Serpa Derpa

[x10]

So here's a question to fire up this thread some more.

So does anybody that hates a serpa appendix carry ?

So it's bad to have a holster that the operator can't manipulate correctly but it's ok to point your gun at your femoral artery? And since this argument is based on outlying cases and speculation and assumptions.

If i had a choice on which body part to put at risk and it's between the outside of my leg vs. pointing at an artery that will let you down after about 4 or 5 heartbeats.

 

[devildog70]

I dont put total weight in opinions made by those who are bribed or paid to render them

Can you back any of that assertion up with factual examples? FLETC wasn't bribed or paid. Nor were any of the other departments I know of who ban them, or strongly recommend against them. I know several of the major instructors who ban them personally, and none of them were bribed or paid. Many of them have been preaching against the SERPA since its release, and many of them were still carrying other Blackhawk items at that time. I highly doubt any of the military units that ban the holster were bribed or paid either.

So...who is/was bribed or paid?

 

[devildog70]

So here's a question to fire up this thread some more.

So does anybody that hates a serpa appendix carry ?

So it's bad to have a holster that the operator can't manipulate correctly but it's ok to point your gun at your femoral artery? And since this argument is based on outlying cases and speculation and assumptions.

If i had a choice on which body part to put at risk and it's between the outside of my leg vs. pointing at an artery that will let you down after about 4 or 5 heartbeats.

Have you read the FLETC holster study? It's pretty clear on why the SERPA is a poor design for duty carry. Mainly because of the propensity to cause cascading failures. Appendix carry doesn't do that.

 

[chezuki]

So here's a question to fire up this thread some more.

So does anybody that hates a serpa appendix carry ?

So it's bad to have a holster that the operator can't manipulate correctly but it's ok to point your gun at your femoral artery? And since this argument is based on outlying cases and speculation and assumptions.

If i had a choice on which body part to put at risk and it's between the outside of my leg vs. pointing at an artery that will let you down after about 4 or 5 heartbeats.

Yep. I hate Serpas and I carry AIWB. A holstered pistol isn’t pointed at anything... it’s holstered.

 

[Vigilant]

Can you back any of that assertion up with factual examples? FLETC wasn't bribed or paid. Nor were any of the other departments I know of who ban them, or strongly recommend against them. I know several of the major instructors who ban them personally, and none of them were bribed or paid. Many of them have been preaching against the SERPA since its release, and many of them were still carrying other Blackhawk items at that time. I highly doubt any of the military units that ban the holster were bribed or paid either.

So...who is/was bribed or paid?

What military units are banning them? The reason they are so popular, is that they are sooo cheap, and dumped by the thousands into the AAFES system. Then John Q. Public sees little Joe kicking’ doors in DurkaDirkastan whilst wearing that piece of ****, and says hey I kin glitz that at the walmarts for $20, gud enuf for the SSDGs, gud enuf fer me.

 

[Vigilant]

Yep. I hate Serpas and I carry AIWB. A holstered pistol isn’t pointed at anything... it’s holstered.

Same here.

 

[churchmouse]

What military units are banning them? The reason they are so popular, is that they are sooo cheap, and dumped by the thousands into the AAFES system. Then John Q. Public sees little Joe kicking’ doors in DurkaDirkastan whilst wearing that piece of ****, and says hey I kin glitz that at the walmarts for $20, gud enuf for the SSDGs, gud enuf fer me.

So now I am John Q. glitzing onda cheep........

 

[Mongo59]

Here's an idea: Get a 5ft piece of chain, attach a 10in square chunk of concrete on one end and the other end to your belt. Drag it around with you wherever you go.

When someone asks you what it is for just tell them it is the self designed safety cocoon for your side arm that is 100% tamper resistant.

If they ask, "aren't you concerned about being able to actually fire the weapon?" You simply answer, "Why? It was clean and functioning when I put it in there..."

 

[devildog70]

What military units are banning them? The reason they are so popular, is that they are sooo cheap, and dumped by the thousands into the AAFES system. Then John Q. Public sees little Joe kicking’ doors in DurkaDirkastan whilst wearing that piece of ****, and says hey I kin glitz that at the walmarts for $20, gud enuf for the SSDGs, gud enuf fer me.

They are banned at the unit-level in at least a couple SOCOM units, with limited exceptions.

 

[Vigilant]

So now I am John Q. glitzing onda cheep........

I guess if you got it at the walmarts after watching little Joe winning hearts and minds you are, otherwise I’ll chock it up to old age and poor choices!

 

[BlaineBug]

Manual safeties have no business on a defensive handgun.

I have never heard of any Glock that did not have the trigger safety. Glock's trigger safety has been copied and used by Smith & Wesson, Springfield, Ruger, and I'm sure many other manufacturers. It has nothing to do with importation laws.

