INGO Argument Match ...Alpha: In The Big Inning

The #1 community for Gun Owners in Indiana

Member Benefits:

  • Fewer Ads!
  • Discuss all aspects of firearm ownership
  • Discuss anti-gun legislation
  • Buy, sell, and trade in the classified section
  • Chat with Local gun shops, ranges, trainers & other businesses
  • Discover free outdoor shooting areas
  • View up to date on firearm-related events
  • Share photos & video with other members
  • ...and so much more!
  • ATM

    will argue for sammiches.
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    30   0   0
    Jul 29, 2008
    21,019
    83
    Crawfordsville
    INGO Argument Match ...Alpha: In The Big Inning

    This is how an INGO Argument Match might work:

    Find someone willing to argue or defend a point, make a new thread and add INGO Argument Match in the title, then proceed to whup the snot out of their belief or position and (optionally) whup the snot out of anyone daring enough to attempt to rescue them from you. ;)

    Sounds simple enough, right? Sounds like fun, right? Cool, I thought so, too. :cool:

    In this match, PaulF will be defending an atheist position and I will be tearing it down and ridiculing it from a theist position. This is voluntary.

    I will begin by admitting that, as a finite being, I do not, and believe that I cannot fully grasp and comprehend infinity. This will not stop me from discussing what can be known about infinity including the paradoxical nature of attempting to make it fit within or obey our fundamental principles of math. I can only assume that Paul will try to argue the absence of infinity, though I'm not sure how.

    I will bring up light, though I admittedly only know a tiny bit about light. I might bring up that light has a measurable speed. When PaulF tries to argue from a position of darkness, I will ask him to first define darkness without defaulting to the mere absence of light (which is mine).

    I will take the position of knowledge (that it is possible to know something, even if we can't know all things). If PaulF tries to defend or promote a position of ignorance, I will ask him to define ignorance without defaulting to the mere absence of knowledge.

    I will argue heat, leaving Paul to define his belief in [STRIKE]the absence of heat[/STRIKE] cold.

    I will argue life, leaving Paul to champion and promote [STRIKE]the absence of life[/STRIKE] death.

    I will...

    Well, you get the picture. I will win. ;)
     

    ATM

    will argue for sammiches.
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    30   0   0
    Jul 29, 2008
    21,019
    83
    Crawfordsville
    So...strawmen then?

    Or are you actually going to ask a question I can (attempt to) answer?

    Why do you think I need to ask you questions?

    lol - oops, that was a question. :)

    Would your belief even have a name without mine?

    oops, there went another.

    SOMEBODY STOP ME!
     

    jbombelli

    ITG Certified
    Rating - 100%
    10   0   0
    May 17, 2008
    13,012
    113
    Brownsburg, IN
    received_1206729402671327_zpsl2zkhawz.gif
     

    Rookie

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    14   0   0
    Sep 22, 2008
    18,175
    113
    Kokomo
    SOMEBODY STOP ME!

    Good idea. Here's a better idea, show some maturity and stop yourself.

    Seriously, I'm not sure what your issue is, but you're not going to convince anyone of anything by being obnoxious and abrasive.
     

    ATM

    will argue for sammiches.
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    30   0   0
    Jul 29, 2008
    21,019
    83
    Crawfordsville
    Good idea. Here's a better idea, show some maturity and stop yourself.

    Seriously, I'm not sure what your issue is, but you're not going to convince anyone of anything by being obnoxious and abrasive.

    What do you believe I'm trying to convince you of?
     

    PaulF

    Shooter
    Rating - 100%
    8   0   0
    Apr 4, 2009
    3,045
    83
    Indianapolis
    Why do you think I need to ask you questions?

    Because I am not going to write anything unless you do.

    lol - oops, that was a question. :)

    Would your belief even have a name without mine?

    Would atheism exist without theism? Yes, of course it would. If no one believed in theism everyone would be atheist...by definition. Would people call life without gods "atheism"? No, probably not...we'd probably just call it "life".

    oops, there went another.

    SOMEBODY STOP ME!

