At what age can you legally give your daughter a gun?

[melensdad]

I understand that if I give my daughter a gun prior to her 18th birthday that I am legally obligated to keep it under my supervision and control.

But my question is can I give legally gift a gun to a child under 18 years of age and have her be the legal owner of that gun, even if she is not legally allowed to operate it without adult supervision?


FOLLOW UP QUESTION: Is there any difference between legally gifting a gun to a minor if the gun is a handgun or a rifle?


I ask because there are some guns that we 'consider' to be my daughter's guns. She shoots them, she cares for them . . . I lock them up when not in use. IF the so-called GUN SHOW LOOPHOLE is 'closed' by Obama and the Brady gang, then to gift guns to our daughters we will have to go to an FFL dealer and have them "transferred". My problem with this is that we already own them and we've already paid to transfer them, so why should we have to pay to transfer them again simply so our daughter can own what she already owns?


So if I have a plinking pistol & plinking rifle and I have a minor daughter, can I legally "gift" her that gun and can she take legal ownership of that gun while she is a minor?

 

[haldir]

Define ownership of anything that an unemancipated minor would have.

 

[melensdad]

Define ownership of anything that an unemancipated minor would have.

Legally possessing in the eyes of the law. For example I can give my minor child a gift of a charm bracelet. The legal system would uphold her right to ownership.

 

[Scutter01]

I believe you're fine. I was reading the statute and I'm not sure, but that's how I take it. IC 35-47-10 defines the purposes for which you can allow possession of a firearm by a minor.

IC 35-47-10-1
Exemptions from chapter
Sec. 1. This chapter does not apply to the following:
(1) A child who is attending a hunters safety course or a firearms safety course or an adult who is supervising the child during the course.
(2) A child engaging in practice in using a firearm for target shooting at an established range or in an area where the discharge of a firearm is not prohibited or supervised by:
(A) a qualified firearms instructor; or
(B) an adult who is supervising the child while the child is at the range.
(3) A child engaging in an organized competition involving the use of a firearm or participating in or practicing for a performance by an organized group under Section 501(c)(3) of the Internal Revenue Code that uses firearms as a part of a performance or an adult who is involved in the competition or performance.
(4) A child who is hunting or trapping under a valid license issued to the child under IC 14-22.
(5) A child who is traveling with an unloaded firearm to or from an activity described in this section.
(6) A child who:
(A) is on real property that is under the control of the child's parent, an adult family member of the child, or the child's legal guardian; and
(B) has permission from the child's parent or legal guardian to possess a firearm.
(7) A child who:
(A) is at the child's residence; and
(B) has the permission of the child's parent, an adult family member of the child, or the child's legal guardian to possess a firearm.
As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.12. Amended by P.L.1-1995, SEC.78; P.L.203-1996, SEC.2.

Then also note:

IC 35-47-10-6
Dangerous control of a firearm
Sec. 6. An adult who knowingly, intentionally, or recklessly provides a firearm to a child for any purpose other than those described in section 1 of this chapter, with or without remuneration, commits dangerous control of a firearm, a Class C felony. However, the offense is a Class B felony if the adult has a prior conviction under this section.
As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.12. Amended by P.L.203-1996, SEC.5.

 

[melensdad]

Scutter, I've seen that. But is there a difference between POSSESS and OWNERSHIP?

That section of the law talks about the minor child possessing a weapon for various purposes and clearly indicates that the weapon still needs to be under the general supervision of an adult.

I'm wondering if it is legal for a gun to actually be owned by a child. Or does the adult technically own the gun until the child is 18?

For people with large collections to pass down to their children the transfer fees for 'gifting' guns to their children could be very cost prohibitive, not to mention unfair since they already transferred the gun to the family once and the gun had been purchased by the adult for the child originally or handed down to the child at some point in his/her young life.

 

[cordex]

I think ownership is a moot point at this time. In your case, the issue of ownership only really matters if laws change. Trying to second-guess laws that have not yet been written is very hard to do accurately. When and if legislation is introduced that would prevent you from making an ownership transfer, examine the wording of that legislation and determine how best to circumvent it.

 

[Mr.Hoppes]

I think. I think there is a difference between ownership and possession.

When a LEO takes possession of your firearm for your safety you still own it, it just isn't in your possession.

