.357 self defense ammunition

[DadSmith]

I`ve carried a handgun in some form or fashion for a big portion of my life. I`m 65. For much of that time, I`ve carried a Glock handgun. I started out with a cheap Davis .380, then eventually went to a Glock 19 in 9mm, but shortly after, went to the Glock pistol in .45 acp. I know what ammunition I like in .45 loads, I carry Federal Hydra Shok 230 grain. I like the heavier bullet and feel that it makes the better self defense round.

Since just recently having acquired a Colt Python 4" I`ve been looking at the various bullet weights and trying to figure out what is the way to go. An internet search lead me to the Federal Hydra Shok .357 mag load in a 158 grain bullet. I was encouraged in another thread to look at a Buffalo Bore 180 grain round for deer hunting, but if I carry a 158 grain bullet for self defense, the sights wouldn`t be adjusted properly for one or the other. I guess due to that, I won`t consider the Python for deer hunting, only personal protection.

There is a ton of knowledge here, and you guys are very generous in sharing your knowledge and expertise, so I hope to gain from your wisdom. What bullet weight would you recommend for self defense carry in .357 magnum. Am I on the right track with my Hydra Shok 158 grain rounds, or should I rethink that?

For great penetration go 158gr or higher. If you are worried that over penetration will happen stay below 158gr and not lower than 125gr. Always use a good hollow point bullet a proven one like Gold Dot, HST etc. If it's self defense. For hunting hard cast WFNGC, or Hornady XTP 180gr work well.

I speak from hunting experience only and I always go heavy for hunting and it does an excellent job, and it also on many occasions goes through one side of a deer and out the other.

 

[gregr]

For great penetration go 158gr or higher. If you are worried that over penetration will happen stay below 158gr and not lower than 125gr. Always use a good hollow point bullet a proven one like Gold Dot, HST etc. If it's self defense. For hunting hard cast WFNGC, or Hornady XTP 180gr work well.

I speak from hunting experience only and I always go heavy for hunting and it does an excellent job, and it also on many occasions goes through one side of a deer and out the other.

I know you speak only from experience and you only speak if you know what you`re speaking of. Thanks buddy.

 

[gregr]

Who knew there was so much to consider when carrying a handgun? Yet, there is all this experience and expertise gathered here in this one place.

 

[scout5]

For me accuracy is key. I am not going to carry hardball ammunition in a carry gun but I do carry what shoots accurate out of it. I know the FBI 7 yards average and all that, but I have always wanted to be accurate at "reasonable" longer distances. Reasonable is the distance I am accurate at.

 

[gregr]

For me accuracy is key. I am not going to carry hardball ammunition in a carry gun but I do carry what shoots accurate out of it. I know the FBI 7 yards average and all that, but I have always wanted to be accurate at "reasonable" longer distances. Reasonable is the distance I am accurate at.

The kid who stopped the shooter at the Greenwood Park Mall found "reasonable" to be the estimated 40 yards he engaged the mass shooter wannabe at.

 

[Noble Sniper]

I wish I had something to add but my 357 experience is handloads. I always favored Skeeter Skelton’s 158’s but have a new one using a 158gr xtp over a copious amount of H110. My ocd I have one load per firearm and that’s all I run. My 44 mag load is a proven load used by a lot of folks shooting silhouettes back in the day.

 

[scout5]

The kid who stopped the shooter at the Greenwood Park Mall found "reasonable" to be the estimated 40 yards he engaged the mass shooter wannabe at.

Yes he did.

I often surprise people at the distance some some carry guns are capable of if you can do your part. One of those skills you hope you never need but handy if you do, which was but on display in the Greenwood Park Mall.

Hat's off to the young man, for being prepared and capable.

 

[duanewade]

I've used both 125 and 158 gr XTP to kill whitetail and there was difference whatsoever in what killed the animal the quickest. I've never been one to dig a bullet out of a deer as my biggest concern was getting it dressed and hung up to cool. Out of the 15 deer I've shot with a .357 none of them made it further than 30 yards before collapsing.

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

 

[gregr]

Just ordered 50 rounds of 125 grain .357 mag Hornady Critical Defense off Midway USA. Dang! That`s expensive!

