Buying a rifle FTF without a LTCH

[melensdad]

I would not sell FTF even if you have LTCH. A FFL transfer at a LGS is the only way to do this. I would feel terrible had I sold a handgun or riffle to someone that showed a LTCH and was revoked or fake and the gun was used in a illegal manner. The usual $15-$20 transfer fee is worth a piece a mind that I did everything I could to keep guns out of criminals hands.

And that is a perfectly valid opinion.

Rarely do I sell any gun, are rarer yet to someone I don't personally know. Have I done it? Yes. But only after sizing them up to the best of my ability.

I have 4 guns for sale now, all 4 are guns I don't use. None are here on INGO. 3 are going through my favorite FFL. 1 is going to another FFL that I've had prior dealings with.

We each make our own choices.

 

[wally05]

I've required it for piece of mind. Sorry, but I won't sell to anyone without one unless you want to pay a transfer fee. It's the responsible thing to do. I've only turned down one buyer in a FTF and it was one I got the "willies" from. I just said "sorry, man, I can't sell this to you." Got in my car and left without further explanation.
==================================================================

I'VE DONE THE SAME THING EVEN WHEN A PERMIT WAS SHOWN. SOMETIMES YOU JUST HAVE TO GET A READ ON PEOPLE. RIGHT OR WRONG. PEACE OF MIND IS A GOOD THING..

Yep, I agree! Good points on the fake/expired LTCHs, though. I might start requiring that we meet to do a transfer/4473.

That person bothered me non-stop for weeks via PM saying that what I did wasn't fair and that he demanded I sell it to him (was an AR15 lower). I finally told him why I didn't and that I thought he was a scumbag that might do something wrong with it... the messages stopped.

 

[gregkl]

Having a copy is common practice. After loosing mine when wallet went missing I will be making a viable copy to carry and the original will be in the safe.

.

Not a bad idea. Maybe one could be made slightly smaller(like credit card size) so it fits better!

How would you make a "viable" copy? I'm looking at mine now and it looks like I could get a piece of pink paper and just copy it on my copier, maybe shrink it slightly, laminate it and be done.

 

[Indy500]

Not a bad idea. Maybe one could be made slightly smaller(like credit card size) so it fits better!

How would you make a "viable" copy? I'm looking at mine now and it looks like I could get a piece of pink paper and just copy it on my copier, maybe shrink it slightly, laminate it and be done.

I went to Kinko's and they have pink paper. I think I copied it at 95% then laminated them. It is still big enough to read everything but still fits in the wallet after laminating.

 

[gregkl]

I went to Kinko's and they have pink paper. I think I copied it at 95% then laminated them. It is still big enough to read everything but still fits in the wallet after laminating.

Thanks. I just did the same thing. Once I get it laminated, it will be credit card size. I'll stick the original in the safe. Glad I posted here!

 

[Sgtusmc]

http://www.usacarry.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/indiana.jpg

Pink paper, a computer, a printer and a subtle knowledge of typography. Easily defeatable, not that I would ever do something illegal. Just sayin....

Look at South Bends legislation. I'm sure they're tired of gang bangers coming down from chi-town to make straw man purchases in this very similar manner.

 

[SERparacord]

The pink slip is an indicator that you are most likely not a felon.

 

[philbert001]

I feel like a LTCH is nice for additional warm fuzzy feeling, but I won't require it, and I trust my gut over a card, either way! There are plenty of people out there, who HAVE a LTCH, only because they haven't been caught yet! It's NOT a be all end all security check! Like I said, my gut is the background check I trust most! Weather you are a felon or not, I feel my instinct is enough for me to have amnesty to avoid, "Knowingly selling to an improper person"!

 

[Sgtusmc]

I'm just saying, the reasoning for asking for a LTCH in a rifle sale is fallable. It's going beyond what the law requires for a rifle purchase. Do we appreciate the cop who goes above the laws requirements to get his "bad guy"? What if one day you find yourself being coined as the "bad guy"? What happened to the argument that by the very wording of the second ammendment that we have a right to bear arms...with ot without a piece of paper? Does it not work when YOUR ass is on the line?

 

[wally05]

I'm just saying, the reasoning for asking for a LTCH in a rifle sale is fallable. It's going beyond what the law requires for a rifle purchase. Do we appreciate the cop who goes above the laws requirements to get his "bad guy"? What if one day you find yourself being coined as the "bad guy"? What happened to the argument that by the very wording of the second ammendment that we have a right to bear arms...with ot without a piece of paper? Does it not work when YOUR ass is on the line?

What the hell are you talking about? We all have the right to pick and choose who we sell our personal possessions to. You have the right to go get that piece of paper if you really need what I have. I don't want to sell to a criminal, so I set that requirement myself.

 

[wally05]

I'm going to assume that those who require a LTCH to make a sale/purchase via the classifieds are in favor of "Universal Background Checks"?

...and before I get a bunch of sh*t for it, think it through. Most of you are arguing that you just want to make sure you are not selling to the "wrong" person, or that it just makes you feel more comfortable... that is, in essence, the erosion of our rights, from within.

The law currently states you are completely legal to sell to anyone as long as can reasonably assume they are legal, and an Indiana resident. Your feel-good policy of asking for a LTCH is basically the same as asking them to submit a 4473.