 

[kludge]

AFAIK, and from the case law I've seen they care not a whit who "owns" the gun, they only care who is possessing or carrying it either physically or constructively. With Indiana and federal laws the way they are it is difficult to "prove" who "owns" the gun.

If she is at home and she has the parents' permission to possess it she is legal.

If she is travelling to or from a range, or at the range she can legally posses it if it is unloaded while transporting. PLEASE also read the definition of LOADED, it's especially special for minors, my advise is two separate locked containers for the gun and ammo while transporting. This shows that the child has no intention of using the gun, and is in compliance with the regulation.

IC 35-47-10-4
"Loaded" defined
Sec. 4. As used in this chapter, "loaded" means having any of the following:
(1) A cartridge in the chamber or cylinder of a firearm.
(2) Ammunition in close proximity to a firearm so that a person can readily place the ammunition in the firearm.
As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.12. Amended by P.L.203-1996, SEC.3.

 

[Scutter01]

I think it's funny that a child, without a license, can travel to/from a range with a handgun but not an adult.

 

[kludge]

Not funny, Scutter, ASININE.


and back theoriginal question:

But my question is can I give legally gift a gun to a child under 18 years of age and have her be the legal owner of that gun, even if she is not legally allowed to operate it without adult supervision?

... "supervision" is not required to operate it "at the residence", what is required "at the residence" is "permission"... and if not at the residence, it must be "real property under the contol of" the parent, guardian, adult family member.

...and to answer the follow up question, I can not find any legal distinction between gifting a longgun vs. a handgun... both sections of code say the same thing.

It's the wording of (2) that confuses me the most:

(2) A child engaging in practice in using a firearm for target shooting at an established range or in an area where the discharge of a firearm is not prohibited or supervised by:
(A) a qualified firearms instructor; or
(B) an adult who is supervising the child while the child is at the range.

It sounds like they are saying that if it's not legal to discharge a firearm in a certain area it's OK if an instructor is there.

 

[kludge]

ooops... how could I forget this one? goes right to the crux of the OP's question.

IC 35-47-2-7
Prohibited sales or transfers of ownership
Sec. 7. (a) Except an individual acting within a parent-minor child or guardian-minor protected person relationship or any other individual who is also acting in compliance with IC 35-47-10, a person may not sell, give, or in any other manner transfer the ownership or possession of a handgun or assault weapon (as defined in IC 35-50-2-11) to any person under eighteen (18) years of age.

 

[wolfman]

I understand that if I give my daughter a gun prior to her 18th birthday that I am legally obligated to keep it under my supervision and control.

But my question is can I give legally gift a gun to a child under 18 years of age and have her be the legal owner of that gun, even if she is not legally allowed to operate it without adult supervision?


FOLLOW UP QUESTION: Is there any difference between legally gifting a gun to a minor if the gun is a handgun or a rifle?

In a state that requires registration, this question could be more difficult to answer, but in Indiana, it really is a moot point.

For example, I have 2 girls, neither of which live at home, so it's just me and the wife, and in my safe, there are mmmmm some guns that I have acquired through trades and other sorts of ftf transactions. If someone were to ask "Who is the legal owner of each one of those guns?", there is no correct answer, because there is no paperwork indicating ownership, other than what the last FFL holder to have "official contact" with them has. It really wouldn't matter if there was a minor involved, because;

ooops... how could I forget this one? goes right to the crux of the OP's question.

IC 35-47-2-7
Prohibited sales or transfers of ownership
Sec. 7. (a) Except an individual acting within a parent-minor child or guardian-minor protected person relationship or any other individual who is also acting in compliance with IC 35-47-10, a person may not sell, give, or in any other manner transfer the ownership or possession of a handgun or assault weapon (as defined in IC 35-50-2-11) to any person under eighteen (18) years of age.

and I could just "name" wife as owner of A&B, daughter 1 as owner of C&D, daughter 2 as owner of E&F, and I own the rest.

For items you acquired directly from an FFL holder, as a parent, in Indiana, you could give it to them the same way you would give them a gift for their birthday or Christmas, by just saying "Here, this is for you". As far as I am aware, just saying "This is Yours" in front of a wittness, pretty much covers the legal transfer when gifting something, but if you wanted to, you could put something in writing. You could even word it something like, "I xxxx here by transfer ownership of xxx gun, to xxxx, once he/she attains the age of 18".