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Monroe County Sheriff R. Lutz -1
- Thread starter japartridge
- Start date
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Mostly I had mentioned FOIA because it had been suggested to me by an attorney that if they didn't seem to want to provide a copy that, that would be the avenue to pursue.
Either way, it will be interesting to look into in the coming week.
Either way, it will be interesting to look into in the coming week.
Annie Oakley
Sharpshooter
Let me see what I can find out.....it seems that getting them to put policies in writing has been somewhat problematic in the past. Will get back to this as soon as I can. Should know something by tomorrow.
japartridge
Master
Update - Heard from Chief Deputy Pershing on Friday
All, I heard from Chief Dep. Pershing on Friday evening...
He stated that he had not received my complaint, and that he had asked all of his people if they had seen it/received it. Of course they all said no. I assured him that I have a copy that will be delivered in person, and also by registered mail.
Regardless, I relayed a brief summary of what had happened. He stated that he would have handled it differently. He at no point said/admitted that Officer Lutz was in the wrong. He did state that the 13th of June is Officer Lutz's last day on the force, as he is retiring and will not be coming back to the force, and is moving to somewhere in Northern IN. I then recieved a round about lecture on open carrying and that it scares people... I again, as I did in my encounter with Officer Lutz, stated that I was sorry if people were scared of someone exercising their legal protected right. He also informed me that it was the officers right to ask for someone's ID and LTCH (of course he kept saying permit...) I choose not to argue that it was also my right to refuse. Deputy Pershing also stated that he has on numerous occasions walked up behind someone who was openly carrying and put his hand on the butt of thier pistol and asked them to see there LTCH!! I couldn't believe that he would do this, but there it is.
Deputy Pershing also informed me that the Sheriff and he have made it policy that none of their officers are allowed to OC while off-duty. He stated that it makes people too un-easy. After another 5 minutes or so of being lectured about OC, I cut the rest of the call short, as I had things to do, and there was a mutual understanding that him telling me that OC was "a bad idea" and me not going to change my thoughts on it, was getting either of us anywhere. He did say that he would take the complaint and put it in Officer Lutz's file, but that there really wasn't anything to be done, as he was leaving soon. I'm not exactly happy with this answer, and I plan on contacting the Sheriff at some point in the near future about it.
All in all, it was about as much as I expected. I am a little surprised that they even bothered to call me back.
All, I heard from Chief Dep. Pershing on Friday evening...
He stated that he had not received my complaint, and that he had asked all of his people if they had seen it/received it. Of course they all said no. I assured him that I have a copy that will be delivered in person, and also by registered mail.
Regardless, I relayed a brief summary of what had happened. He stated that he would have handled it differently. He at no point said/admitted that Officer Lutz was in the wrong. He did state that the 13th of June is Officer Lutz's last day on the force, as he is retiring and will not be coming back to the force, and is moving to somewhere in Northern IN. I then recieved a round about lecture on open carrying and that it scares people... I again, as I did in my encounter with Officer Lutz, stated that I was sorry if people were scared of someone exercising their legal protected right. He also informed me that it was the officers right to ask for someone's ID and LTCH (of course he kept saying permit...) I choose not to argue that it was also my right to refuse. Deputy Pershing also stated that he has on numerous occasions walked up behind someone who was openly carrying and put his hand on the butt of thier pistol and asked them to see there LTCH!! I couldn't believe that he would do this, but there it is.
Deputy Pershing also informed me that the Sheriff and he have made it policy that none of their officers are allowed to OC while off-duty. He stated that it makes people too un-easy. After another 5 minutes or so of being lectured about OC, I cut the rest of the call short, as I had things to do, and there was a mutual understanding that him telling me that OC was "a bad idea" and me not going to change my thoughts on it, was getting either of us anywhere. He did say that he would take the complaint and put it in Officer Lutz's file, but that there really wasn't anything to be done, as he was leaving soon. I'm not exactly happy with this answer, and I plan on contacting the Sheriff at some point in the near future about it.
All in all, it was about as much as I expected. I am a little surprised that they even bothered to call me back.
I used to live in Bloomington and that's the thing I hate about it, a bunch of raging liberals. I can see that the people at Walmart would be afraid, even if the gun was a water gun, that's how Bloomington is. I have open carried there and always get nasty looks. I have, however, seen off duty officers carry there and OC at that. That's one place where the LE are arrogant, pumpous, male anatomies. They think they own the place and that's because the people let them think that.
