Right to Work Bill

[ATM]

...So why do the big jobs go to the union contractors? It sure as hell has nothing to do with right to work.

Since, like you say, it has nothing to do with right to work, why all the fear and resistance to its passage?

 

[cordex]

Since, like you say, it has nothing to do with right to work, why all the fear and resistance to its passage?

This question keeps getting asked in different ways by different people in every thread about RTW and it has yet to be answered. Union members claim on the one hand how great and spectacular unions are, and on the other hand how RTW will totally destroy unions because everyone will up and leave as soon as they have the choice.

Doesn't make much sense to me.

 

[Roadie]

Since, like you say, it has nothing to do with right to work, why all the fear and resistance to its passage?

We STILL havent r'cvd an answer to that question, have we? Nor have I r'cvd one anywhere else I have asked it.

 

[mike8170]

I don't give a rat f**k if it passes or not! I am tired of being bashed on this forum for being a union carpenter. If you want your kids to go to a school that is built shoddily, then by all means, do it. Do you think there is one non-union outfit in Indiana that could have built the stadium? There isn't. Period. I have worked around non union outfits, pouring and finishing sidewalks, for example, and we had to cut the doors off the building in the winter because the[STRIKE] mexican[/STRIKE]hispanics didn't dowel where slab met sidewalks, and they heaved. Real fracking smart. But it is up to you, you can get what you pay for.

 

[Roadie]

I don't give a rat f**k if it passes or not! I am tired of being bashed on this forum for being a union carpenter. If you want your kids to go to a school that is built shoddily, then by all means, do it. Do you think there is one non-union outfit in Indiana that could have built the stadium? There isn't. Period. I have worked around non union outfits, pouring and finishing sidewalks, for example, and we had to cut the doors off the building in the winter because the[STRIKE] mexican[/STRIKE]hispanics didn't dowel where slab met sidewalks, and they heaved. Real fracking smart. But it is up to you, you can get what you pay for.

So people expressing an opinion opposite of yours, and asking you questions you can't(won't) answer is "bashing" you?

My aren't you just a wee bit sensitive..

 

[dross]

I don't give a rat f**k if it passes or not! I am tired of being bashed on this forum for being a union carpenter. If you want your kids to go to a school that is built shoddily, then by all means, do it. Do you think there is one non-union outfit in Indiana that could have built the stadium? There isn't. Period. I have worked around non union outfits, pouring and finishing sidewalks, for example, and we had to cut the doors off the building in the winter because the[STRIKE] mexican[/STRIKE]hispanics didn't dowel where slab met sidewalks, and they heaved. Real fracking smart. But it is up to you, you can get what you pay for.

Now I get it. Unions exist to save us from sub standard work performed by people who speak Spanish.

You guys are so hard on unions when all they want is for you to have your sidewalk poured correctly. Shame on you.

 

[mike8170]

So people expressing an opinion opposite of yours, and asking you questions you can't(won't) answer is "bashing" you?

My aren't you just a wee bit sensitive..

What questions have you asked? If you want to see how it really works, pull the dodge sheets up and see what contractors bid on jobs, and the amounts they have bid when the bids are open. It might wake a few people up.

And every union thread on this is nothing but bashing by people that have no clue what some do for a living. Iprovide a quality product for a reasonable rate. If you will go back on this thread, previously, I have worked with non-union that is just as good, but not big enough. I have worked around guys that make more than I do, with better benefits that are non-union, but they were all small time outfits. I have worked around non-union outfits that did sh*t work, that I was paid to go back and fix. Really saved the local government body or owner money, didn't it. Stop listening to political crap, do some research, and then make a decision. If unions were so bad, would all of Eli Lilly's buildings be built by union contractors? Lilly's is a private firm, they can hire whoever they want. Last big project I saw going there was Wilhelm Construction, a large union outfit.

 

[mike8170]

Now I get it. Unions exist to save us from sub standard work performed by people who speak Spanish.

You guys are so hard on unions when all they want is for you to have your sidewalk poured correctly. Shame on you.

My company was fined by OSHA, on my jobsite, $25,000.00 because I did not have a Spanish interpreter on the job for a contractor that the school corporation hired. NONE SPOKE ENGLISH. Nothing to do with our work, but we were the prime contractor. You going to tell me thats right?

 

[dross]

What questions have you asked? If you want to see how it really works, pull the dodge sheets up and see what contractors bid on jobs, and the amounts they have bid when the bids are open. It might wake a few people up.

And every union thread on this is nothing but bashing by people that have no clue what some do for a living. Iprovide a quality product for a reasonable rate. If you will go back on this thread, previously, I have worked with non-union that is just as good, but not big enough. I have worked around guys that make more than I do, with better benefits that are non-union, but they were all small time outfits. I have worked around non-union outfits that did sh*t work, that I was paid to go back and fix. Really saved the local government body or owner money, didn't it. Stop listening to political crap, do some research, and then make a decision. If unions were so bad, would all of Eli Lilly's buildings be built by union contractors? Lilly's is a private firm, they can hire whoever they want. Last big project I saw going there was Wilhelm Construction, a large union outfit.

I don't have anything against unions. My argument is with the laws that use force to give them an advantage.

 

[Roadie]

What questions have you asked? If you want to see how it really works, pull the dodge sheets up and see what contractors bid on jobs, and the amounts they have bid when the bids are open. It might wake a few people up.

