HVAC Decision help

[bulletsmith]

I know there are a few HVAC people here, so I thought I'd ask for some input.

My house was built in the late 60's. It has a boiler and baseboard hot water heat. It's well past time to replace the boiler. I really like the radiant heat, but really really hate the window ac I'm forced to use.

My options seem to be to upgrade to a forced air system for heat and ac, or replace the boiler and go with a forced air system for ac only. Can anybody offer pros and cons with these options based on your experience?

BTW, because of the layout of the home, I'd most likely be looking at two forced air units.

 

[ChristianPatriot]

Adding forced air to an existing house is a massive pain in the butt and crazy expensive. Are you propane or natural gas?

 

[bulletsmith]

Adding forced air to an existing house is a massive pain in the butt and crazy expensive. Are you propane or natural gas?

Natural gas.

Yeah, walls will be harmed in the process...

 

[churchmouse]

Adding forced air to an existing house is a massive pain in the butt and crazy expensive. Are you propane or natural gas?

^^^^This^^^^^^^^^^

Doable but a lot of work.

Basement that accesses all the ground floor...???

Attic accessible to human beings...???

 

[churchmouse]

Natural gas.

Yeah, walls will be harmed in the process...

2nd floor unit most likely in the attic or a closet.

 

[bulletsmith]

Right on the money. Basement unit for the ground floor rooms, except for family room. Attic space above attic is accessible, and is where I'm thinking of putting the second unit. That one would handle family room, and up stairs bedrooms.

 

[bulletsmith]

So do I keep the boiler? Or just convert totally to forced air for heat and ac?

 

[churchmouse]

Right on the money. Basement unit for the ground floor rooms, except for family room. Attic space above attic is accessible, and is where I'm thinking of putting the second unit. That one would handle family room, and up stairs bedrooms.

We have done a few of these this year and man the attic work sucks.
Basements are OK.

 

[87iroc]

I have the same issue. When we bought our house...it had a 'space pac' central air system in the attic. It was central air system that worked on the philosophy of high velocity air. It was designed to retrofit old homes and the ductwork could be fed through walls. It was great...I guess...for what it was designed for. It never worked well for us.

So when it went out, I had 3 quotes come in for retrofitting a more normal system in. 6-11k was the price range(single story ranch with nice crawl space). We opted for window units for a few years. We're now getting ready to pay someone to retrofit the forced air CA system in the house.(I'm in Columbus area). IN the process we'll get a central air unit...and a new furnace. We'll leave the boiler system in as I like it as well. We'll have a backup heat source(they're wanting to make it electric...as I believe its simpler to install. As we already have gas...I don't really care). It will be an interesting adventure...especially to see how they punch holes through some of our tile floors. Not worried about most of them...except for the 2 bathrooms(one with heating wires in the floor) tile that they'll have to punch in to. As we are ready to spend the cash...I am going to ask many more implementation questions than I did 4-5 yrs ago when initial quotes came in.

Bad thing is...I don't think it adds much value to the house. Its expected to have CA today. Although we just had our house appraised and it was super low...I think its because eot he lack of CA in the house.

 

[ChristianPatriot]

.

 

[churchmouse]

.

Space paks never worked well for anybody.

 

[corngrower]

Investigate a ductless mini split system. Can do heat and cool not real common yet but it's making gains. I love the individual room temps and the high efficiency of the system

 

[ChristianPatriot]

Ah yes, the ductless mini-split. Invented by El-Diablo himself.

 

[corngrower]

Ok I'm not in the HVAC business but have a mini split and it has been much better than installing a ducted system. What makes them bad? Not trying to hijack the op

 

[CountryBoy19]

Ok I'm not in the HVAC business but have a mini split and it has been much better than installing a ducted system. What makes them bad? Not trying to hijack the op

I agree, they are widely used in Europe etc and they work well from all my experience. I think the biggest factor is quality; you buy junk you end up with junk, no surprise there.

 

[Cameramonkey]

I agree, they are widely used in Europe etc and they work well from all my experience. I think the biggest factor is quality; you buy junk you end up with junk, no surprise there.

This. I have a split system at the office. Biggest pain for me? The drain pan algaes up and pees all over the floor if I dont clean it every 90 days. And the squirrel cage cant be cleaned without draining the gas and disassembling the whole system. And when the cage gets too gummed up it starts spitting little black snowflakes of dust as they come off the fan vanes.

And I cant justify a replacement unit to my bosses while it still works simply based on an annoyance so I just have to clean it religiously and do my best to clean the fan blades with one of those thin flexible brushes you use to clean out a clothes dryer vent screen area by sticking it into the unit while running. (yes, I may damage the fan but as you can see from above I'm not too worried about that. A forced replacement isnt a bad thing. )

But damn if they arent easy to install. One or two 1"-ish holes in the wall or ceiling and you are done. All you need to pass through the walls is copper tubing and the condensate drain tube.

And the other drawback is they are electric heat only.

EDIT: And the takeaway that may not be obvious, Make sure the unit can be serviced without draining the "freon". If my fan goes out, They cant simply replace the motor.

 

[churchmouse]

Splits are not the end all. In some situations they are the answer but not all.
They have limitations on multi-room systems and they take up so much wall space. They are not that decorative.
Installation costs on multi-zone systems can go north of budget.

 

[long coat]

My MIL has elect base board heat and the A/C in the attic. She rents the house, when the A/C was installed the drain was done wrong. That caused it to leak and the drywall ceiling has been repaired 2 times now. I'm not sure what was installed wrong, but it was not cheap to have it fixed, she's glad she rents and didn't have to pay for it.

 

[mtinner]

never rule out geothermal.

 

[CountryBoy19]

And the other drawback is they are electric heat only.

Most of them are electric heat-pump heat, which is much more efficient than electric resistance heat...

My experience with them is primarily limited to CHU use (single room) and similar applications which is where they really shine.

CM is definitely right in that they can easily surpass budget if you try to outfit an entire home with them.