 

[bdybdall]

Yes he did.

I often surprise people at the distance some some carry guns are capable of if you can do your part. One of those skills you hope you never need but handy if you do, which was but on display in the Greenwood Park Mall.

Hat's off to the young man, for being prepared and capable.

Not to hijack a thread but what handgun and caliber was the young man using?

 

[gregr]

Not to hijack a thread but what handgun and caliber was the young man using?

I read it was a 9mm handgun, I think a Glock?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Not going to reply individually, but:

1) My personal rule is 3" barrel and under stick with .38+P. Gold Dot Short Barrel has been unobtainium for years, but was a popular load in the day as well. There are some .357 magnum loads that are basically "magnum light" and sort of split the difference.

Hard cast wadcutters are a very viable choice for 2" and under barrels when it starts getting pretty tough to get a bullet to both expand and penetrate sufficiently, and nothing is going to be truly barrier blind. Also much more pleasant and controllable to shoot vs the high fiving a sledgehammer of a full house magnum in a snubby. But you do lose that magnificent flashbang with each trigger pull. I don't carry wadcutters because employer rules say "quality hollowpoint", but were I not to have that restriction, I'd go WC in my LCR.

2) Clear gel tests are not used institutionally for a reason. There is no proven analogue to real world results and the gel is not and can not be repeatedly 'calibrated' for apples to apples comparison between blocks, or even the same block from test to test. The only reason anyone uses it is cost and ease of handling, or they don't know any better. For a long read on why clear gel can't be relied on, see: https://www.police1.com/police-prod...gelatin-comparisons-part-ii-NVdpfONSxRFxBwTL/

3) Ammo makers know that the vast majority of carry revolvers are snubbies, and carry ammo biases toward that. Which is why you'll typically get a screaming amount of over penetration in duty sized guns. .357 Magnum has a lot of case volume and it's very tough to make a load that both detonates reliably and is not barrel length sensitive.

4) It is an expensive cartridge, as are most revolver cartridges, because revolvers are largely relegated to hobby and hunting status, outside of j-frames and LCRs. If you plan to shoot revolvers much, reloading is where you need to research next. Savings for cranking out revolver cartridges piles up much quicker than the common semi-auto loads. When I'm cranking out .45 Colt you can hear Pink Floyd's "Money" playing from my press if you listen hard enough.

 

[Opie]

I've been using Golden Saber 125gr in .357 mag for years, never had a problem. It's more of a mid-powered load but every avail test I have seen shows incredible expansion and it's been 100% reliable for me. I don't feel like I am giving up much to full powered loads, and it shoots great out of my 686.

 

[billybob44]

Hydrashok works fine in .357 magnum, the velocity allows it to expand reliably whereas low velocity cartridges like the .45 Auto are not reliable expanders. Gold Dots work fine. I've not seen the HSTs in real world use, but given the quality of the line up over all I'd have no issue with them unless proven otherwise. Critical Duty works fine.

Downsides are many of the bullets over penetrate when fired from 4" and up barrels instead of snubbies. I've never seen Critical Duty stay inside a person. For a rural environment that may not be much of a concern. For denser areas, pass throughs remain dangerous. As in through a grown man's chest, through a security door, through a solid core front door, through two interior walls, and shattering on a fireplace sort of over penetration. If you've never touched one off inside, it's an experience. The noise and concussion are...attention getting. Personally I'd rather not do it again but if you have access to a shoot house or some other way to safely do so I recommend you give it a go once to prepare yourself for what it's like if you have to. I won't even shoot it at an indoor range any longer. It's much more fun to shoot outside.

.38+P will do for any human issues with less recoil, less noise, and less over penetration and I would (and do) stick with it for urban/indoor carry. Bonus is it ejects easier, given the shorter brass. Downside is you need to clean the cylinder's chambers a bit more often as crud will build up and make .357 brass stick when you swap back.

You will need to find what cartridges shoot point of aim = point of impact, but *generally* speaking fixed sight guns are regulated for 158 gr.

^^^BEST information on this thread, from One who knows...Bill.

