To Mask or Not to Mask?

[gunworks321]

Has anyone considered that this is somewhat analogues to the Walking Dead? Could we all be infected and some have symptoms and some do not but still have it, and some percentage will die from it? Then to take it out into the future, how long will it be around and keep mutating? Also kinda like World War Z. Or alternately the Apocalypse. Just random thoughts to clear the brain sleepiness. Wear a mask where necessary. At home... nope, while driving... nope. In a crowded store... you betcha.

 

[jamil]

Wear your mask....

https://video.twimg.com/amplify_video/1349437537857789955/vid/946x720/YsbDADlzNWs36PIZ.mp4?tag=13

Oh come on. What do you expect him to do? Sneeze into his mask so that he'll have that hocker smeared all over his face? Ewww.

 

[jamil]

Masks are not like seatbelts. I agree with you that seatbelt laws are ridiculous. Masks are like septic systems.

Air and water are similar in that it's far easier to keep them clean and safe by prevention than it is to filter/purify out contaminants at the point of use. Septic systems and sewage treatment plants are required because even one person's fecal bacteria getting into the drinking water supply can cause serious risks for an entire community. Same thing for one person exhaling a virus into the shared air supply.

Full of ****?

Wait. Air and water are similar to septic systems? Dude, you are not starting off well here.

But seriously. I think we need to start imagining a world where we don't think we have to wear masks, not a world where it's perpetually justified.

It doesn't look to me like we will eliminate this virus. I think we just need to learn how to live with it and get on with things. If you're worried about the symptoms killing you, take the vaccine. Maybe that'll help.

 

[jamil]

Has anyone considered that this is somewhat analogues to the Walking Dead? Could we all be infected and some have symptoms and some do not but still have it, and some percentage will die from it? Then to take it out into the future, how long will it be around and keep mutating? Also kinda like World War Z. Or alternately the Apocalypse. Just random thoughts to clear the brain sleepiness. Wear a mask where necessary. At home... nope, while driving... nope. In a crowded store... you betcha.

Some research came out and said that in the future the virus will be a lot like the common cold. A child's illness as we build up immunity to it as it burns through the population. That article was removed from the publication.

 

[jamil]

I just saw a video from FNC on YouTube. One of the executive orders that he’ll sign in the first 10 days: interstate travelers must wear masks.

**** Biden.

 

[NHT3]

I've had a belly full of the masks and I submit Dr. Charlie A. Fauci (NHT3's) opinion on masks. First my disclaimer, I'm not an American physician or immunologist BUT I can read. From what I can ascertain there is little or no reason to wear a mask. It's nothing more than a virtue signal demanded by the people that want to control every aspect of our lives.
Here's the science or at least the facts. Disagree if you like but please supply some facts similar to what I have supplied with your argument.
Common sense tells me if I can smell cigarette smoke or air freshener with my mask on a virus will readily pass through the same mask. The highly touted N95 mask is designed to stop 95% of particles that are .03 microns or larger. The largest virus is .03 microns and the smallest is .005 microns. In general the masks most people wear are not N95 so any and all viruses will pass through them. The chart I've supplied states relative sizes of particles so you can see for yourself that the masks that are in general use have no ability to protect or defend against a virus. Social distancing and washing your hands are the only effective methods most of us have to prevent virus transmission. I'm sincere when I say if anyone thinks I'm off base please tell me, I don't see it.
Keep the numbers in mind the next time you dutifully don your new master's (CCPJoe's) mandated mask. Just my .02

 

[churchmouse]

I just saw a video from FNC on YouTube. One of the executive orders that he’ll sign in the first 10 days: interstate travelers must wear masks.

**** Biden.

Twice.

This has got to stop. Now.