And every union thread on this is nothing but bashing by people that have no clue what some do for a living. Iprovide a quality product for a reasonable rate. If you will go back on this thread, previously, I have worked with non-union that is just as good, but not big enough. I have worked around guys that make more than I do, with better benefits that are non-union, but they were all small time outfits. I have worked around non-union outfits that did sh*t work, that I was paid to go back and fix. Really saved the local government body or owner money, didn't it. Stop listening to political crap, do some research, and then make a decision. If unions were so bad, would all of Eli Lilly's buildings be built by union contractors? Lilly's is a private firm, they can hire whoever they want. Last big project I saw going there was Wilhelm Construction, a large union outfit.

There are over FIVE HUNDRED POSTS in this thread, and if you have to ask what questions have been asked then you have just proven that you haven't read even the last page or two of the thread, let alone the question asked directly of you!

You would rather whine and cry about how people are bashing you, (with no evidence thereof), while making irrelevant posts on non Union workers, than actually discuss the Bill.

May I suggest that you go back and read at least the last few pages of this thread? Heck, read just a the last FEW POSTS BACK even.

 

[ATM]

I don't give a rat f**k if it passes or not!

Then I'll rephrase my question:
Why do you think most of the union folks who have chimed in seem to fear and resist RTW passing?

Very few are even willing to discuss the limited scope of the actual bill.

I noticed that none of the rest of your responses even touched on the RTW subject.

 

[sepe]

Then I'll rephrase my question:
Why do you think most of the union folks who have chimed in seem to fear and resist RTW passing?

Very few are even willing to discuss the limited scope of the actual bill.

I noticed that none of the rest of your responses even touched on the RTW subject.

From seeing my friends comments on Facebook, they were told by union reps that they'd lose around $5,300/yr, workers comp, and then their jobs. Most haven't even thought about finding out what RTW actually is or does.

 

[Stschil]

From seeing my friends comments on Facebook, they were told by union reps that they'd lose around $5,300/yr, workers comp, and then their jobs. Most haven't even thought about finding out what RTW actually is or does.

Fear is a great motivator. Especially when that fear is instilled in a captive audience. Union shops in general have taught members to let them think for the collective. Individual thought/action is discouraged.

The point has been driven home time and time again in these threads, the Union group think mentality unfortunately not let it be realized.

To the Union Members: please see that your UNION BADGE does not make the quality of your product, YOU DO! If you have good leadership (don't read that as representation) like in any business union or no, the product will be better. If the workers take pride in what they do, the quality will increase.
Speaking to the Trades: If an outfit does not produce good work, their record should be taken into account during the bid process. The fact that a shop is union should not. Do some of the larger outfits have union contracts?, sure they do, nothing wrong with that, however don't place credit for quality on the Union, give it to ones that deserve it, the Individuals.

RTW gives the Individual the freedom to choose his/her own path. Think about it this way, if I choose to represent myself that makes me and me alone responsible for getting My job done correctly. If I have not fulfilled my end of the bargain. Bye bye me, QED. When a union member doesn't do his/her job correctly, even if it is recognized, your union spends your money to at the very least, make sure Joe Dirtbag, is fired in the proper manner.
It wastes time and money and therefore adds to the cost of goods for all.

 

[ATOMonkey]

You guys crack me up! I love checking out this thread for my morning lulz...

 

[LockStocksAndBarrel]

You people that favor RTW are just a bunch of haters! Why can't you just keep your logic to yourselves and let everyone's emotions override critical thought?

Ouch! My butt hurts!

 

[dross]

From seeing my friends comments on Facebook, they were told by union reps that they'd lose around $5,300/yr, workers comp, and then their jobs. Most haven't even thought about finding out what RTW actually is or does.

Think about that for a second. They're saying that a significant portion of their paycheck and the very fact they have a job is based mainly on the power that men with guns have to make others behave contrary to their own self-interest, and against the interest of non-union workers.

What a shame if your job depends on someone forcing others to give you things you can't get them to give you through fair trade.

I make more than union workers and there never has been a union in my field. I wonder why my employer pays me so much with no one forcing him to?

The proof against their argument is contained in their argument.

 

[mike8170]

Then I'll rephrase my question:
Why do you think most of the union folks who have chimed in seem to fear and resist RTW passing?

Very few are even willing to discuss the limited scope of the actual bill.

I noticed that none of the rest of your responses even touched on the RTW subject.

My responses have touched on union bashing, and some personal experience of what I have had happen on projects, and what I have seen. RTW is for our elected officials to debate, as they are paid to do. I haven't even read RTW, so I won't comment on the bill.

 

[1911 DeadHead]

I work in Illinois as a union electrician, but I could possibly transfer to Indiana. My biggest gripe, personally, with this bill is if I had transferred and put on a book(list) for employment, this is how some locals work, and a big job got called in, thw possibility of my position being taken by a non union electrician is quite possible. I dont like that. I don't know if this is really gonna affect the big from not hiring union contractors, but maybe. I hope the best for ALL, but if my brothers are stuck sitting at home because of jobs being taken by non union, that will start to bother me. Thats my only gripe. Then maybe union workers will be FORCED, since people like to use that word here, to leave the union. The past 3 years has been horrible for any trade to find work in the whole country union or not. I hope all you union bashers are right and that the economy will flourish because of this bill, but I doubt it will change much.

 

[kludge]

No one is keeping you from applying for the non-union job.

 

[CarmelHP]

I work in Illinois as a union electrician, but I could possibly transfer to Indiana. My biggest gripe, personally, with this bill is if I had transferred and put on a book(list) for employment, this is how some locals work, and a big job got called in, thw possibility of my position being taken by a non union electrician is quite possible.

The heart of the issue! Making a barrier to entry to stop other people from competing fairly for work. Unions are for screwing the other guy!