 

[Ziggidy]

Just ordered 50 rounds of 125 grain .357 mag Hornady Critical Defense off Midway USA. Dang! That`s expensive!

RK had some off brand JHP .357 - 17.99 for a box of 20. Things just are not the same as they used to be.

 

[gregr]

RK had some off brand JHP .357 - 17.99 for a box of 20. Things just are not the same as they used to be.

I have a RK gift card, I need to go look. I guess I`m going to go with the 125 grain, so I guess any brand so long as it`s that bullet weight will be good.

 

[ECS686]

I've been using Golden Saber 125gr in .357 mag for years, never had a problem. It's more of a mid-powered load but every avail test I have seen shows incredible expansion and it's been 100% reliable for me. I don't feel like I am giving up much to full powered loads, and it shoots great out of my 686.

^^THIS^^^

What I have found out with my 357 revolvers

As BBI stated with his Magnum Lite statement Golden Sabres meet that IMHO it has nowhere near the blast that other 125’s generally have but still has good ballistics (just look at the Lucky Gunner results)

Any if the Hydra Shocks would be good without a lot of blast (well not as much as most 125’s)

Another decent option is 145 grain Winchester Silvertips. While like Hydra Shocks they are older and some folks think they have to have a bonded bullet they still work. I worked for the US Marshals Service as a contract Guard in the late 1990’s and the issue gun for the USMS at that time was a 3” Ruger GP 100 with 145 gr Win Silvertips. While most of us carried Sigs or Glocks in 9,40 or 45 the shootings they had with the 357 showed that loading worked great.

 

[edporch]

I started out carrying a S&W Model 19 .357 Magnum 4" barrel in the early 1980's.
I always used .357 125 grain hollow point ammo, as if memory serves the police liked that round.
If I was buying .357 magnum defensive ammo today, I'd begin with Underwood .357 Mag 125gr. eXtreme Terminal Performance (XTP®) Jacketed Hollow Point.
Has a muzzle Velocity of 1700fps

.357 Mag 125gr. eXtreme Terminal Performance (XTP®) Jacketed Hollow Point Hunting & Self Defense Ammo

Underwood Ammo offers the most comprehensive and innovative Hornady® Supersonic Handgun Ammo for personal defense & hunting. Shop now .357 Mag Brass ammo with Jacketed Hollow Point.

underwoodammo.com

 

[garni]

I`ve carried a handgun in some form or fashion for a big portion of my life. I`m 65. For much of that time, I`ve carried a Glock handgun. I started out with a cheap Davis .380, then eventually went to a Glock 19 in 9mm, but shortly after, went to the Glock pistol in .45 acp. I know what ammunition I like in .45 loads, I carry Federal Hydra Shok 230 grain. I like the heavier bullet and feel that it makes the better self defense round.

Since just recently having acquired a Colt Python 4" I`ve been looking at the various bullet weights and trying to figure out what is the way to go. An internet search lead me to the Federal Hydra Shok .357 mag load in a 158 grain bullet. I was encouraged in another thread to look at a Buffalo Bore 180 grain round for deer hunting, but if I carry a 158 grain bullet for self defense, the sights wouldn`t be adjusted properly for one or the other. I guess due to that, I won`t consider the Python for deer hunting, only personal protection.

There is a ton of knowledge here, and you guys are very generous in sharing your knowledge and expertise, so I hope to gain from your wisdom. What bullet weight would you recommend for self defense carry in .357 magnum. Am I on the right track with my Hydra Shok 158 grain rounds, or should I rethink that?

Either round (.357 or. 45acp) are fantastic carry rounds so long as you use quality guns, and you train well.

 

[thelefthand]

You want speed if you're running 357 mag. Stick with stuff in the 125gr range. Gold dot, ranger, hst, and golden sabers will all do fine. If you want a little more penetration, find someone who loads a 125gr monolithic hp like Buffalo Bore or Corbon. Here's a link to the corbon load being tested. Looks like penetration is a non-issue.



158 gr is generally a hunting load designed to drive deep into vitals. 2 legged preditors are not as thick skined as most game animals. If you really want to run. A heavier projectile, drop down to 38 spl ammo and save yourself quite a bit of recoil, muzzle flash, and noise.