Once again, you're buying someone's personal property... I don't like selling my mustangs to people that I think are going to butcher them/hot rod them/whatever. I don't like selling guns to loonies or someone that for some reason, I think may use them for a bad purpose. My right to restrict that. Governmental restrictions and personal sale restrictions are not the same thing.

 

[wally05]

This is why I only use ingo for my FTF personal sales. Yes, you are right as there is little to no honor these days so I stay with this forum. It is also not all that difficult to size someone up during the negotiations.
That said....again, you are not responsible for anything done with the gun after you sell it just like a bat, car, bicycle etc. I understand the paranoia folks have with all of this but like I stated before, if that is the case do not sell the gun yourself. Use a LGS for this. Asking for my LTCH is not an option unless you have a badge and I am in the wrong.
Just because someone shows you the "Pink" does not mean they are a right person. Folks are getting suspended every day for stupidity.
We can argue this all day. A persons personal feelings are just that. I and many others think it is silly to do this for all the reasons I stated.

You seriously wouldn't have a problem with it if the dipstick that you sold a firearm to just used it to shoot and kill innocent people? Personally, I think if people took a little more responsibility for each other, half of the issues with violence we have today wouldn't be a problem. My

 

[Sgtusmc]

I'm not going to regurgitate all the points and counterpoints I've made over the past 10 pages. I'll say what I said in the opening post...I'm all for making sure weapons dont get in the hands of felons. You may very well choose to conduct business as you wish. The Indiana LTCH is not infallible to duping though and expecting a buyer to jump through unnneccesary hoops when maybe they only own a shotgun or a rifle in the first place is but an unsavory practice.

Carry on.

 

[Hwseeker]

Why is is a problem?

Requesting a LTCH to sell to a FTF purchaser is just another way to help Dnsure that the buyer is legit. If, GOD FORBID, something does go wrong, it gives the seller some comfort in knowing that he/she did some due diligence in trying to make the transaction a safe one. None of us can insure that the buyer will not do something stupid with the firearm. The same is the case with any purchase from a dealer. The bottom line is, IF YOU WANT THE OFFERED GUN, COMPLY WITH THE SELLER'S REQUEST.

 

[Hwseeker]

THat is...Why is it a problem?

Happy fingers....sorry!

 

[FirstTime]

Just go with instincts, 9 times out of 10 they are right.

 

[Bunnykid68]

Requesting a LTCH to sell to a FTF purchaser is just another way to help Dnsure that the buyer is legit. If, GOD FORBID, something does go wrong, it gives the seller some comfort in knowing that he/she did some due diligence in trying to make the transaction a safe one. None of us can insure that the buyer will not do something stupid with the firearm. The same is the case with any purchase from a dealer. The bottom line is, IF YOU WANT THE OFFERED GUN, COMPLY WITH THE SELLER'S REQUEST.

I have sold several firearms to members on this forum with nothing more than a firm handshake, if they do something illegal with it after that it would not have mattered if I had run a full background check on them.

If it makes some people feel better that is fine.

Although, I do worry about a couple fellas I met in Terrible Haute
You know who you are.

 

[Libertarian01]

To All,

I fully respect the free market and capitalism. People everywhere should have the right to engage in commerce that benefits both the buyer and the seller, employer and employee, provider and customer, etc.

For the past 100 years it is absolutely clear that society demands that all parties behave in an ethical manner. Whether we like this or not we must acknowledge the reality of the terrain in which we find ourselves operating.

Society didn't like mining companies paying employees in company script, so laws were passed to force the issue. Society didn't like workers loosing limbs in unsafe machines then being dumped on the street, so laws were put into effect to force the issue. Society didn't like snake oil salesmen selling fake products, so laws written to force the issue. Do we see a trend ladies and gentlemen???

My only point is this: I can hold to the pure ideal that I can sell to who I want when I want how I want without taking any action other than the pure exercise of capitalism OR I can self regulate and avoid a societal push to write laws from the outside.

I do not believe every transaction needs to take place in a gun store with a background check. I do believe more should be done than just an exchange of firearms (or anything extremely dangerous) for cash.

How much more (if any) is up to each one of us.

Regards,

Doug

 

[Miller Tyme]

I'm not going to regurgitate all the points and counterpoints I've made over the past 10 pages. I'll say what I said in the opening post...I'm all for making sure weapons dont get in the hands of felons. You may very well choose to conduct business as you wish. The Indiana LTCH is not infallible to duping though and expecting a buyer to jump through unnneccesary hoops when maybe they only own a shotgun or a rifle in the first place is but an unsavory practice.

Carry on.

And what you want has an even greater chance of letting a firearm fall into a felons hands. Now that might be OK by you, but I worked very hard for everything I own and in todays sue happy society I am going to do everything in my power to protect what I own and not risk it to accomadate your wishes to own MY gun.

Remember you can always buy from someone not requiring a LTCH

 

[Snavelybob]

New to this topic, I carry. Lifetime latch... I did it to prove to me and (the rest) I deserved it... I too served my country.. Navy sea bee ... Desert storm, it's your right of passage if you went civilian.. I'm not speaking for everyone, just myself