1st Grader punished for pointing his fingers like a gun

[IndyGunworks]

Are you guys advocating beating children in schools? I think more people's agendas are showing.

putting words into my mouth. no i am not, but i did get beat in school and it did help keep me in line. today a teacher isnt even allowed to raise her voice at students and there are almost NO alternatives to a misbehaving student than talking to the parents. after my wife talks to a parents and no progress is made, the office is the ONLY other avenue she can take.

 

[public servant]

Are you guys advocating beating children in schools?

No. I'm advocating personal responsibility. Are you advocating anarchy?

I think more people's agendas are showing.

Yours is on high beam. You used to make a lot of sense. Meh...not so much anymore.

 

[eldirector]

Allowing teachers more options for discipline WOULD be nice. As it sits, their hands are tied. Any teacher that tries to discipline a child is automatically thought to be a bad teacher (hence, this thread). Give them some options, maybe (just maybe) even the paddles that us old-timers grew up with, and I'd bet classroom behavior begins to improve.

 

[rambone]

I find it hard to believe people would accept strangers on power trips wailing on their kids with blunt objects. There certainly should be more in-school options, but corporal punishment I don't think would fly very far.

 

[steveh_131]

I find it hard to believe people would accept strangers on power trips wailing on their kids with blunt objects. There certainly should be more in-school options, but corporal punishment I don't think would fly very far.

I think some people are stuck on the way things used to be. Yeah, teachers used to paddle kids. But there weren't 2000 kids in a school back then, and as a parent you could get to know the teacher personally and knew they could be trusted to administer that sort of punishment.

There's no way in hell I'd let some random teacher's union yahoo paddle my kid now. They can't even figure out how to teach basic arithmetic but they can handle corporal punishment? Please.

 

[eldirector]

I find it hard to believe people would accept strangers on power trips wailing on their kids with blunt objects. There certainly should be more in-school options, but corporal punishment I don't think would fly very far.

You are all in, all the time, aren't you?

Instead of focusing on the "wailing on kids with blunt objects" part that didn't really exist, why not focus on a sliding scale of responsibility and accountability?

So, if corporal punishment and in-school suspensions (dentition, extra homework, and sitting alone), and telling their parents to discipline their own children are off of your list, what options are left?

 

[public servant]

They can't even figure out how to teach basic arithmetic..

You are correct. Dumbing it down for little Johnny hasn't worked. It only made him...dumber.

 

[level.eleven]

Also, trying to call this "new-age" is absurd. There's nothing traditional in human history about forcing little kids to sit in little seats like drones.

Kids grew up learning from their parents and the people around them. Learning trades, learning the family business, learning how to work.

Cramming a bunch of completely different children into a little room and expecting them to learn the exact same way is "new-age".

The Prussian Model didn't make its way into the United States until the mid 1800's. I think people would be singing a slightly different tune if they knew the history associated with the Prussian Model and its desired outcome. Hint - it isn't about making you smarter. As you can see in this thread, its working.

 

[steveh_131]

You are correct. Dumbing it down for little Johnny hasn't worked. It only made him...dumber.

You keep bringing this up as if I somewhere advocated dumbing down the curriculum. Where did I say this?

 

[rambone]

You are all in, all the time, aren't you?

Instead of focusing on the "wailing on kids with blunt objects" part that didn't really exist, why not focus on a sliding scale of responsibility and accountability?

So, if corporal punishment and in-school suspensions (dentition, extra homework, and sitting alone), and telling their parents to discipline their own children are off of your list, what options are left?

My dad got wailed on with blunt objects. Kids got black eyes in his school.

For the record, I didn't catch that he got an "in school" suspension for the first few pages of this thread. That was my fault for the oversight (aka, my agenda).

In-school suspensions, detentions, extra homework, sitting alone, cleaning duty, Saturday school, loss of extra curricular activities; these are all fine by me.

Out of school suspensions and expulsions should be used for the most extreme cases. This finger-pointing kid doesn't even come close. Again -- I now realize that he didn't get an out-of-school suspension. But many other kids have from hysterical gun-hating schools.

Corporal punishment is something else entirely.


I made a poll because this makes me curious.

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...ion/131422-corporal_punishment_in_school.html

 

[steveh_131]

The Prussian Model didn't make its way into the United States until the mid 1800's. I think people would be singing a slightly different tune if they knew the history associated with the Prussian Model and its desired outcome. Hint - it isn't about making you smarter. As you can see in this thread, its working.

