more smelting questions

[hornadylnl]

I just tried my hand at smelting wheel weights for the first time today. I bought some cheap (this is probably the biggest problem) from wallyworld to use as ingot molds. I read that some people use them instead of Lee, Lyman, or RCBS ingot molds. I poured the first two pans and can't get them to release at all. The cheap cups break right out of the pan. I literally have to peel the cups off of the ingots in pieces. Should the ingots be that hard to get out of the molds?

 

[CarmelHP]

I've never done it, but isn't there a mold release spray sold for this purpose? It's kind of a spray on powder that prevents a bond with the mold.

 

[ntrngr]

BEWARE! Using wheel weights as part of your bullet alloys can cause problems. Antimony (if thats what a big part of the WW allow is) tends to "mix" with lead/tin alloys instead of forming a true molecular bond. I've had big trouble with the antimony causing massive leading problems.

I've often wondered if a guy could make some type of heavy fire clay ingot molds. I should try it.

 

[fireball168]

I suspect you're thinking of Zinc, not antimony.


Muffin pans work fine for casting ingots - is that what you're using?

 

[Fishersjohn48]

Dang it, I thought we were going to go to catch those tasty little fish that are so good in beer batter.

 

[Slow Hand]

I had the same thing happen with cheap muffin tins as well. i think the coating was so crappy that the lead kind of soldered itself to the tins. I've heard some folks use the cast iron moulds that cook corncob shaped cornbread. I bought a Lee aluminum ingot mould several years ago. It's pretty cheap and well worth it. I use a bottom pour pot and bigger ingots like those made from muffin tins will not fit in my pot. The Lee ingots are a little smaller than a Twinkie and I can fit then in on either side of the rod as my allow starts to get low.

Doug K

 

[jclark]

if there is a plumbing supply house near you, they sell 5 pound ingots very reasonably.

 

[Slow Hand]

if there is a plumbing supply house near you, they sell 5 pound ingots very reasonably.

Last year when we took our test to get our plumbing licenses, the guys who had to buy their lead fo tthte lead joing said it was around $35 for a 5lb muffin! I about crapped when they said it was that high! Haven't checked lately, but I just lucked into about 700 lbs of pure lead, so I'm set ofr a few summers of shooting!

Doug K

 

[hornadylnl]

Yes, I think it was some sort of coating on the pans. They weren't teflon coated though. I literally had all the side peeled off the cup but still had to peel the bottom off of the ingot. It acted like it was welded to the cup. I'll just have to order a few ingot molds. I thought about getting some of the release spray but hadn't seen anyone say whether they had used it so I figured it was non essential. Plus, I think it was $10 for a can of it.

 

[Old Syko]

Anti spatter spray from any welding supply allows the use of non-coated muffin tins and a can goes a long way. You now know why ingot molds are cast iron.

ntrngr, I've no idea what you are referring to but it certainly isn't antimony. The proper amount of antimony is a necessity for all casting needs other than muzzle loader use. Too much antimony will not cause leading. Antimony is very abrasive and if not blended properly will cause accelerated barrel wear. Too many people employ improper fluxing methods that cause them to rake off the antimony along with the contaminants such as dirt and WW clips. This should be avoided like the plague in order to retain the antimony.

Slow Hand, that 700# of pure lead is going to get rather expensive to turn into alloy unless you plan to use it all for front stuffer material. Tin, antimony, and other components used to form a good alloy are serious money these days. That is why I'm just setting on a few hundred pounds of plumbers lead myself.

 

[Slow Hand]

Slow Hand, that 700# of pure lead is going to get rather expensive to turn into alloy unless you plan to use it all for front stuffer material. Tin, antimony, and other components used to form a good alloy are serious money these days. That is why I'm just setting on a few hundred pounds of plumbers lead myself.

I've got several rolls of 95-5 solder and can get my hands on plenty more as time goes by. Most of what I shoot works fine with a good 20:1 mix and a roll (1 pound) of solder mixed wtih 20lbs of pure lead does the trick. Works well for .38's and light .357's, .45acp and Colt rounds; the majority of my shooting.

Doug K

 

[ntrngr]

Anti spatter spray from any welding supply allows the use of non-coated muffin tins and a can goes a long way. You now know why ingot molds are cast iron.

ntrngr, I've no idea what you are referring to but it certainly isn't antimony. The proper amount of antimony is a necessity for all casting needs other than muzzle loader use. Too much antimony will not cause leading. Antimony is very abrasive and if not blended properly will cause accelerated barrel wear. Too many people employ improper fluxing methods that cause them to rake off the antimony along with the contaminants such as dirt and WW clips. This should be avoided like the plague in order to retain the antimony.

Slow Hand, that 700# of pure lead is going to get rather expensive to turn into alloy unless you plan to use it all for front stuffer material. Tin, antimony, and other components used to form a good alloy are serious money these days. That is why I'm just setting on a few hundred pounds of plumbers lead myself.

"The proper amount" is the key. If you try to just use antimony to harden the lead without the use of tin it will lead the barrel as bad as 40:1. But, add some tin in with it and you can get a fine alloy. In fact, you can make a 20:1 mix with lead and tin then ad antimony to get it down to 12:1 or even 8:1 but you've gotta have that tin.

Maybe the abrasive quality of the antimony is what causes the leading when you push it. But, all the metalurgy says that the molecular structure exposes the lead making it like pure lead in some ways even though your hardness tester will show its 12:1. Either way, just make sure you use enough tin before you start dumping the wheel weights in.

The cast iron cornbread cookers work great! I've used tin cans, old aluminum drinking cups, muffin tins even small aluminum pans.

Yard sale season is upon us! So, its time to go out and get those ingot molds cheap!