Government vs. Production

[hoosieridentity]

Government vs. Production


"More Americans work for the government than work in construction, farming, fishing, forestry, manufacturing, mining and utilities combined," explained Moore. Even Michigan, at one time the auto capital of the world, and Pennsylvania, once the steel capital," reported Moore, "have more government bureaucrats than people making things."

Government vs. Production

~ Brian

 

[Lucas156]

this is not surprising at all. People living off the hard work of other people.

 

[45fan]

It is easier to control the masses when they look to the government for their paycheck. Just think how much lower our taxes would be if the government stopped hiring a new person or starting a new office or position every time somebody needs an envelope licked.

 

[SideArmed]

Please don't think all of us are the same. I find it better to specify which sector of the "government" you are refering to when you want to bash government employee's. I have worked for the GOV in one way or another for the last 11+ years, and can firmly attest to the fact that the majority of the people that I have worked with are more like you and me than you think.

 

[Garb]

Please don't think all of us are the same. I find it better to specify which sector of the "government" you are refering to when you want to bash government employee's. I have worked for the GOV in one way or another for the last 11+ years, and can firmly attest to the fact that the majority of the people that I have worked with are more like you and me than you think.

Are you allowed to tell us where you work? lol

 

[dross]

Please don't think all of us are the same. I find it better to specify which sector of the "government" you are refering to when you want to bash government employee's. I have worked for the GOV in one way or another for the last 11+ years, and can firmly attest to the fact that the majority of the people that I have worked with are more like you and me than you think.

Regardless of your individual qualities, and regardless of whether your particular government job is actually useful, all government workers are still a drain on productivity. Some are a necessary drain on productivity, but a drain nonetheless.

 

[SideArmed]

Are you allowed to tell us where you work? lol

I am allowed to. Just not going to on a public forum at this time.

Regardless of your individual qualities, and regardless of whether your particular government job is actually useful, all government workers are still a drain on productivity. Some are a necessary drain on productivity, but a drain nonetheless.

Please explain how I, and many others that are on this forum, because I know I am not alone, are a "drain on productivity" and who's productivity am I draining. Not trying to incite a riot or anything, I am sincerely curious as to your view on this.

 

[shibumiseeker]

Please explain how I, and many others that are on this forum, because I know I am not alone, are a "drain on productivity" and who's productivity am I draining. Not trying to incite a riot or anything, I am sincerely curious as to your view on this.

Productivity means you produce something. Either you make stuff out of raw materials, or you take the stuff made from raw materials and make more stuff out of it, or you are someone who makes it easier and better for those who make the stuff.

Everyone else is just a parasite on that productivity. Some of those parasitic loads are necessary to a degree. In our system, most are not.

As an example, I own a very small company that manufactures stuff. I'm a one man shop. Fully 1/3 of my time is complying with government paperwork at all levels from local to federal. It gets worse if I want to hire one employee.

Imagine how much more productive I could be if I didn't have to spend that much time. How much bigger could I build the business if a quarter of my gross didn't go towards taxes in one form or another.

 

[dross]

Please explain how I, and many others that are on this forum, because I know I am not alone, are a "drain on productivity" and who's productivity am I draining. Not trying to incite a riot or anything, I am sincerely curious as to your view on this.

Please understand that this isn't a value judgment on you.

Let's say I have a small shop. One guy makes stuff, one guy sells the stuff, I manage it, and the janitor cleans it.

Only two people in that organization produce, the maker and the salesman. The other two of us are (hopefully) necessary evils.

This is even more true for the government. The productivity you are draining is your cost in taxes on the product someone else produces.

If my maker doesn't make and my salesman doesn't sell, I have nothing to manage and my janitor has nothing to clean up, and there are no taxes to pay for your government function. All of us live off their production.

Now, my janitor and I are much closer to the production process than you, and hopefully, if my company is well-run, we perform tasks that help the producers to produce.

As a government worker, you most likely only drain the productivity without helping it in any way. Your function MIGHT be necessary and important, though I would argue that most government jobs are not. But even if you are there are only a very, very few government jobs that in any way support production.

 

[Pocketman]

Government workers don't really pay taxes either. They just return some of what they received in compensation. This then contributes to the burden on the private sector, assuming they pay taxes, which many do not.

