Home Defense Shotgun Loads -- A Comparison

[Cole46845]

Great post thanks! I'm a new shotgun owner. Mossy 500 cruiser and this clears up what shot to use

 

[ShootnCut]

Just remember guys, shotguns pattern differently even among the same model. Two identical guns off the same assembly line may throw different patterns. So be sure to confirm the results with your own gun.

N8RV, Excellent Post! Thanks for taking the time to test and post your results. I've always loved fighting scatterguns and have been surprised over the years at some of the results I've encountered. Your post is what these forums are all about.

Oh, and many years ago an old fellow recommended loading shotgun shells with rice for close range when kids are stealing your pumpkins. Ever see what rice does when it absorbs moisture?

 

[TheWabbit]

00 buck suffers from over penetration in close quarters HD scenarios. #4 is recommended for a reason.

 

[chezuki]

Anything that penetrates enough bad guy to consitantly stop him will also penetrate walls.

Don't compromise your defensive load to gamble on physics, just "Be sure if your target and what's behind it".

 

[1911ly]

I'm sure that there are a gazillion combinations of effective HD loads out there. I just happened to buy these to see what they would do. I would imagine that the #4 shot would fall somewhere in between the BUBBA SHELLS and the LAW ENFORCEMENT load.

My concern with small shot only is that there are far too many stories out there of bad guys, hit with multiple rounds of small shot, who continue to press on. In fact, the first autopsy I watched was on a HUGE guy whose common-law wife somehow managed to wrest away from his bear paws a single-shot 12 gauge loaded with #6 shot, as I recall. Oh, and she was the only (surviving) witness. Imagine that.

It somehow accidentally went off, striking him in the side. He looked the rapidly growing red spot on his undershirt, looked at her and took the shotgun away from her. He plopped down on the couch, propped his feet up on the coffee table, called her a ***** and laughed at her. Had that not been a single-shot gun ...

At autopsy, his innards were shredded. One lung completely collapsed, several holes in his heart, trachea and esophagus, liver and spleen -- all from the "billiard ball effect" of pellets caroming off each other and bones. Really ugly. However, it takes time to bleed out, thus the insistence of some advocating slugs for HD.

I thought that maybe a slug/pellet combo would be the best of both worlds. I'm sure it all depends on what you hit and how many times. Regardless, more holes and larger holes equals faster incapacitation in most cases.

I also like the slug/pellet combo. Pellets first and the slug follow up. I was recommended to use slugs on every other round when I load the gun. This was by a county cop. I think I like your test with the mix in one shell.

 

[N8RV]

00 buck suffers from over penetration in close quarters HD scenarios. #4 is recommended for a reason.

Agreed. However, life is full of compromises (unless you're a liberal ), and some folks advocate using an AR or AK for home defense. Quite effective, but talk about penetration of missed rounds. Same issue with some pistol ammo.

I see the shotgun loads as just another set of compromises to address an unknown emergency. Could a slug or 00 load miss and go through walls with enough energy to injure or kill someone in another room? Through several walls? That's fodder for another test. I just wanted to see the pattern and spread.

Besides, I don't have any loved ones in adjacent rooms. Even my neighbors are fair game at times, so I don't worry about over-penetration.

 

[melensdad]

people seem to under estimate the power of #4 shot, hit the face or throat area & the fight will be gone from the bad guy

I'm sure that there are a gazillion combinations of effective HD loads out there. I just happened to buy these to see what they would do. I would imagine that the #4 shot would fall somewhere in between the BUBBA SHELLS and the LAW ENFORCEMENT load.

My concern with small shot only is that there are far too many stories out there of bad guys, hit with multiple rounds of small shot, who continue to press on.

00 buck suffers from over penetration in close quarters HD scenarios. #4 is recommended for a reason.

I actually like what the "FBI" reccomends, #4 Buck..... 27 pellets, and a nice pattern ..... JMHO,

We need to be very careful when we talk about #4 in our shotgun.

There is #4 BUCKSHOT and there is #4 BIRDSHOT. A big difference.

Not everyone on this forum is experienced enough to know the difference. But #4 BUCKSHOT is bigger and heavier and nothing like #4 BIRDSHOT.

So for the folks who are on this forum and don't know, it should be stated that #4 BIRDSHOT is NOT generally considered suitable for self-defense, while #4 BUCKSHOT is often recommended by self-defense experts.

 

[N8RV]

We need to be very careful when we talk about #4 in our shotgun.

There is #4 BUCKSHOT and there is #4 BIRDSHOT. A big difference.

Not everyone on this forum is experienced enough to know the difference. But #4 BUCKSHOT is bigger and heavier and nothing like #4 BIRDSHOT.

So for the folks who are on this forum and don't know, it should be stated that #4 BIRDSHOT is NOT generally considered suitable for self-defense, while #4 BUCKSHOT is often recommended by self-defense experts.
http://s3.photobucket.com/user/melensdad/media/gats/image_zpsde0de4b2.jpg.html

Good point, Bob. Thanks for pointing that out.

Also, if you have a few minutes to kill, go to YouTube and search for "wax slugs." There are several videos demonstrating the ballistic efficacy of using smaller shot held together with wax to effectively magnify the energy of the pellets into a mass that is much more destructive than a slug.

I'm not sure what the legal ramifications are of modifying shot shells like this for defensive use, but for those who firmly believe that it's "better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6," it may be a viable option.

I would be more concerned about missing the target with wax slugs, just as I would using the Pit Bull load above. However, the physics of energy transfer as the pellets in a "wax slug" encounter the resistance of a body and begin to scatter is impressive in HD (that's high-definition in this case, not home defense ... although I'm sure that would be equally impressive.)

 

[melensdad]

Good point, Bob. Thanks for pointing that out.

I'm right? Really?

QUICK . . . Somebody tell my wife

 

[Yamadog35]

There is #4 BUCKSHOT and there is #4 BIRDSHOT. A big difference.

This may help visualize a bit more. #4 BIRD on right. #4 BUCK in middle. and 00 Buck on left for comparison.

 

[BigBoxaJunk]

Why mess with birdshot? Why risk having to shoot someone more than necessary?

Is this a trick question?

 

[walleyepw]

When I was single and didn't have kids I had my Mossy 500 loaded with six shells of Federal number 4 Personal Defense loads. Out of the improved cylinder bore they patterned nicely. Now with children in the house the long guns are locked up. I have to make do with my Glock 22. I prefer the shotgun for variety of options and would like to go back to having the shot gun ready for home defense.

 

[Ketchup]

Thanks for the data!

Those 12 pellets aren't kidding around..

 

[BugI02]

I'd like to suggest an additional test for anyone selecting home defense gun/ammunition combos. Find a safe location outdoors and fire each of the candidates at night. Some loads out of a personal firearm turn out to be real flamethrowers that seriously degrade ones night vision, in which case one shot/one kill has now become a necessity. When I did this test with my handguns I was quite surprised with the wide variation in the amount of glare accompanying the discharge, even within the same caliber.

 

[alan robert]

Nice range report. I think the (15') test range was very practical. Good data to consider.

Thanks.