The trouble with no Trainer Accountability

[OurDee]

I worked in a stamping plant, but not in China. WHOOOO........

 

[ECS686]

Many gun channels on YouTube are messed up. (Yes he loaded the gun before he put on his ear pro with said gun in his hand)

 

[Ziggidy]

Meh.. that's nothing...

But...but....he's wearing a plate.

 

[WebSnyper]

Meh.. that's nothing...

WTF?

 

[Timjoebillybob]

WTF?

How about this one?

This one isn't too safe either.

Handicapable Man Almost Shoots Classmate -

In a video that has been making the rounds on Facebook, a man in a wheelchair appears to be attending a class where the shooters are practicing a drill where they shoot as they are approaching the target. While normally I would watch the video and move on with my life, the handicapped shooter...

www.thefirearmblog.com

 

[The Bubba Effect]

How about this one?

This one isn't too safe either.

Handicapable Man Almost Shoots Classmate -

In a video that has been making the rounds on Facebook, a man in a wheelchair appears to be attending a class where the shooters are practicing a drill where they shoot as they are approaching the target. While normally I would watch the video and move on with my life, the handicapped shooter...

www.thefirearmblog.com

That looks like tactical response, either fighting pistol or advanced fighting pistol.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

That looks like tactical response, either fighting pistol or advanced fighting pistol.

The top one is, and I'm almost positive the bottom one is as well.

 

[The Bubba Effect]

The top one is, and I'm almost positive the bottom one is as well.

I think those two classes are the best live fire classes I have taken. I know that a lot of folks crap all over Tactical Response, but that is a heck of a well put together class.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

I think those two classes are the best live fire classes I have taken. I know that a lot of folks crap all over Tactical Response, but that is a heck of a well put together class.

So do you believe it is safe or unsafe to put a photographer down range during live fire? Or have a guy in a wheelchair firing from well behind the line of other shooters while being bounced around?

 

[The Bubba Effect]

So do you believe it is safe or unsafe to put a photographer down range during live fire? Or have a guy in a wheelchair firing from well behind the line of other shooters while being bounced around?

I think both are worth the risk.

These are not casual actions, but intentional and with reason.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

I think both are worth the risk.

These are not casual actions, but intentional and with reasonable.

A photo op is worth the risk? Other than a "cool" photo, what gain is there to have a photographer standing down range on a hot range? And even if there is a valid reason, they do have something called remote cameras.

As for the wheelchair, easily done in a safe manner. Keep him with the line or have him run the drill without the others. Don't start pushing and bouncing him all over when the others are well in front of him.

I'm not denigrating their training, I haven't attended it. But their safety protocols do seem to be a bit lacking.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

A photo op is worth the risk? Other than a "cool" photo, what gain is there to have a photographer standing down range on a hot range? And even if there is a valid reason, they do have something called remote cameras.

As for the wheelchair, easily done in a safe manner. Keep him with the line or have him run the drill without the others. Don't start pushing and bouncing him all over when the others are well in front of him.

I'm not denigrating their training, I haven't attended it. But their safety protocols do seem to be a bit lacking.

The free marketing is worth it to the company and the edu-trainment is worth it to at least some of the customers, as these discussions often show. They will mistakenly believe this has better prepared them to shoot with "innocents" downrange or shown them something about their abilities that could not have been produced in a safer manner...similar to how the vast majority of professional gun-toters train.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

The free marketing is worth it to the company and the edu-trainment is worth it to at least some of the customers, as these discussions often show. They will mistakenly believe this has better prepared them to shoot with "innocents" downrange or shown them something about their abilities that could not have been produced in a safer manner...similar to how the vast majority of professional gun-toters train.

Can't disagree. I saw a video of Clint Smith talking about wearing body armor when he takes students through a shoot house, paraphrasing he said he wears it not because he thinks a student will shoot him, but **** happens.

And I'm not sure that the photographer was to prepare the students to shoot with "innocents" down range, from what I've heard they sell the photos in the gift shop.

 

[Tactically Fat]

Can't disagree. I saw a video of Clint Smith talking about wearing body armor when he takes students through a shoot house, paraphrasing he said he wears it not because he thinks a student will shoot him, but **** happens.

And I'm not sure that the photographer was to prepare the students to shoot with "innocents" down range, from what I've heard they sell the photos in the gift shop.

If you're in a GOOD, well-run shoothouse, all students and instructors should be wearing at least a front plate and a ballistic helmet.

IE: Alliance Police Training facility in Alliance, OH. https://alliancepolicetraining.com/

They rent the facilities out to MANY different high-quality instructors. Every one in the shoot-house is kitted up appropriately for that type of gig. Be they LEO or regular people.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

If you're in a GOOD, well-run shoothouse, all students and instructors should be wearing at least a front plate and a ballistic helmet.

IE: Alliance Police Training facility in Alliance, OH. https://alliancepolicetraining.com/

They rent the facilities out to MANY different high-quality instructors. Every one in the shoot-house is kitted up appropriately for that type of gig. Be they LEO or regular people.

No idea if Smith runs his shoot house the same way, iirc he was using it as an example of safety precautions because accidents happen.

 

[turnandshoot4]

If you're in a GOOD, well-run shoothouse, all students and instructors should be wearing at least a front plate and a ballistic helmet.

IE: Alliance Police Training facility in Alliance, OH. https://alliancepolicetraining.com/

Front, rear, helmet, eyes, ears, TQ, trauma kit. No less than that.

 

[Altrex]

Meh.. that's nothing...

Wow, this is probably the craziest thing i've seen to date. Anyone in the LE community able to verify if this legit training on any level?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Wow, this is probably the craziest thing i've seen to date. Anyone in the LE community able to verify if this legit training on any level?

From the text at the video:

The jawdropping footage shows the unnamed training officer walk randomly in front of cops who are firing off rounds on a gun range at the Superior School in Parana, south Brazil. Officials have said the instructor could face disciplinary action after apparently going against training rules, but refuse to confirm whether the rounds were live or dummy.

What he's trying to do is get them to stay aware of their surroundings and notice things that could get in their line of fire. He's not accomplishing that because the training is too unrealistic. They are primed to look for him. The environment is sterile (meaning there's very little sensory input to sort through, stimulus is very simple, etc) which combined with very simple decision making means the mental load is very low.

If you were going to do this sort of thing, it would be both safer for everyone involved and more useful to do it with Simunitions during realistic force on force. It is very difficult to not tunnel vision on a threat to your life whereas it's very easy to not tunnel vision on a bit of paper, especially when you've been told the instructor is going to dart in front of you randomly...

 

[ancjr]

Meh.. that's nothing...

Reminds me of some of the more enthusiastic brass collectors at public ranges.

 

[dekindy]

Not sure how you can tell what action she was performing. I have watched their youtube videos and they are knowledgeable and good people.