For those who have not heard the story about how semi-auto shotguns came into the market, this is a kicker.
In 1898 John Moses Browning came up with the design now known as the Auto5. He knew he had something special when he held it in his hands. Now, the Browning Brothers had an agreement with Winchester Repeating Arms to where Winchester would purchase two designs from the Browning's each year. They would normally bring a working prototype to Winchester, their gun designer (TC Johnson) would go over it and take out as many patents as they could to prevent infringement once the gun came into production.
Later, when they are about to tool up they would get together in a room and hash out the compensation. (The 1885 drop block was the first joint venture between Winchester and Browning.) This time the compensation requested would be different. Browning did not want to give up his rights to the gun and wanted to be paid royalties on each unit produced. Well, Oliver's son wasn't going to have any of this so they came to an impasse. History seldom mentions the third Browning brother, the youngest, but it is said he could really get under Winchester's skin. In the end John said I have to offer them two designs a year but it wouldn't include this one so give me my gun back.
Winchester at the time had many high level lawmakers in their pocket and they felt they could keep him from producing his design and eventually he would have to come crawling back to them on his knees with a much more profitable (to them) offer. Instead he went over seas to FN and they got started on production. Winchester *suggested* that import tariffs be raised as to make it unprofitable to import foreign made firearms. So John went to Remington and said, "How would you boys like to make an auto loading shotgun?" And thus we have the Remington Model 11. Remington got all the American sales and FN got the foreign sales.
Meanwhile Winchester is making boom boom in his knickers. He goes to their best designer, TC Johnson, and tells him to make their own semi auto shotgun and make sure he doesn't violate ANY of the patents that he himself had applied for to prevent such an occurrence. It took him 10 long years, but he did it. The 1911 sl (for Self Loading). One of the patents he was not to infringe on is the bolt handle. Browning's design was the first to make need of any such device and TC had made sure no one else could use one. So to do an end run around that he knurled a portion of the barrel to provide grip to compress the barrel into the receiver to to load the chamber. What could possibly go wrong?
Gun safety wasn't as big back then but I am certain the results would have been the same. People would leave the butt of the gun on the ground and press down on it like they were churning butter. Did I mention this design had a tendency to 'slam fire', well it did. I am sure it looked like three monkeys trying to have relations with a football. End result is this shotgun earned the endearing name of "Widow-maker".
If you get a chance to get inside one of these guns, the engineering (or I could say over engineering) of this thing is mind blowing. There is absolutely nothing about this gun that is intuitive! The more and more obscure it becomes seems to make it more dangerous. In 2005 four police offices were wounded trying to unload one of these shotguns.
When it came out in 1911 it was the highest priced weapon that was assembly line produced by Winchester at that time. As evidenced by the fact most of you have probably never seen or heard of one would let you know it didn't go over that big. They are difficult to find BUT reasonably affordable when you do (as a Winchester goes). They never came with a Walnut stock which, to me, is something I had come to expect from Winchester. All were made of a three piece laminated Beech. They had buffer discs (2 of them) that would wear out and need replaced which seldom if ever happened. When they got hard on the shoulder just put a pad on it until it broke itself apart.
The nicest one I have found for sale, and bought, was from a skeet club in Pa. I was the only bidder and they threw in shipping to make sure it was really gone. In reality, properly maintained and with strict firearm safety, these are the Cadillac's of the semi autos. If you feel the shot it needs serviced. The problem is that the buffer discs have gone the way of the dinosaur. Loving on them has become a side line for me. I have disassembled, cleaned and fired all of mine but today I take it to the next level. I started a total redo on the one from Pennsylvania.
I forgot to take a 'before picture' so the whole gun is another from my stable that will be done in the future. I have at least one more hiding around here somewhere...
These are all the parts...
As usual the forearm is cracked, it seems to be a right of passage...
In 1898 John Moses Browning came up with the design now known as the Auto5. He knew he had something special when he held it in his hands. Now, the Browning Brothers had an agreement with Winchester Repeating Arms to where Winchester would purchase two designs from the Browning's each year. They would normally bring a working prototype to Winchester, their gun designer (TC Johnson) would go over it and take out as many patents as they could to prevent infringement once the gun came into production.
Later, when they are about to tool up they would get together in a room and hash out the compensation. (The 1885 drop block was the first joint venture between Winchester and Browning.) This time the compensation requested would be different. Browning did not want to give up his rights to the gun and wanted to be paid royalties on each unit produced. Well, Oliver's son wasn't going to have any of this so they came to an impasse. History seldom mentions the third Browning brother, the youngest, but it is said he could really get under Winchester's skin. In the end John said I have to offer them two designs a year but it wouldn't include this one so give me my gun back.
Winchester at the time had many high level lawmakers in their pocket and they felt they could keep him from producing his design and eventually he would have to come crawling back to them on his knees with a much more profitable (to them) offer. Instead he went over seas to FN and they got started on production. Winchester *suggested* that import tariffs be raised as to make it unprofitable to import foreign made firearms. So John went to Remington and said, "How would you boys like to make an auto loading shotgun?" And thus we have the Remington Model 11. Remington got all the American sales and FN got the foreign sales.
Meanwhile Winchester is making boom boom in his knickers. He goes to their best designer, TC Johnson, and tells him to make their own semi auto shotgun and make sure he doesn't violate ANY of the patents that he himself had applied for to prevent such an occurrence. It took him 10 long years, but he did it. The 1911 sl (for Self Loading). One of the patents he was not to infringe on is the bolt handle. Browning's design was the first to make need of any such device and TC had made sure no one else could use one. So to do an end run around that he knurled a portion of the barrel to provide grip to compress the barrel into the receiver to to load the chamber. What could possibly go wrong?
Gun safety wasn't as big back then but I am certain the results would have been the same. People would leave the butt of the gun on the ground and press down on it like they were churning butter. Did I mention this design had a tendency to 'slam fire', well it did. I am sure it looked like three monkeys trying to have relations with a football. End result is this shotgun earned the endearing name of "Widow-maker".
If you get a chance to get inside one of these guns, the engineering (or I could say over engineering) of this thing is mind blowing. There is absolutely nothing about this gun that is intuitive! The more and more obscure it becomes seems to make it more dangerous. In 2005 four police offices were wounded trying to unload one of these shotguns.
When it came out in 1911 it was the highest priced weapon that was assembly line produced by Winchester at that time. As evidenced by the fact most of you have probably never seen or heard of one would let you know it didn't go over that big. They are difficult to find BUT reasonably affordable when you do (as a Winchester goes). They never came with a Walnut stock which, to me, is something I had come to expect from Winchester. All were made of a three piece laminated Beech. They had buffer discs (2 of them) that would wear out and need replaced which seldom if ever happened. When they got hard on the shoulder just put a pad on it until it broke itself apart.
The nicest one I have found for sale, and bought, was from a skeet club in Pa. I was the only bidder and they threw in shipping to make sure it was really gone. In reality, properly maintained and with strict firearm safety, these are the Cadillac's of the semi autos. If you feel the shot it needs serviced. The problem is that the buffer discs have gone the way of the dinosaur. Loving on them has become a side line for me. I have disassembled, cleaned and fired all of mine but today I take it to the next level. I started a total redo on the one from Pennsylvania.
I forgot to take a 'before picture' so the whole gun is another from my stable that will be done in the future. I have at least one more hiding around here somewhere...
These are all the parts...
As usual the forearm is cracked, it seems to be a right of passage...
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