 

[NKBJ]

 

[nonobaddog]

I've had a belly full of the masks and I submit Dr. Charlie A. Fauci (NHT3's) opinion on masks. First my disclaimer, I'm not an American physician or immunologist BUT I can read. From what I can ascertain there is little or no reason to wear a mask. It's nothing more than a virtue signal demanded by the people that want to control every aspect of our lives.
Here's the science or at least the facts. Disagree if you like but please supply some facts similar to what I have supplied with your argument.
Common sense tells me if I can smell cigarette smoke or air freshener with my mask on a virus will readily pass through the same mask. The highly touted N95 mask is designed to stop 95% of particles that are .03 microns or larger. The largest virus is .03 microns and the smallest is .005 microns. In general the masks most people wear are not N95 so any and all viruses will pass through them. The chart I've supplied states relative sizes of particles so you can see for yourself that the masks that are in general use have no ability to protect or defend against a virus. Social distancing and washing your hands are the only effective methods most of us have to prevent virus transmission. I'm sincere when I say if anyone thinks I'm off base please tell me, I don't see it.
Keep the numbers in mind the next time you dutifully don your new master's (CCPJoe's) mandated mask. Just my .02

View attachment 121507

You are off on one major point. The size used to certify respirator masks is 0.3 microns. That size is used because it is a particularly difficult size to filter. N/P/R 95 masks stop at least 95% of 0.3 micron particles. They stop more than 95% of particles both smaller and larger than 0.3 microns.

So they are better than 95% at stopping the virus size particles.

 

[phylodog]

You are off on one major point. The size used to certify respirator masks is 0.3 microns. That size is used because it is a particularly difficult size to filter. N/P/R 95 masks stop at least 95% of 0.3 micron particles. They stop more than 95% of particles both smaller and larger than 0.3 microns.

So they are better than 95% at stopping the virus size particles.

This was the first cite I could find. Do you have a better one? Not being smart, I'm legitimately curious.

"They are said to remove 95% of airborne particles that are at least 0.3 microns in diameter" (emphasis added)

https://wellnessnova.com/r95-vs-n95-face-masks/#5-what-are-n95-masks

 

[nonobaddog]

I posted this about a month ago (post 3,351). The link below can tell you much more than you want to know about good mask filtration.

This is a very common misconception. The masks are rated at 0.3 microns because particles in that size range are some of the most difficult to filter. That is exactly why 0.3 microns was chosen to evaluate and certify filter materials.
The 0.3 micron rating is NOT a cutoff size and and does NOT mean it filters particles "down to" that size.

The filter material in the 95 masks and the 100 masks (regardless whether they are "N", "P" or "R") will filter particles bigger than 0.3 microns as well as particles smaller than 0.3 microns at a higher efficiency than the 0.3 micron particles.

This is a well known phenomenon and this fact has been stated many times but people just don't get it - probably because it is not intuitive plus they just don't want to get it.

This is a NASA article that explains how this works. It is technical so if you don't want to read it just look at the graph on page 7.
https://www.usairpurifiers.com/media/BSE/NASA-HEPA-report-7-2020.pdf

The toy masks that you see everybody wearing everywhere are not like this - they don't filter much at all. There is no point in blaming good respirator masks and saying they don't work because they do and they have been working well for a long time. Blame the mandates to wear crappy masks that don't work, that is the problem.

 

[phylodog]

Thank you. I didn't take my link as gospel but I was surprised at how little info came up. I'm used to Google though, dumped them for DuckDuckGo last week and it's a little different.

 

[MCgrease08]

Just anecdotally I would say people are starting to get tired of wearing masks. I took a trip to the grocery store around 6 pm last night and saw more people shopping without masks then I have in quite some time. At least 6 that I counted and the store was not very crowded.

That might not seem like a lot, but it's been a while since I can recall seeing anyone inside that store without one on.

None of the store employees seemed to care and I didn't notice any of the other shoppers visibly shooting dirty looks or going out of their way to avoid walking by people without them.

 

[NHT3]

You are off on one major point. The size used to certify respirator masks is 0.3 microns. That size is used because it is a particularly difficult size to filter. N/P/R 95 masks stop at least 95% of 0.3 micron particles. They stop more than 95% of particles both smaller and larger than 0.3 microns.

