How bad do NFA approval times have to get before a lawsuit becomes applicable?

[rooster]

Currently 350-450 days for a paper form 4. Eforms, which was supposed to solve the problem with a 90 day wait by end of year is currently over 200 days and growing every single day.


At what point is a lawsuit applicable for the government simply failing to do its job in a timely manner?

The flip side of this is if there are so many suppressors/sbr’s getting created that .gov can’t keep up with applications then at what point are they “common use” ?

 

[KLB]

What difference does common use make? They are being "taxed" not banned.

 

[cg21]

What difference does common use make? They are being "taxed" not banned.

Well they seem to be “taxed” because they are “more dangerous” yet they are used in very few if any violent crimes even with the huge amount that are in circulation.

 

[1nderbeard]

you can't sue the government for being terrible at its job. but you can vote, and when that doesn't work something else.

 

[manifest destiny]

I wonder if the delay is simply ineptitude or a nefarious effort to limit the acquisition if NFA items getting in the hands of citizens.

 

[2in1evtime]

I wonder if the delay is simply ineptitude or a nefarious effort to limit the acquisition if NFA items getting in the hands of citizens.

This right here and some voted for this

 

[rooster]

you can't sue the government for being terrible at its job. but you can vote, and when that doesn't work something else.

Aren’t like half of hundreds of lawsuits against the trump administration some form of “the administration isn’t doing its job?”

And how are people and groups allowed to sue the presidential administration but not agencies ?

 

[Cameramonkey]

you can't sue the government for being terrible at its job. but you can vote, and when that doesn't work something else.

To quote the great Rocket J. Squirrel "That trick never works"

Just look at some here's Lord and Savior... He sure didnt do anything about bump stocks when he had the chance. Or lift a finger to reign in the ATF.

 

[manifest destiny]

I'm thinking lawsuits can happen anytime for any reason. But convincing a court/judge that the suit has merit is an uphill battle. Even reasonable lawsuits based upon indisputable facts would take years to be settled. And years worth of money, time and other resources. There is obviously a point in time at which delay becomes de facto denial. I can buy a fully semi-automatic gun with more than 8 bullets in a round off the internet. But I can't get permission to be taxed for adding a muffler to my rifle in 18 months time. The system is broke.

 

[manifest destiny]

To quote the great Rocket J. Squirrel "That trick never works"

Just look at some here's Lord and Savior... He sure didnt do anything about bump stocks when he had the chance. Or lift a finger to reign in the ATF.

Wasn't he busy fighting off impeachment for being a Russian agent? Or fighting for securing the border?

 

[Cameramonkey]

Wasn't he busy fighting off impeachment for being a Russian agent? Or fighting for securing the border?

Irrelevant.

And its worse than I remember. When I went for the quote I remembered him saying they were just toys with no serious value, I found that he called for their banning after the Vegas shooting. I recalled that it was the ATF that did it and he sat on his hands. I was wrong.


So just because you vote out a Democrat and vote in a Republican, doesnt mean he believes in our 2A rights completely.

 

[cg21]

Irrelevant.

And its worse than I remember. When I went for the quote I remembered him saying they were just toys with no serious value, I found that he called for their banning after the Vegas shooting. I recalled that it was the ATF that did it and he sat on his hands. I was wrong.


So just because you vote out a Democrat and vote in a Republican, doesnt mean he believes in our 2A rights completely.

Trumps record shows he was far from a 2A advocate. But he looked like Colion noir when comparing him to the “other side”

 

[Ziggidy]

Irrelevant.

And its worse than I remember. When I went for the quote I remembered him saying they were just toys with no serious value, I found that he called for their banning after the Vegas shooting. I recalled that it was the ATF that did it and he sat on his hands. I was wrong.


So just because you vote out a Democrat and vote in a Republican, doesnt mean he believes in our 2A rights completely.

I've heard this out of the mouths of many people over the last 60 years.

