HR 2749 Passed: Totalitarian Control of Food Supply

[SavageEagle]

I assume you were responding to me.

I wasn't excusing anything. I oppose this legislation as much as anyone. I would, however, like to see it opposed for factual reasons. And there's no shortage of those with a horrendous bill like this!

Oh, I understand what you're saying, but there seem to be provisions of the bill that do apply to home growers and canners.

I'll go back and read the bill later. Right now I'm working myself up to a heart attack at 27 watching the "Town Hall" with the "Idiot".

 

[jennybird]

What are they going to do about it though? Non-violent Amish people don't even protest.

I thought the Amish were exempt from our laws as they see fit (e.g. paying taxes) for "religious" reasons. no?

 

[mettle]

This, in effect, will complete the financial and markets take-over by the government; giving it complete control of the country. It will not need to strip gun rights, or collect guns, all it has to do is starve the masses into compliance.

Watch and see...

This will be a non-physical, non-combat takeover of a country by another country; I am just interested to see which actual country over the seas is actually behind it.

 

[SavageEagle]

I thought the Amish were exempt from our laws as they see fit (e.g. paying taxes) for "religious" reasons. no?

I do believe you're right. I'll have to look that up...

 

[Thumper]

If this is about food will it take away hunting?

 

[SavageEagle]

I didn't see a provision for that, but you can look up the bill and look through it.

 

[agentl074]

What are they going to do about it though? Non-violent Amish people don't even protest.

LOL true

 

[Rob377]

oh geez. More hyperventilating histrionics from infowars. Good grief.


Most of the stuff is completely misstated (which is why infowars won't give you a pin cite to the actual provision it's referring to, because they're full of manure in most cases)

Search Results - THOMAS (Library of Congress)



This a classic example of "overstating the case"
When you use hyperventilating histrionics like this that grossly exaggerate your case, it destroys any credibility you might have.


Does the bill call for the creation of "Martial Law Manure" to go along with the "martial law bridges"?

It's a stupid bill, sure, but an evil totalitarian plot for enslaving the populace it ain't. There are very good treatments for paranoid schizophrenia available these days.

 

[SavageEagle]

I don't believe it's the plot to enslave us, but any time the government oversteps their bounds, that's EXACTLY what it is. Do you smoke pot? Whether you WOULD or not, you don't because it's illegal. Do you own a full auto AK without a tax stamp? No, because it's illegal. Do you pay Income or Property Tax? Of Course you do.

All that is enslavement. Pure and evil. This bill is just another choke hold on the People it has no right to do.

 

[agentl074]

I don't believe it's the plot to enslave us, but any time the government oversteps their bounds, that's EXACTLY what it is. Do you smoke pot? Whether you WOULD or not, you don't because it's illegal. Do you own a full auto AK without a tax stamp? No, because it's illegal. Do you pay Income or Property Tax? Of Course you do.

All that is enslavement. Pure and evil. This bill is just another choke hold on the People it has no right to do.

This is true. Whether you exaggerate, inflate or spin the facts... govt. control is still control.

 

[Rob377]

* HR 2749 would give FDA the power to order a quarantine of a geographic area, including “prohibiting or restricting the movement of food or of any vehicle being used or that has been used to transport or hold such food within the geographic area.” [This - "that has been used to transport or hold such food" - would mean all cars that have ever brought groceries home so this means ALL TRANSPORTATION can be shut down under this. This is using food as a cover for martial law.] Under this provision, farmers markets and local food sources could be shut down, even if they are not the source of the contamination. The agency can halt all movement of all food in a geographic area. [This is also a means of total control over the population under the cover of food, and at any time.]

well, actually, no. This is a lie, and a rather blatant one at that.