I was called on one time because I went to the Office Lounge and I apparently matched the description of the guy that raped a black woman from Brown county, in Bloomington. I hadn't done a thing and had been there for about 10 minutes and next thing I know, I am approached by two officers in uniform. I asked what it was about and they refused to tell me. They're asking for ID, where I live, how long I had lived there, and more. I wasn't CC'ing at the time, but I had a pocket knife on me. They asked about weapons and I told them about that. They took it until it was all over. They kept it and my ID until the last minute or so. Not until they'd ran all their checks, did they give me my things back and tell me what it was all about.
Now let me ask you this- what kind of law enforcement takes the word of someone calling in from a bar, as to whether someone is a rapist or not? That's not to say all bar patrons are drunks, but seriously. If I was LE, i'd be using some serious common sense on that one. What pissed off liberal woman that I so much as looked at wrong, wouldn't call the police?
Beautiful town, but the people, the politicians, and the LE are all power hungry rights destroyers hell bent on making everyone know that they own the town and will force you out one way or another, if you don't love their tree hugging ways.
I was called on one time because I went to the Office Lounge and I apparently matched the description of the guy that raped a black woman from Brown county, in Bloomington. I hadn't done a thing and had been there for about 10 minutes and next thing I know, I am approached by two officers in uniform. I asked what it was about and they refused to tell me. They're asking for ID, where I live, how long I had lived there, and more. I wasn't CC'ing at the time, but I had a pocket knife on me. They asked about weapons and I told them about that. They took it until it was all over. They kept it and my ID until the last minute or so. Not until they'd ran all their checks, did they give me my things back and tell me what it was all about.
Now let me ask you this- what kind of law enforcement takes the word of someone calling in from a bar, as to whether someone is a rapist or not? That's not to say all bar patrons are drunks, but seriously. If I was LE, i'd be using some serious common sense on that one. What pissed off liberal woman that I so much as looked at wrong, wouldn't call the police?
Beautiful town, but the people, the politicians, and the LE are all power hungry rights destroyers hell bent on making everyone know that they own the town and will force you out one way or another, if you don't love their tree hugging ways.
Sounds like the "esteemed" Officer Lutz is getting his "power fix" in before retirement, because after that he just becomes a "commoner" like the rest of us.
(Purple? You decide.)
japartridge
Master
japartridge
Master
No, I do not believe purple is needed in this case!
Titanium_Frost
Grandmaster
That update just turned my stomach a little. If it were I that the sheriff told that to I would have informed him just how closely he was to violating Indiana law on the subject of rules and policies against firearms.
I wish you well in getting some sort of satisfaction but it is unlikely at this point because his department id obviously just making excuses for him.
I wish you well in getting some sort of satisfaction but it is unlikely at this point because his department id obviously just making excuses for him.
Wow, It sounds like your encounter with Deputy Lutz was a piece of cake compared to the attitude stated by Chief Deputy Pershing. 
What is the deal with a number of these LEO types walking up behind OC'ers and putting their hands on their firearms?
What is the deal with a number of these LEO types walking up behind OC'ers and putting their hands on their firearms?
...What is the deal with a number of these LEO types walking up behind OC'ers and putting their hands on their firearms?
It would seem that they have been spared the hospitalization and personal embarrassment that such an ignorant action clearly warrants.
Or perhaps they aren't as sneaky as they think and the carriers had already identified them as officers during their approach.
So here's a question for ya'll...
Someone comes up behind you and put their hand on your OC weapon. Most of us would like to say that the person would soon be beaten within an inch of their life, but...
Would this be considered assault? Attempted theft? What? And would you be justified in beating them with their own arm?
What if a LEO did it? Would that now be an assault on a police officer on your part?
This is incredible! Sneaking up behind someone and touching the gun? That is absolutely insane. And this guy was bragging about it?
It is apparent that this entire department is in need of some education and pronto, before one of their own gets hurt, or worse.
Promoting illegal policy and acting in an irrational manner with no regard to their own, or the law abiding citizens safety is not only irresponsible, it's dangerous.
It is apparent that this entire department is in need of some education and pronto, before one of their own gets hurt, or worse.
Promoting illegal policy and acting in an irrational manner with no regard to their own, or the law abiding citizens safety is not only irresponsible, it's dangerous.
I don't care what they ended up being charged with, they are a threat to me and I will use whatever reasonable force is necessary to stop the threat.
I also wouldn't care what I'm charged with after the fact. If they have not identified themselves as an officer, they are to be treated just as any other threat would be by a reasonable person such as myself.
chickenman
Marksman
japartridge
Master
Huh?This Sheriff Dept. is a relaxed Sheriff Dept. has they come.
Man, I am SO GLAD I picked the RIGHT university town to live in. I have YET to be bothered by any LEO's. I did have one walk up and ask me how I liked the S&W MP. Told him I loved it. He was curious about it, told him he is welcome anytime to shoot it at Applied Ballistics, just give me a shout. He has yet to take me up on it.