Got to vote for the best out of what we're given and keep moving forward. We reached this point because we allowed it. No one to blame but ourselves; and the demoncrats.

 

[Cameramonkey]

I'm thinking lawsuits can happen anytime for any reason. But convincing a court/judge that the suit has merit is an uphill battle. Even reasonable lawsuits based upon indisputable facts would take years to be settled. And years worth of money, time and other resources. There is obviously a point in time at which delay becomes de facto denial. I can buy a fully semi-automatic gun with more than 8 bullets in a round off the internet. But I can't get permission to be taxed for adding a muffler to my rifle in 18 months time. The system is broke.

And dont forget that SCOTUS likes to kill lawsuits like this when the plaintiff loses standing, even though there are millions more like him. You'd have to have a stamp in waiting to sue. By the time they got around to hearing your case, You'd have your stamp and SCOTUS would dismiss the case because it was no longer a problem; you got your stamp. You are made whole.

There was a "kid" who sued because 18yos should be able to buy a handgun. While waiting on SCOTUS, he turned 21 and no longer had standing in their eyes. So they dismissed it on those grounds, instead of ruling to protect the "kids" behind him who were also impacted. Total Bull

 

[rooster]

And dont forget that SCOTUS likes to kill lawsuits like this when the plaintiff loses standing, even though there are millions more like him. You'd have to have a stamp in waiting to sue. By the time they got around to hearing your case, You'd have your stamp and SCOTUS would dismiss the case because it was no longer a problem; you got your stamp. You are made whole.

There was a "kid" who sued because 18yos should be able to buy a handgun. While waiting on SCOTUS, he turned 21 and no longer had standing in their eyes. So they dismissed it on those grounds, instead of ruling to protect the "kids" behind him who were also impacted. Total Bull

Didn’t the Supreme Court just rule about this in a New York case? If I remember NY was being sued so they changed their laws to stop the lawsuit

 

[Cameramonkey]

Didn’t the Supreme Court just rule about this in a New York case? If I remember NY was being sued so they changed their laws to stop the lawsuit

That too. I'm thinking of another case.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law/gun-sales-minimum-age-21/2021/09/22/52f7f83e-1bc0-11ec-a99a-5fea2b2da34b_story.html

And wouldnt this be like saying "Plaintiff Roe has reached menopause. (or died) Therefore Since she is no longer capable of becoming pregnant, we are vacating the ruling of RvW."

 

[rooster]

That too. I'm thinking of another case.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law/gun-sales-minimum-age-21/2021/09/22/52f7f83e-1bc0-11ec-a99a-5fea2b2da34b_story.html

And wouldnt this be like saying "Plaintiff Roe has reached menopause. (or died) Therefore Since she is no longer capable of becoming pregnant, we are vacating the ruling of RvW."

Maybe this is a good strategy to get my next form 4 approved quickly. File form 4 and then file lawsuit

 

[Cameramonkey]

Maybe this is a good strategy to get my next form 4 approved quickly. File form 4 and then file lawsuit

Lol. No. The case will just drag on longer than the form. You'll get your form in a year and a half like "normal" and then once you have it the courts will say "See, no problem here. He has been remedied, no need to press ATF to move faster."
As long as the ATF moves faster than the courts (7 years?) Nobody will be able to force a change through the courts. And its ridiculous.

 

[xwing]

Over 200 for eForm now? Do you have a link to your source? I recently saw 160, but maybe it's changed (or maybe I'm not looking in the right place)

And I think it's incompetence by the government instead of intentional. They have no incentive to improve and don't try very hard, but aren't actively working to make it take longer.

 

[Creedmoor]

Over 200 for eForm now? Do you have a link to your source? I recently saw 160, but maybe it's changed (or maybe I'm not looking in the right place)

And I think it's incompetence by the government instead of intentional. They have no incentive to improve and don't try very hard, but aren't actively working to make it take longer.

I was at Huntington Gun & Pawn yesterday using the Kiosk. The man behind the counter told me eForms are averaging 7 months.