Thank you for this.

I read up on the Prussian model and it was intriguing.

Compulsory and progressive education, Prussian school system, totalitarianism, State versus the Individual, conformity and public indoctrination

Throughout history, rulers and court intellectuals have aspired to use the educational system to shape their nations. The model was set out by Plato in The Republic and was constructed most faithfully in Soviet Russia, Fascist Italy, and Nazi Germany. But one need not look only to extreme cases to find such uses of the educational system. One can see how irresistible a vehicle the schools would be to any social engineer. They represent a unique opportunity to mold future citizens early in life, to instill in them the proper reverence for the ruling culture, and to prepare them to be obedient and obeisant taxpayers and soldiers. Unsurprisingly, rulers and intellectuals jumped at the chance to make the schools a mill for the creation of Good Citizens. That motivation has been part of every effort to establish government schools.

See what I mean about turning little boys into mindless drones?

 

[Benny]

I find it hard to believe people would accept strangers on power trips wailing on their kids with blunt objects. There certainly should be more in-school options, but corporal punishment I don't think would fly very far.

A stranger touching my child would be the biggest mistake of their life...But I'm certainly not opposed to taking matters into my own hands(literally and figuratively).

I raised my 6 year old the right way though, so any authority figure paddling my child would be more than excessive.

 

[steveh_131]

Interested in what Albert Einstein had to say about public schools?

One had to cram all this stuff into one's mind, whether one liked it or not. This coercion had such a deterring effect that, after I had passed the final examination, I found the consideration of any scientific problems distasteful to me for an entire year.... It is in fact nothing short of a miracle that the modem methods of instruction have not yet entirely strangled the holy curiosity of inquiry; for this delicate little plant, aside from stimulation, stands mainly in need of freedom; without this it goes to wrack and ruin without fail. It is a very grave mistake to think that the enjoyment of seeing and searching can be promoted by means of coercion and a sense of duty. To the contrary, I believe that it would be possible to rob even a healthy beast of prey of its voraciousness, if it were possible, with the aid of a whip, to force the beast to devour continuously, even when not hungry - especially if the food, handed out under such coercion, were to be selected accordingly.

 

[public servant]

You keep bringing this up as if I somewhere advocated dumbing down the curriculum. Where did I say this?

Correct. You didn't advocate dumbing it down. You advocate changing the curriculum each time some kid can't grasp the current concept.

They have special classes for this. I don't see holding every other child back because Johnny cannot or will not do as expected. I mean...do they need to talk slower to each child because Johnny can't comprehend?

This is the reason public schools are currently failing. 30+ years of making excuses for Johnny.

If it's a learning problem...assist Johnny so he gets it...one on one if necessary. If it's a discipline problem and progressive discipline hasn't corrected the problem...let his parents deal with it...at home.

 

[steveh_131]

Correct. You didn't advocate dumbing it down. You advocate changing the curriculum each time some kid can't grasp the current concept.

They have special classes for this. I don't see holding every other child back because Johnny cannot or will not do as expected. I mean...do they need to talk slower to each child because Johnny can't comprehend?

This is the reason public schools are currently failing. 30+ years of making excuses for Johnny.

If it's a learning problem...assist Johnny so he gets it...one on one if necessary. If it's a discipline problem and progressive discipline hasn't corrected the problem...let his parents deal with it...at home.

See above quote by Albert Einstein. He sums it up much better than I can.

 

[Burr Head]

God help us!!! We're all gonna wake up one day and another flag will be flying without ever a shot fired. What happened to our country? BH

 

[public servant]

See above quote by Albert Einstein. He sums it up much better than I can.

Are you kidding me???

I went to public schools for the most part. I didn't understand a word of it.

But the lack of comprehension is no one's fault but my own.

 

[steveh_131]

Are you kidding me???

I went to public schools for the most part. I didn't understand a word of it.

But the lack of comprehension is no one's fault but my own.

He used a lot of big words, but I'm pretty sure he was saying that he used to make his fingers into a gun at school and got suspended for it.

 

[SemperFiUSMC]

Are you guys advocating beating children in schools? I think more people's agendas are showing.

There are few problems a paddle in the hallway didn't fix when I was a kid. Kids growing up now learn they can do whatever they want for 5 more seconds.

I would have no problem swatting a kid acting up in my class. Guess it's a good thing I'm not a teacher.

 

[turnandshoot4]

Yes, beat them for pointing a finger at someone.