Corporal Punishment in School

[rambone]

What I would like would be a poll given that isn't worded so as to gear answers towards your viewpoint.

LOL, I thought it was pretty clear that I was being a little bit humorous with the poll. I thought Waterboarding was a dead giveaway. Anyways aside from the silliness in the vote, 66 people currently want teachers to use a paddle on their kids and 25 currently want none of the above. How do you resolve the two? Majority does not rule, when you are talking about raising children. I strongly disagree with the State forcing things on kids that the parents do not consent to. I think the best way to please both sets of parents is to privatize schools, and the parents who want their kids to learn discipline from a teacher can send their kid to Boot Camp Elementary School.

How about this one...Rambone, when did you stop beating your wife? Perfectly logical question isn't it? Come on, was it recently? Last month?

I think you should be asking some of these folks who got the tar beat out of them as kids, and now do the same thing to their family because it seems comfortable and normal.

How about this one, what have you done to rid yourself of the toxins in your body, that you know you have, from the vaccinations you received as a child? You know, the ones that give you seizures and have caused you other health maladies over the years.

Fasting for better health

you also are forced to pay for our roads whether you use them or not, pay for your Governmental bodies whether you agree with them or not, heck here in St. Joseph county we pay for recycling whether we use it or not. We are forced to pay for many things in this state we may or may not use...like public schools.

Generally we classify these social programs as varying degrees of Socialism. The debate arises from how many of these programs are constitutional, necessary, affordable, effective, and fair. I don't think garbage disposal or education should be in the hands of the government, but road work is a fair compromise, if handled on the local level. JMHO

 

[Rookie]

I am all for spankings if they are warranted. I will be there to witness and my children know that it will be worse when they get home. I got spanked one time in school, believe me, I learned not to do it again.

I remember one time in school that one of the students just stopped going to school. Years later, I asked my dad (who was the administrator of the school) what ever happened to the student. My dad had called the parents, explained that little Johnny had done xyz, and he was going to be spanked. Btw, it took a LOT to get a spanking. Anyway, the parents told my dad that no one was going to lay a finger on their little angel, and my dad politely informed them that they could pick their son up and find another school.

I look at it this way. If parents can't/won't do their job, then someone has to try. I spent six months as a guard at a juvenile facility. 99.9% of those kids wouldn't have been there if parents would have blistered their kid's ass.

I have four kids, none have ever been in more trouble than detention for being tardy.

 

[rambone]

We had a recent thread where a lot of members longed wistfully for a return to corporal punishment in schools. I thought this might be a good time to revive this INGO classic for a new generation.

What say you, INGO? Should public school teachers and staff have the authority to strike students into compliance once again?

All without parental consent, parental knowledge, or proof of the infraction, of course! Just like the good old days.

 

[Bapak2ja]

No one touches my kid in school. If my kids misbehave, call me. I will deal with them. I made sure my kids' teachers all knew it. I made it very explicit. Do not touch my kids. Of course, that was the norm in both jungles in which I raised them (Borneo and Kingston, Jamaica). A teacher touches a child in those places at the risk of life and limb. Interesting results, though.

In Jamaica, the streets are dangerous—especially for white folks, and especially in February. Speaking from personal experience. However, in Borneo you walk for miles, walk into any village, hamlet, or town at any time, day or night, and are completely safe. Mind your manners and you will be received. Strangers will welcome you into their home for coffee and snacks (sticky rice, fried or boiled manioc dipped in raw molasses, fruits of all sorts, etc). If you are lost, or trapped by flood waters, they will help you get out of the water, feed you, dry you out, and send you on your way. But no one except a father or close relative (uncle, grandfather) ever lays a hand on the kids.

Corporal punishment is not the issue. The key issue is respect for one's elders and for authority figures. In Indonesia, the children were, and still are, taught to respect their elders and all authority figures. In Jamaica, this respect is not part of the general education process, though many fine families still do stress it and teach it to their kids. We no longer teach it in the USA and we are seeing the transformation of our society from an Indonesian style of interaction to a Jamaican one. It has nothing to do with corporal punishment, finances, education, race, gender, or politics. It has to do with the absence of a father who will teach a child to respect his/her elders and those in authority.

Fire away. I have my helmet on. INCOMING!!

 

[HoughMade]

I think we need to return to the days when, for all kids knew, the school and the parents were a united front in the disciple department. Were that the case, the specific means of discipline would not be as important.

As it turns out, my parents had some issues with teachers I had in grade school- crazy notion: I didn't find out until years later. Whatever issues they had were addressed to the teacher and principle and I was not in the loop.

 

[Thor]

A good corollary for this poll would be "What do you think your kids should be able to get away with in public before someone calls them count."

I think (from the news) too many peoples answer is "Anything...up to and including beating on a cop and trying to steal his gun."

The little darlings.

But then again...I home school...no longer trust the government or other peoples 'limits'.

 

[HoughMade]

...But then again...I home school...no longer trust the government or other peoples 'limits'.

You and me both....as much due to the other students as the teachers and admin.

Oh, where my kids go, there most certainly is corporal punishment, it just hasn't been necessary in years. Go figure.

 

[2A_Tom]

I say only the Pengiun gets to use the rulers, but hand slap/spanking seems fine. It shouldn't be used constantly, but after some preset "rules of engagment".

Heeey! I've got arthritis in both hands, probably you too.


Seriously though, there is a reason that God provided a large round target, that is nearly impossible to seriously damage, with more nerve endings than any other patch of skin, save the nose.

Jokes aside, what would you allow a stranger to do to your kids?


Please discuss.

At the school my children attended we signed a permission slip for corporal punishment. This was carried out by the principal who would talk to them, then give them swats with a paddle and in the end give them a Little Debbie or some sort of treat before sending them back to class.

