were going to go with the "Chewbacca Defense."

Stop it, you'll make him put on his Wookie suit.

 

[Paul30]

But I strenuously object.

I strenuously object, is that how that works?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOnRHAyXqYY

 

[Paul30]

I will shoot when my gut tells me it's time, not before, not after. Shooting someone is on my bucket list of things I hope I never have to do, and would do about anything possible to avoid. I am a good man, period. I trust my judgement, period. I know deep inside that if I am in a situation where it's time to take action, I will do whatever I have to do to survive the encounter, but I'm definately not trigger happy to end someone's life no matter what they have done. I am also in no hurry to put my entire financial future as well as my personal freedom on the line for anything other than "I am in danger of great bodily harm or death". That said, I'll be darned if I let someone beat me to a brain dead state before deciding to take action to keep them from continuing the beating, because once you are incapacitated, you may lose the option. I am not violent by nature, but jury or no, if someone tells me they are going to physically attack me I will try everything possible to verbally prevent it, or even leave if possible. If that doesn't work, I'm going to court for shooting an unarmed man regardless of race, religion, or any other thing that makes no difference in a similar situation. So in short, if someone decides a violent attack that could leave me brain dead for life is a game of some sort, I'm speed dialing my lawyer "Guy" as soon as I hang up on 911 after calling for an ambulance for the attacker and the police. I doubt the ambulance will do them much good, but it's the right thing to do, and it should count in court as an effort for the jury if they happen to be of a different race WHEN (not if) the prosecutor tries to paint me as a hateful trigger happy nut.