NFA items without a trust, when I DIE

dieselrealtor · Apr 2, 2024

I have been wishy washy about getting a trust & suppressors.

Now, @Aszerigan has made my life intensely more complicated with his "eight days" thread which seems to be intensely speedy for individuals..

My wife is not really into shooting like I am, I don't think she will really be interested in owning suppressors when I expire, 1 or 2 of my kids might but not a high enough interest level that I am planning for that.

I DON'T want to make things difficult for my heirs however, I was reading about a form 5 tax free transfer.

Do used suppressors have enough value to make it worth reselling them upon my demise?

NyleRN · Apr 2, 2024

dieselrealtor said:
I have been wishy washy about getting a trust & suppressors.

Now, @Aszerigan has made my life intensely more complicated with his "eight days" thread which seems to be intensely speedy for individuals..

My wife is not really into shooting like I am, I don't think she will really be interested in owning suppressors when I expire, 1 or 2 of my kids might but not a high enough interest level that I am planning for that.

I DON'T want to make things difficult for my heirs however, I was reading about a form 5 tax free transfer.

Do used suppressors have enough value to make it worth reselling them upon my demise?

Short answer, no.

Goodcat · Apr 2, 2024

Depends how many suppressors you have. 2-3? Not life changing. 10-15, SBRs and DDs, of course. Used suppressors don’t retain a ton of value. A ton of suppressors do. The legal side would be very stressful on them if you don’t do the trust. It’s not a cost and benefit analysis I think.

Aszerigan · Apr 2, 2024

dieselrealtor said:
Do used suppressors have enough value to make it worth reselling them upon my demise?

The honest answer is, with suppressors, that’s not a value situation at the end. If you don’t have family members that know what to do, the trust isn’t worth a hill of beans.

You can have your estate or probate executor file a form 5 to anyone you designate in your final wishes. No tax, just paperwork (from someone that knows how to file the right papers.)

Trusts used to have advantages. In my humble yet experienced opinion, they don’t anymore unless you plan on leaving NFA items with family and friends…. while you’re still alive.

Creedmoor · Apr 3, 2024

Aszerigan said:
The honest answer is, with suppressors, that’s not a value situation at the end. If you don’t have family members that know what to do, the trust isn’t worth a hill of beans.

You can have your estate or probate executor file a form 5 to anyone you designate in your final wishes. No tax, just paperwork (from someone that knows how to file the right papers.)

Trusts used to have advantages. In my humble yet experienced opinion, they don’t anymore unless you plan on leaving NFA items with family and friends…. while you’re still alive.

Agree, Andrew does know Cans!

The only plus is like me, I have children that also share the same hobbies.
All are soon to be Trustees on the Trusts, so all of us can buy, sell and use any cans on that trust. When I croak it just stays the same and I easily get removed from said Trust.
I just did two cans on a individual to see how fast they get done, hopefully they get done in 1/10th of the time so they can be used this summer.
Once stamps are done, I will do stamps again and put them on the can Trust.
All of our cans except rimfire were over a grand a piece, do the math.

Slow Hand · Apr 3, 2024

Used suppressors generally don’t have much resale value. I may be misinterpreting your line of thought, but the tax free From 5is to transfer to your heirs upon your death. Not to sell to someone else( as far as I know). Meaning yes, the cans will transfer for free to your wife, kids, favorite nephew, whoeve, but that person has to be laid out prior to your death. It’s not like your wife or kids can sell them and then transfer them free to the buyer somewhere down the line. The future buyer would still have to pay the $200. Unless by some miracle suppressors are deregulated by the time you shuffle off this mortal coil, then it’s a whole ‘nother ball game!
if you want one, I’d say buy it and enjoy it. If you get close to that time and nobody has any interest in it, leave a note saying something like “this item requires special paperwork, it’s easier to just hand it over to the police”.

cg21 · Apr 3, 2024

How old are the kids maybe dont count them out yet :dunno:

shootersix · Apr 3, 2024

I paid 150 for a suppressor from the estate of a friend who passed, it was a gemtech 22 caliber, a mutual friend is a lawyer with quite a few class 3 items himself handled the sale, my friend also had 1 machine gun, and an old Winchester trapper 14 in barrel I think, it was a rare bird.

The sale involved death certificate, letters from the estate lawyer, and all the other steps of a class 3 item (and of course the atf lost the death certificate and letters from the lawyer and they all had to be resent) but all in all, at that time it took about the same time as buying a new suppressor

My advice would be talk to a lawyer preferably with class 3 experience, since my friends estate had a lawyer who’s a gun guy, and has class 3 experience it made the whole experience pretty painless for both me and Bob’s estate

Aszerigan · Apr 3, 2024

Even if you don't leave notes in your will / trust / final wishes, the executor of your estate (or a court probate attorney) can transfer the suppressors to a family member tax free. No friends, neighbors or work buddies, only family. If any of the latter want the cans, they'd do a standard form 4 after the form 5s are approved.