 

[45fan]

Please don't think all of us are the same. I find it better to specify which sector of the "government" you are refering to when you want to bash government employee's. I have worked for the GOV in one way or another for the last 11+ years, and can firmly attest to the fact that the majority of the people that I have worked with are more like you and me than you think.

Honestly, I dont typically think of the people who work for the government so much as the politicians that have turned it into the mess that so many of us love to disagree with.
I apologize if I offended with that generalization.

 

[SideArmed]

Productivity means you produce something. Either you make stuff out of raw materials, or you take the stuff made from raw materials and make more stuff out of it, or you are someone who makes it easier and better for those who make the stuff......

OK, so you just described my job. I make stuff, and I repair said made stuff and keep it in service for years and years and years.

I understand that there are sections of government that basically suck. But I am pretty sure that there are A LOT of good government employees are very happy with the job they do and are a benefit to society.
I guess what I am getting at is that I hear the "ALL GOV Employees are worthless" line all the time and take great exception to it.

Everyone is so quick with Thank You for Your Service to the Country to military members, and then turn around and bash "Government Employees" completely forgetting that Military is a part of that Government Employee group as well.

 

[J man]

Think how much higher our unemployment rates would be if it were not for our Gov't workers. I am guessing in the 20% range.

 

[cbseniour]

I don't think its the people who work for the government. But if you talk to a lot of leftists they don't see a thing wrong here.

 

[45fan]

I think the point that is trying to be made is that government is a drain to the funds generated by taxes. Even though government employees pay taxes, every dollar that they are payed originated as tax dollars, so it isnt putting more money in, only giving some back.
That isnt to say that you dont work for your paycheck, and I am sure you are of value to society, but productive in the sense that your position adds to tax funds it is not.

 

[SideArmed]

Government workers don't really pay taxes either. They just return some of what they received in compensation. This then contributes to the burden on the private sector, assuming they pay taxes, which many do not.

Really??? I pay taxes. Yes some of that is in theory returned to me in my paycheck, but I still have to pay in just as much to all the other bull as everyone else, like social security (what a joke), welfare, ect., and my money goes towards whatever goofy spending plans the GOV decides to come up with just as yours does.
I see where you are coming from on this though, since the money originated as tax payer dollars. But I still see the hits in the check every two weeks just like everyone else.

Honestly, I dont typically think of the people who work for the government so much as the politicians that have turned it into the mess that so many of us love to disagree with.
I apologize if I offended with that generalization.

I think that is the stance most people have. There are very large differences between the politicians and people such as myself, not that I am some elite section of government or something.
No offence taken. I understand what most people are getting at when they are pissed at the politicians, as I am most of the time as well. It's just that a lot of people take a hard-line stance with GOV employees, without realizing that there are differences between the politicians and employees.

 

[hornadylnl]

Sidearmed. What's the difference if the government pays you $100 and takes $20 back in taxes or pays you $80 with no taxes. The end result is the same. Taking "taxes" out of a government employees check is shuffling the boat chairs on the deck.

Here's a question for you. Do corporations pay taxes?

 

[Pocketman]

... Here's a question for you. Do corporations pay taxes?

Consumers pay taxes through purchasing goods and services from corporations.

Sidarmed, when I was a LEO a real nice gentlemen, who was in a less than nice frame of mind, told me that he paid my salary and was obligated to do what he asked. I told him there were thousands of other people who pay me to protect them from people like him. As it turned out, he worked for a local retailer where my wife shopped. So, I guess we paid each others' salaries. Let's face it, an economy is little more than people passing money around in exchange for goods and services.

 

[hornadylnl]

And I wonder how much corporations spend every year just complying with the tax code. I'm not talking about actually paying the tax, I'm talking about paying accountant salaries, etc. Their customers pay 100% of that. Saying that government employees pay taxes is of the same logic that we can somehow tax corporate profits and not a single penny of that added cost will be passed on to the consumer.

 

[Bunnykid68]

A lot of government jobs are over paid because they are government jobs. A temp mail delivery person makes 26.12 an hour...I mean really????? maybe in New York city but in a small town that is ridiculous. It is not that hard to deliver mail.