    Is this why you brought me here? Is this really the best you have? Srawmen and ad hominem...no substance?

    Maybe you should stop.
     

    LEaSH

    Grandmaster
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    43   0   0
    Aug 10, 2009
    5,816
    119
    Indianapolis
    I've kinda grown to admire ATM's, err ah wordiness.

    I don't think he really bothers anyone, does he?

    Nothing here is that big of a deal.
     

    ATM

    will argue for sammiches.
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    30   0   0
    Jul 29, 2008
    21,019
    83
    Crawfordsville
    Would you rather I pick your beliefs apart line by line? I'll bet they are weakly held and nobody has ever really challenged you to defend them. You know I'm going to eventually. When I please. Are you ready?

    It really depends. In practice the line is quite blurry.

    I have never described myself as agnostic. It feels insincere. Agnostic either means one is "unsure", or it means that the answer is "unknowable". Neither is true for me.

    I am not conflicted. I do not spend time and effort weighing the options between a world without gods compared to a world where gods exist, but in such a way where their actions are indistinguishable from their absence.

    I also think if gods existed their interactions and requirements would remain consistent over time and over distance. If gods existed it would be obvious, as people from all over the world would come to the same religious conclusions regardless of their contact with outside ideas. If gods really existed a person that lived their entire life in isolation would have just as deep an understanding of God as the most educated scholar...since they both received their message directly from the source...the same source.

    So, I think if gods existed it would be knowable...and that's one of the key reasons I do not believe in anyone else's gods.
     

    PaulF

    Shooter
    Rating - 100%
    8   0   0
    Apr 4, 2009
    3,045
    83
    Indianapolis
    Would you rather I pick your beliefs apart line by line? I'll bet they are weakly held and nobody has ever really challenged you to defend them. You know I'm going to eventually. When I please. Are you ready?

    Yes, Alan, I am ready for you to make some sort of point.

    Go ahead and tear down my weakly held, unchallenged, and indefensible beliefs...anything is better than your poorly executed straw men.
     

    chezuki

    Human
    Rating - 100%
    48   0   0
    Mar 18, 2009
    34,158
    113
    Behind Bars
    Unrelated question...

    Is there a way to block entire threads from showing on INGO? Say, if a thread or group of threads were so particularly asinine that you'd rather not even have to see them when browsing a subforum you frequent?



    ...asking for a friend.
     

    ATM

    will argue for sammiches.
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    30   0   0
    Jul 29, 2008
    21,019
    83
    Crawfordsville
    Yes, Alan, I am ready for you to make some sort of point.

    Go ahead and tear down my weakly held, unchallenged, and indefensible beliefs...anything is better than your poorly executed straw men.

    OK, I'll certainly get around to that. But, first, I wanted to stress the challenge of the actual task you seem to have never considered in formulating this position for yourself.

    All things in existence are at my disposal, for all things belong to my God.

    Only the absence of those things are available to you, for your god is absent.

    I won't get around to using all things to expose that your belief is bankrupt, in fact, the admission that you have no means of even beginning rather serves to make my point, but they are all available to me.

    No weapon formed against my God can prevail (as if you even possessed anything He didn't provide for you).

    You are a pot attempting to deny the potter. At most, He only left you the option of dismissing Him.

    Again, good luck, friend. :)
     

    Jludo

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    3   0   0
    Feb 14, 2013
    4,164
    48
    Indianapolis
    OK, I'll certainly get around to that. But, first, I wanted to stress the challenge of the actual task you seem to have never considered in formulating this position for yourself.

    All things in existence are at my disposal, for all things belong to my God.

    Only the absence of those things are available to you, for your god is absent.

    I won't get around to using all things to expose that your belief is bankrupt, in fact, the admission that you have no means of even beginning rather serves to make my point, but they are all available.

    No weapon formed against my God can prevail (as if you even possessed anything He didn't provide for you).

    You are a pot attempting to deny the potter. At most, He only left you the option of dismissing Him.

    Again, good luck, friend. :)

    I want to see an Egyptian god Ra v ATM's god debate. What makes one more likely than the other?
     
    Top Bottom