WebSnyper · Apr 5, 2024

Slow Hand said:
Used suppressors generally don’t have much resale value. I may be misinterpreting your line of thought, but the tax free From 5is to transfer to your heirs upon your death. Not to sell to someone else( as far as I know). Meaning yes, the cans will transfer for free to your wife, kids, favorite nephew, whoeve, but that person has to be laid out prior to your death. It’s not like your wife or kids can sell them and then transfer them free to the buyer somewhere down the line. The future buyer would still have to pay the $200. Unless by some miracle suppressors are deregulated by the time you shuffle off this mortal coil, then it’s a whole ‘nother ball game!
if you want one, I’d say buy it and enjoy it. If you get close to that time and nobody has any interest in it, leave a note saying something like “this item requires special paperwork, it’s easier to just hand it over to the police”.

And rather than turn it over to the police, why wouldn't just "cut this up with a hack saw" work? I assume people die all the time and their nfa items are destroyed with out anyone coming looking?

SmolderOutdoors · Apr 5, 2024

Lots of good info here. I debated a trust but ultimately went individual for the fast approval times on my first can. (Can always stamp again someday if I decide to trust) While it might be a slight hassle after I hit my expiration date someday at least it can be done without tax stamps to family. Frankly I don’t trust anyone to be in possession of my can without me there so that benefit of a trust wasn’t very important to me.

WebSnyper · Apr 5, 2024

If my brother and my son lived in the state, I'd do a trust when I get my first suppressor and then my brother and I would probably add more items. Since we're so far apart geographically, there's not much every day benefit to it for me I don't think. I hope to be looking at getting a can soon.

SmolderOutdoors · Apr 5, 2024

WebSnyper said:
If my brother and my son lived in the state, I'd do a trust when I get my first suppressor and then my brother and I would probably add more items. Since we're so far apart geographically, there's not much every day benefit to it for me I don't think. I hope to be looking at getting a can soon.

Now is as good of time as any! Take advantage of these fast approvals on individual! It pushed me over the edge to buy my first!

dieselrealtor · Apr 5, 2024

WebSnyper said:
And rather than turn it over to the police, why wouldn't cut this up with a hack saw work? I assume people die all the time and their nfa items are destroyed with out anyone coming looking?

I have kind of wondered how many nfa items are running around still in the name of a deceased.

SmolderOutdoors · Apr 5, 2024

dieselrealtor said:
I have kind of wondered how many nfa items are running around still in the name of a deceased.

Wouldn’t want to get caught with one of those.

Slow Hand · Apr 6, 2024

WebSnyper said:
And rather than turn it over to the police, why wouldn't just "cut this up with a hack saw" work? I assume people die all the time and their nfa items are destroyed with out anyone coming looking?

I’m sure there are plenty of technically ‘unpapered’ C3 items floating around that were not properly transferred upon the owners death. I’m also sure the ATF rarely if ever goes looking for them. I guess my thought was that if you turned it over to the police or local ATF office, the decedents would have a paper trail showing proof they didn’t possess it anymore. Telling the government office who is famous for shooting dogs and women holding babies and burning down buildings full of women and children that you ‘cut it up and threw it away’ with out any proof seems iffy.

Slow Hand · Apr 6, 2024

And the above post was only meant to be snarky and insulting to the AFT, not any members of INGO!

TJ Kackowski · Apr 6, 2024

WebSnyper said:
If my brother and my son lived in the state, I'd do a trust when I get my first suppressor and then my brother and I would probably add more items. Since we're so far apart geographically, there's not much every day benefit to it for me I don't think. I hope to be looking at getting a can soon.

There is no geographical limit on a trust that I am aware of. If you, your brother, and son are named as trustees in the trust, any of you can add items to the trust simply by modifying the attached schedule and sharing copies with the other trustees.

Signing the original trust simply takes the time to mail to each other and have your signature notarized. There is the need to submit fingerprints by all trustees when applying for the tax stamp on a new item, but that's also easily accomplished.

The harder part would be keeping track of the current schedule, and possibly crossing state lines with your NFA items to share with each other. However, with items in different locations, it seems easier to just keep the items at each location and when you visit, you can take them out to use without the other being present ... you're a trustee, so the item is yours as much as theirs.

WebSnyper · Apr 6, 2024

TJ Kackowski said:
There is no geographical limit on a trust that I am aware of. If you, your brother, and son are named as trustees in the trust, any of you can add items to the trust simply by modifying the attached schedule and sharing copies with the other trustees.

Signing the original trust simply takes the time to mail to each other and have your signature notarized. There is the need to submit fingerprints by all trustees when applying for the tax stamp on a new item, but that's also easily accomplished.

The harder part would be keeping track of the current schedule, and possibly crossing state lines with your NFA items to share with each other. However, with items in different locations, it seems easier to just keep the items at each location and when you visit, you can take them out to use without the other being present ... you're a trustee, so the item is yours as much as theirs.

Understood, but the amount of sharing given 900 miles of distance would be pretty much nil. The coordination while not completely undoable by any means (we did some of that when dealing with some POA, and other trust stuff), would likely outweigh the overall benefit for us.

NFA items without a trust, when I DIE

The #1 community for Gun Owners in Indiana

Member Benefits:

Master

Master

From a place you cannot see…

Grandmaster

Grandmaster

Master

Master

Master

Grandmaster

Time to make the chimichangas

Plinker

Time to make the chimichangas

Plinker

Master

Plinker

Master

Master

Let it begin here.

Time to make the chimichangas

Log in

Site Supporter

Forum statistics