Better 308 questions!

[Topher Durden]

I just got my first 308!!!! Haven't fired it yet, but can't wait. I 've spent several hours on this forum as well as others to learn as much as I can without blindly asking the same repeat questions such as;

What bullet weight is best? answer; What kind of shooting will you be doing?
What twist rate is optimal? answer; What kind of shooting will you be doing?
what ammo is best for my 308? answer; what kind of shooting will you be doing?
how do i shoot 1000 yards? answer; Practice and the right equipment, but mostly practice.


My details:
Rifle: Savage FCP HS Precision stock 308
Barrel: 24"
Twist: 1 in 10
Intended use: Long distance target shooting
I already reload pistol on a dillon 550(thanks andrew at Profire) and will be reloading for my 308 down the road

What I know:
-need to practice
-heavier bullets tend to excel for distances longer than 600 yards...
-practice quite a bit
-1:10 twist rate would be better for heavier bullets
-make sure I practice a lot!
-lapua brass seems to be the most favored
-I gotta practice a ton
-Reloading is going to be the best way to get great ammo for my rifle
-practice, practice, practice...
-single stage reloading is better for precision rifle loading
-don't forget to practice


My "better 308 questions"
-can my progressive press be setup to reload as a single stage?
-should I reload heavier bullets now to start at shorter distances with the intent of using the same round as I shoot at further distances? or should I be shooting 2 or more different rounds for different distances? lighter bullet for 200-400 yards, develop new round for shooting 600+ yards? or only use one bullet for everything?
-why is Lapua Brass so much better?
-why is boat tail better at longer distance only? why wouldn't it shoot better even at 200 yards than flat bottom bullets?
-Should I buy Lapua ammo now to obtain brass for when I do reload or should I shoot cheap factory stuff to zero and go to 400 yards and then get better stuff as I shoot farther?
-What am I forgetting or what should I know that I don't know I don't know?
Thanks everybody!!!!

Topher Bell

 

[ghostdncr]

The world according to John (that's me):

-can my progressive press be setup to reload as a single stage? I've no idea, so will pass on this one.

-should I reload heavier bullets now to start at shorter distances with the intent of using the same round as I shoot at further distances? or should I be shooting 2 or more different rounds for different distances? lighter bullet for 200-400 yards, develop new round for shooting 600+ yards? or only use one bullet for everything?I've always shot the Sierra Match King (SMK) in 168 or 175 grain weights. Some sticks prefer one or the other. Sometimes, the difference is insignificant. Whatever the case, I use one load and one load only.

-why is Lapua Brass so much better? I've used both Lake City M118 and Federal Gold Medal Match brass with excellent results. I'm sure the Lapua brass is superb stuff, but I've never dealt with it.

-why is boat tail better at longer distance only? why wouldn't it shoot better even at 200 yards than flat bottom bullets? BTHP bullets will will shoot just fine at shorter distances, but the superiority of the boat-tail design becomes apparent at longer ranges.

-Should I buy Lapua ammo now to obtain brass for when I do reload or should I shoot cheap factory stuff to zero and go to 400 yards and then get better stuff as I shoot farther? See my response to the brass question above.

-What am I forgetting or what should I know that I don't know I don't know? Consider getting a notebook or ledger and recording info on every round you fire. Import this data to an Excel spreadsheet for ease of sorting. Spend way more on your optics than you did on your rifle. Either study your optics choices extensively or buy a Leupold Mark 4 and be done with it. If you don't know how to level a scope, pay someone who does to set you up. Don't mount a $1000 scope in $34 aluminum rings. Pay the money for a 20MOA base too, as it tends to work out well. I like to build a CBS target series in order to understand what to expect from the first shot through a cold barrel at given distances. This is good info to have. Learn to build a solid hold on the rifle. Cheek weld matters, along with about a dozen other aspects of holding a precision rifle. Weigh your powder charges individually on a precision scale; weigh and sort your brass and bullets into lots on the scale, as well. There's MUCH more, but these points spring immediately to mind and I'm being called for dinner.

 

[Savage99]

Great advice ghostdncr. I know that shooting highpower my biggest problem is having a repeatable, consistent position. That will apply to long range as well (bench or prone). In my .30-06 target rifle I shoot 168 gr A-max and then further out plan to shoot 190 gr HPBT. Just haven't had a place or time to try it. I would get some practice in before spending $$$ on high dollar brass. It may be wore out before you can even shoot 1000 yds. Get good up close first. A data book is a must. The other thing that has helped me a bunch is having friends that are way better than me that are willing to help me.

 

[ViperJock]

I use my dillon as a single stage at times. I just use the die I want and forward it through the others or pull it off the press. I'm not sure if yours allows you to do that or not?

 

[Topher Durden]

Thanks for the help. I've selected my scope which is more expensive than the rifle. I've made arrangements to get the scope mounted and zeroed with AA Optics(see you soon alan!)on my Nightforce 20MOA base, and I already have a blank notebook for data collection.
This brings up another great question! What data should I collect that I may not be aware of? I plan on tracking loads and reload data but the CBS was something I would not have thought of that makes perfect sense. is there a specific "rifle data log" that I should be aware of for meticulous data collection?

 

[ghostdncr]

Storm Tactical sells a good collection of data logs: Storm Tactical, Precision Rifle Data Books, USMC Sniper, Army Sniper, Military Sniper, SWAT Sniper, Log Books Most civilian shooters can get by just splendidly with their large economy model for $20: Storm Tactical Standard Paper Coil Data Books

Here's an interesting page I found that contains a bunch of SOTIC (Special Operations Target Interdiction Course) info, which should keep you busy for awhile: http://www.range37.com/PSR037/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/data_book_sotic.pdf

 

[avboiler11]

Your rifle should shoot Federal 168/175gr Gold Medal Match well. It should also do well with 168gr Hornady A-Max/TAP and 178gr Amax/HPBT.

I would pick one bullet and run with it; you aren't shooting benchrest so wringing the last tenth out of the rifle at 100/200yd via a light flat-base bullet isn't a huge deal.

Also, make sure you get a quality optic - you don't need to spend Schmidt & Bender money or "even" Nightforce, but a quality Weaver/Vortex/SWFA that has repeatable, accurate tracking and enough elevation adjustment to reach the ranges with 308 you plan to shoot will suit you fine.

You'll probably want a 20MOA base (I like Weaver a bit more than EGW, its aluminum but works just fine, there are many other steel options out there) and a quality set of rings; I like and have had good luck with Burris XTR but many don't/haven't, with TPS/Seekins/Badger being typically recommended.

 

[42769vette]

After talking to Topher we decided the Elite 6500 best fits his bill.

 

[Hohn]

My understanding of the lapua brass "superiority" is based on consistency (weight variation piece to piece) and it seems more resistant to work hardening (perhaps lower Copper content?) so it may have a longer life before needing to be tossed.

 

[rvb]

I already reload pistol on a dillon 550 ... can my progressive press be setup to reload as a single stage?

yes, but why would you want to? you won't see it hold to better tollerances or anything doing it the painful way.

there are other threads on this you can search out, but for my .223 on my 550, I use two toolheads. 1st toolhead sizes and trims (actually sizes 2x since the trimmer is also a sizer) in stations 1 and 3. For the second toolhead I use a universal decaper in station 1 to clean media out of the flash hole then load just like pistol (lube on the first pass, tumble to remove lube for the second pass).

-rvb