(i) Authority to Prohibit or Restrict the Movement of Food Within a State or Portion of a State-
`(1) AUTHORITY TO PROHIBIT OR RESTRICT THE MOVEMENT OF FOOD-
`(A) IN GENERAL-
`(i) After consultation with the Governor or other appropriate official of an affected State, if the Secretary determines that there is credible evidence that an article of food presents an imminent threat of serious adverse health consequences or death to humans or animals, the Secretary may prohibit or restrict the movement of an article of food within a State or portion of a State for which the Secretary has credible evidence that such food is located within, or originated from, such State or portion thereof.
`(ii) In carrying out clause (i), the Secretary may prohibit or restrict the movement within a State or portion of a State of any article of food or means of conveyance of such article of food, if the Secretary determines that the prohibition or restriction is a necessary protection from an imminent threat of serious adverse health consequences or death to humans or animals.
(2) NOTIFICATION PROCEDURES- Subject to paragraph (3), before any action is taken in a State under this subsection, the Secretary shall--
`(A) notify the Governor or other appropriate official of the State affected by the proposed action;
`(B) issue a public announcement of the proposed action; and
`(C) publish in the Federal Register--
`(i) the findings of the Secretary that support the proposed action;
`(ii) a statement of the reasons for the proposed action; and
`(iii) a description of the proposed action, including--
`(I) the area affected; and
`(II) an estimate of the anticipated duration of the action.
`(3) NOTICE AFTER ACTION- If it is not practicable to publish in the Federal Register the information required under paragraph (2)(C) before taking action under paragraph (1), the Secretary shall publish the information as soon as practicable, but not later than 10 business days, after commencement of the action.
`(4) APPLICATION OF LEAST DRASTIC ACTION- No action shall be taken under paragraph (1) unless, in the opinion of the Secretary, there is no less drastic action that is feasible and that would be adequate to prevent the imminent threat of serious adverse health consequences or death to humans or animals.
`(5) NONDELEGATION- An action under paragraph (1) may only be ordered by the Secretary or an official designated by the Secretary. An official may not be so designated unless the official is the Commissioner of Food and Drugs or the Principal Deputy Commissioner.
`(6) DURATION- Fourteen days after the initiation of an action under paragraph (1), and each 14 days thereafter, if the Secretary determines that it is necessary to continue the action, the Secretary shall--
`(A) notify the Governor or other appropriate official of the State affected of the continuation of the action;
`(B) issue a public announcement of the continuation of the action; and
`(C) publish in the Federal Register the findings of the Secretary that support the continuation of the action, including an estimate of the anticipated duration of the action.
`(7) RULEMAKING- The Secretary shall, consistent with national security interests and as appropriate for known hazards, establish by regulation standards for conducting actions under paragraph (1), including, as appropriate, sanitation standards and procedures to restore any affected equipment or means of conveyance to its status prior to an action under paragraph (1).'.

Not "all food" not "all vehicles"

The legalese is clear. For example, if mad cow shows up, they can shut down beef and trucks used to haul beef. Thats it, and only for a limited time. That's not Martial law, or totalitarian enslavement, thats just good common sense.

And now that you mention it, I do feel totally enslaved because I can't down a pint of Vodka and go for a joy ride legally. I might as well put on chains because I can't legally sell contaminated food. Call me Kunta Kinte because I have to maintain records about the food I sell to distributors who in turn sell to consumers, because dangit, they might hold me responsible if it's diseased. They might as well be whipping me with that kind of enslavement! Dang Gov't Control!

 

[SavageEagle]

Look, most of us already said we don't believe infowars so I'm not sure why you keep arguing with no one. Oh wait. You said vodka. Well my friend, allow me to get a shot of my Hennessy and take a shot with you....

Here's to the fall of tyranny. May it come swift and soon.

 

[Rob377]

Look, most of us already said we don't believe infowars so I'm not sure why you keep arguing with no one. Oh wait. You said vodka. Well my friend, allow me to get a shot of my Hennessy and take a shot with you....

Here's to the fall of tyranny. May it come swift and soon.

I will certainly drink to that!

 

[SavageEagle]

Allow me to argue just one point of your last post before the above one...

I might as well put on chains because I can't legally sell contaminated food. Call me Kunta Kinte because I have to maintain records about the food I sell to distributors who in turn sell to consumers, because dangit, they might hold me responsible if it's diseased.

That is what the free market is for. If you sold contaminated food or diseased food, people would just not buy your product any longer and undoubtedly put you out of business. Which in turn would give another individual a chance in the market. Isn't the Free Market a thing of beauty?

 

[Rob377]

Allow me to argue just one point of your last post before the above one...