So they are better than 95% at stopping the virus size particles.

The fact still remains that most people don't have N95 masks and most people don't wear the masks they have properly.
Also, I read the data that about the 3 micron particle being difficult to trap but please don't ask me to believe a .05 micron particle is easier to trap than a 3 micron particle. As I said, credibility is important and the people spewing the numbers don't have any.
I have a net that catches 95% of the golf balls I throw at it but it is theoreticly better at catching BBs. Sorry that math just doesn't add up for me. Anything is possible but that is so far out there I can't buy it.

 

[jamil]

Just anecdotally I would say people are starting to get tired of wearing masks. I took a trip to the grocery store around 6 pm last night and saw more people shopping without masks then I have in quite some time. At least 6 that I counted and the store was not very crowded.

That might not seem like a lot, but it's been a while since I can recall seeing anyone inside that store without one on.

None of the store employees seemed to care and I didn't notice any of the other shoppers visibly shooting dirty looks or going out of their way to avoid walking by people without them.

 

[chipbennett]

I head back to Covid Paranoia Central (Orange County, CA) next week. I don't expect things to have changed since I was there last month.

 

[buckwacker]

I head back to Covid Paranoia Central (Orange County, CA) next week. I don't expect things to have changed since I was there last month.

Well the religious mask wearing and lockdowns have put covid cases on a steep decline. Oh wait.....

 

[jamil]

I head back to Covid Paranoia Central (Orange County, CA) next week. I don't expect things to have changed since I was there last month.

Let us know what rituals they perform for their masks. Like do they light candles and pray to them before putting them on? Is there a ceremony involved? Maybe a get-together on zoom for a call and response session with family members in isolated parts of the house? Do they splash holy water on them before donning?

Does CA impose a fine for not wearing a mask while on the ****ter at home, in their own bathrooms, alone?

 

[chipbennett]

Let us know what rituals they perform for their masks. Like do they light candles and pray to them before putting them on? Is there a ceremony involved? Maybe a get-together on zoom for a call and response session with family members in isolated parts of the house? Do they splash holy water on them before donning?

Does CA impose a fine for not wearing a mask while on the shitter, at home, in their own bathrooms, alone?

That depends on whether or not your last name is "Newsom".

They do have a regional "stay at home" order in place. (Essential workers exempted - not that I would be out there for any other reason.)

 

[nonobaddog]

The fact still remains that most people don't have N95 masks and most people don't wear the masks they have properly.
Also, I read the data that about the 3 micron particle being difficult to trap but please don't ask me to believe a .05 micron particle is easier to trap than a 3 micron particle. As I said, credibility is important and the people spewing the numbers don't have any.
I have a net that catches 95% of the golf balls I throw at it but it is theoreticly better at catching BBs. Sorry that math just doesn't add up for me. Anything is possible but that is so far out there I can't buy it.

I agree people do not have good masks available and that they frequently don't even wear their crappy masks right.

But about the small particles - The size you mean is 0.3 micron, not 3 micron.

The filtration you are talking about is sieving. This is where the particles are trapped because they are too big to get through the holes. That is only one mechanism for trapping particles. In sieving it is very true that bigger particles are easier to trap than smaller particles.

Did you ever notice that furnace filters catch a lot of tiny dust particles in spite of having visibly huge holes through them? Even a cursory reading on filtration will show there are other mechanisms involved, like - Inertial, Interception, Diffusion. A simplistic description of these would be that the tiny particles stick to the filter strands rather than being physically trapped. So these mechanisms work more based on the surface area of the filtration media separate from the hole size. Even a single strand of filtration material will catch a few particles.

Of course you are free to believe or not believe whatever you want but the reality is filters work by more than just hole size.

If you care to learn more, here are a couple articles from National Institutes of Health(NIH) and Minnesota Mining & Manufacturing(3M).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7498895/

https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/410364O/filtration-mechanisms-for-particulate-respirators.pdf