This in no way took my responsibility as a parent. My children received a few spankings at home but not too many, Past 5 or 6 hardly any, and the same at school.

Although my youngest daughter did get a Little Debbie every day of 5 year old kindergarten. (what can i say, she would do anything for a snack) She is now 22 lives at home, works and we have a great relationship and no problems at all.

 

[Thor]

You and me both....as much due to the other students as the teachers and admin.

Oh, where my kids go, there most certainly is corporal punishment, it just hasn't been necessary in years. Go figure.

Yep, at this point with my kids the stern look suffices.

 

[devious169]

The cruel bastards made us make our own paddles in shop class, then gave them to our parents at the end of the year.

 

[mcjon77]

I think I am the last of the generation that was hit with rulers by nuns in catholic school. It was once (Sister Fran) in the first grade. I still remember thinking "wow, I actually got hit by a nun, just like on TV. Cool!" Seriously, it was a slight sting, but nothing compared to what my mom would do (which was still pretty mild).

HOWEVER, one form of mass corporal punishment that was REGULARLY used in my Catholic elementary school (at least through the third or fourth grade) was what would later be called "stress positions" when talking about the U.S. "enhanced interrogation techniques" (AKA torture) that was used against terrorism suspects.

If some of the kids in the class got rowdy, then the WHOLE class was forced to stand with their arms straight out (which, ironically for a Catholic school, looked a lot like we were being crucified) holding dictionaries in each had. If ANYONE dropped a dictionary the whole class had to hold them up longer. As we moved on to the next grade, the dictionaries got bigger and the standing time got longer. I can still remember the the burning feeling in my shoulders 30 years later. I also still remember the anger I had for being physically punished for something that I didn't do. It was great for the school because it was the equivalent of being about to beat the children without leaving any marks.

IMHO, it was stupid. I remember another punishment that one my teachers gave out. She made us do times tables (remember 1x1 =1x2=2, etc) over and over again. That was mind numbingly repetitive, but it also one of the reasons that I can multiply so quickly in my head today, so at least that had some value.

 

[Thor]

We did those stress positions in military camp...kids holding a k98 on their wrists with their arms straight out in formation...such fun.

 

[copperhead-1911]

Seems like kids are far more mild today than in the 80s or even early 1990s.

 

[Thor]

Or the press and gubiment would have us believe so...

 

[2A_Tom]

I think I am the last of the generation that was hit with rulers by nuns in catholic school. It was once (Sister Fran) in the first grade. I still remember thinking "wow, I actually got hit by a nun, just like on TV. Cool!" Seriously, it was a slight sting, but nothing compared to what my mom would do (which was still pretty mild).

HOWEVER, one form of mass corporal punishment that was REGULARLY used in my Catholic elementary school (at least through the third or fourth grade) was what would later be called "stress positions" when talking about the U.S. "enhanced interrogation techniques" (AKA torture) that was used against terrorism suspects.

If some of the kids in the class got rowdy, then the WHOLE class was forced to stand with their arms straight out (which, ironically for a Catholic school, looked a lot like we were being crucified) holding dictionaries in each had. If ANYONE dropped a dictionary the whole class had to hold them up longer. As we moved on to the next grade, the dictionaries got bigger and the standing time got longer. I can still remember the the burning feeling in my shoulders 30 years later. I also still remember the anger I had for being physically punished for something that I didn't do. It was great for the school because it was the equivalent of being about to beat the children without leaving any marks.

IMHO, it was stupid. I remember another punishment that one my teachers gave out. She made us do times tables (remember 1x1 =1x2=2, etc) over and over again. That was mind numbingly repetitive, but it also one of the reasons that I can multiply so quickly in my head today, so at least that had some value.

Sounds like the making of a domestic terrorist. Better keep an eye on you white Christians.

 

[traderdan]

Like this or not....A child who resorts to violence, may need to be reminded that he or she might BECOME the recipient of controlled violence. Pain works. Corporal punishment should be a tool used carefully by a school system.

 

[John317]

I do not want the teacher or school staff of schools touching my kid as any form of punishment. Maybe if I was a parent in a previous generation I would feel differently. We certainly live in a different age than years ago in the county when it would be the norm. I personally don't trust teachers or school administrators to be able to implement a corporal punishment into the school system. Now if they want to make them do push-ups, run laps, or something similar I would be open to the idea as long as it's a regulated program that parents can sign off on after reviewing. All it takes is one teacher though to have a bad day and take it out on your kid and go too far. I know growing up any punishment the school would give me I would gladly take over what I would get at home and that kept me in line.

 

[HoughMade]

... I know growing up any punishment the school would give me I would gladly take over what I would get at home and that kept me in line.

Which is sadly lacking today as parents regularly see little Johnny or Suzie as perfect and can do no wrong. If the educators had more parental support and less battling, this whole discussion may be moot.

 

[copperhead-1911]

I do not want the teacher or school staff of schools touching my kid as any form of punishment. Maybe if I was a parent in a previous generation I would feel differently. We certainly live in a different age than years ago in the county when it would be the norm. I personally don't trust teachers or school administrators to be able to implement a corporal punishment into the school system. Now if they want to make them do push-ups, run laps, or something similar I would be open to the idea as long as it's a regulated program that parents can sign off on after reviewing. All it takes is one teacher though to have a bad day and take it out on your kid and go too far. I know growing up any punishment the school would give me I would gladly take over what I would get at home and that kept me in line.

Yeah, but you probably know how to control your kids. Many people dont. in some groups and places there is little to any accountability at home. that is the problem.

 

[KJW]

Children like canoes are best guided from the rear.