Just because you don't understand how it works, or why it was invented, doesn't make it a bad feature. It is a very effective safety feature. Had the Sig P320 had a trigger safety, the whole firing when dropped ordeal wouldn't have been an issue.

What about a firing pin block that wouldn't allow the firing pin to reach a cartridge unless the trigger was pulled? Or did the P320 have such a light trigger pull that it could make a full motion sweep if it was dropped due to inertia?

 

[cbhausen]

That is not what he is saying. It still takes some motor skill to bring an AR to bear and fire it. Manual safety in this regard. There is a dance here as well.

Jeesh people G****s have flaws. He listed a litany of articles on this very fact. They are made by people. Nothing man made is perfect even a freaking G**** for cripes sake.

Not a direct stab at you CB just an example of platform defense. G****s Serpas etc. We all do this dance.

Sorry if it came off that way. I never took it as a direct shot at me. I do think Glocks are perfectly safe as long as you pay attention to what you’re doing. But you should be doing that with any gun.

 

[churchmouse]

Sorry if it came off that way. I never took it as a direct shot at me. I do think Glocks are perfectly safe as long as you pay attention to what you’re doing. But you should be doing that with any gun.

No direct stab at you. Glad you called and we could discuss it.

My point is we all defend our decisions/positions to a point. I am guilty of this as are we all to a point. I will say my mind/opinion has been altered/changed multiple times by this forum. My learning curve has gone vertical. I learn from this and many other interactions. What I do with that knowledge varies.
I am looking at the 3rd option offered up in here. The ALS thing just will not work for me.

 

[lovemachine]

So here's a question to fire up this thread some more.

So does anybody that hates a serpa appendix carry ?

So it's bad to have a holster that the operator can't manipulate correctly but it's ok to point your gun at your femoral artery? And since this argument is based on outlying cases and speculation and assumptions.

If i had a choice on which body part to put at risk and it's between the outside of my leg vs. pointing at an artery that will let you down after about 4 or 5 heartbeats.

My machine of love is nestled against my Glock 19 in a NSR Appendix Holster as I type this.

 

[CPT Nervous]

What about a firing pin block that wouldn't allow the firing pin to reach a cartridge unless the trigger was pulled? Or did the P320 have such a light trigger pull that it could make a full motion sweep if it was dropped due to inertia?

It has a firing pin block. The light trigger pull, paired with a physically heavy trigger, made it possible that when dropped at the right angle, the trigger would actually depress due to inertia. They made the trigger lighter so it doesn't do that now. A Glock style trigger safety would have prevented that.

I have three P320's now and I love them. I was initially skeptical because of the problems they had, but after the recall, they're fantastic firearms.

 

[seedubs1]

Yep. I hate Serpas and I carry AIWB. A holstered pistol isn’t pointed at anything... it’s holstered.

If you say so.....But it sure looks like it's pointed right at your femoral artery. Whole bunch of nope for me.

 

[seedubs1]

The ALS thing just will not work for me.

Check out Red Hill Tactical. They have a retention holster that may work for you as well. Spendy, but looks pretty nice. No full locking like a Serpa or Safariland, but it's got a push lever activated hood and comp. cut.

 

[BlaineBug]

It has a firing pin block. The light trigger pull, paired with a physically heavy trigger, made it possible that when dropped at the right angle, the trigger would actually depress due to inertia. They made the trigger lighter so it doesn't do that now. A Glock style trigger safety would have prevented that.

I have three P320's now and I love them. I was initially skeptical because of the problems they had, but after the recall, they're fantastic firearms.

That's good to know. But, was the argument in regards to a trigger mounted safety versus no safety at all? With a slide or frame mounted safety, the gun would still have no possible way of firing at all when the safety is engaged, even if dropped.

I do believe that the safer safety is a slide or frame mounted safety. When it is engaged you are lock and stock assured that a trigger pull won't fire the bullet. With the Glock style trigger safety, it fires no matter what unless a round is not chambered.

Personal preference. Plenty of older firearms have no trigger disconnecting safety, and neither do revolvers. Doesn't stop anybody from carrying them either.

 

[Ddillard]

I have several serpa holsters and I will keep them. I love the system. We all have our opinions.

 

[CPT Nervous]

That's good to know. But, was the argument in regards to a trigger mounted safety versus no safety at all? With a slide or frame mounted safety, the gun would still have no possible way of firing at all when the safety is engaged, even if dropped.

I do believe that the safer safety is a slide or frame mounted safety. When it is engaged you are lock and stock assured that a trigger pull won't fire the bullet. With the Glock style trigger safety, it fires no matter what unless a round is not chambered.


Personal preference. Plenty of older firearms have no trigger disconnecting safety, and neither do revolvers. Doesn't stop anybody from carrying them either.

As I stated before, manual safeties have no business on a defensive handgun.

But you carry what you're comfortable with.