That is what the free market is for. If you sold contaminated food or diseased food, people would just not buy your product any longer and undoubtedly put you out of business. Which in turn would give another individual a chance in the market. Isn't the Free Market a thing of beauty?

With perfectly efficient markets with omniscient rational actors which only exist in theory, sure. In the real world, not so much. It's cheaper, more efficient, and doesn't require anyone to die to have basic regulations beforehand. As even Friedman of Hayek understand, perfectly efficient markets with omniscient actors don't actually exist. (for points from the former, see Capitalism and Freedom, and the latter The Road to Serfdom) (as a free market advocate, you should probably be familiar with these authors/theorists) Without those premises being valid, the anarcho-capitalist model falls apart. Trying to impose an unrealistic, dumbed down model based on simplistic, invalid premises of perfect efficiency and omniscience on reality isn't a thing of beauty. It is however, a thing of ridicule.

Like the joke about economists goes, assume a can opener.

 

[Rob377]

I should also point out that regulation on food content and labeling is perfectly acceptable in a libertarian regime, wherein the gov't's only role is to prevent one party from taking another's property or liberty by "force and fraud." The selling of contaminated food and drugs to others is clearly with the scope of the latter. By fraudulently selling food/drugs that are not what they claim them to be, they have violated that basic principle and are rightly held to be criminals.

 

[SavageEagle]

I should also point out that regulation on food content and labeling is perfectly acceptable in a libertarian regime, wherein the gov't's only role is to prevent one party from taking another's property or liberty by "force and fraud." The selling of contaminated food and drugs to others is clearly with the scope of the latter.

It would be nice if the agency handling this would only go this far. Unfortunately, the FDA is one of the most corrupt and "bought" agencies in the American Empire and unilaterally controls everything we eat drink and take as medicine. You can't even claim a healing plant cures a disease that it cures or you go to jail and get fined a minimum of $1mil.

So how's that FDA working out for ya?

 

[Rob377]

It would be nice if the agency handling this would only go this far. Unfortunately, the FDA is one of the most corrupt and "bought" agencies in the American Empire and unilaterally controls everything we eat drink and take as medicine. You can't even claim a healing plant cures a disease that it cures or you go to jail and get fined a minimum of $1mil.

So how's that FDA working out for ya?

that's because more often that not, the supposed "healing plant" is straight up quackery. Such fraudsters should be put in jail, under the no force no fraud principle.
(I'm assuming you've read On Liberty by JS Mill, a must read for any liberty loving person)

Moreover, you exagerating the level of control they have. If you believe the plant cures some disease, you can take it. The FDA doesn't control what you can take or not take, they just have regulations against fraudulent advertising.
The non-regulated supplement industry rakes in billions and billions every year selling crap that doesn't work. (Acai berry anyone? Oprah likes it

You don't see a problem with quacks selling snake oil under fraudulent pretenses?

 

[Rob377]

Look at this, did you know dandelions cure cancer?

Dandelion Root Cancer Cure? At No Cost!

Those FDA bastards would prevent this guy from making this claim? Totalitarianism, I tell ya.

 

[SavageEagle]

Look at this, did you know dandelions cure cancer?

Dandelion Root Cancer Cure? At No Cost!

Those FDA bastards would prevent this guy from making this claim? Totalitarianism, I tell ya.

You don't get it. They take money from companies to market their drug which is more harmful than the disease it treats. They had cures for diseases long before they released them because they knew they could get rich treating an ailment instead of curing it. They encourage you to take all these drugs and medicines for things that need no medicine. In turn you end up with other problems after taking said medicine. I take little to no medicine for anything. Flu, Colds, never get headaches (ever, except for brain freeze ), I had a kidney stone when I was younger and the ONLY thing I took for it was Cannibus and had far less pain before I passed it than most people, I just don't take medicines unless I'm dying. And guess what. I don't get sick.

My kids can pass something back and forth through our house multipule times and I can interact with them constantly and never catch what they have. Strept Throat, colds, flu, nothing. I've had chicken pox, but when my mother got shingles, which is highly conteigous I'm told, I didn't catch it.

And the FDA has indoctrinated the population into thinking that if we don't take these "drugs" that we will wither and die.