Russia vs. Ukraine Part 2

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    smokingman

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    Or, the NYT is making a claim...
    What if it was Victoria Nuland making the claim,say in 2014?

    If you think we did not overthrow an elected president because he supported close ties to Russia,you have not been paying attention.

    As for the "for democracy" cries,Ukraine is anything but. It has one political party now. The others have been destroyed by this and previous appointed governments.

     
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    Keith_Indy

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    What if it was Victoria Nuland making the claim,say in 2014?

    If you think we did not overthrow an elected president because he supported close ties to Russia,you have not been paying attention.

    As for the "for democracy" cries,Ukraine is anything but. It has one political party now. The others have been destroyed by this and previous appointed governments.


    People forget our own history...

     

    Hawkeye

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    What if it was Victoria Nuland making the claim,say in 2014?

    If you think we did not overthrow an elected president because he supported close ties to Russia,you have not been paying attention.

    As for the "for democracy" cries,Ukraine is anything but. It has one political party now. The others have been destroyed by this and previous appointed governments.

    Yawn. Scratch. Snort.
     

    BigRed

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    Transcript from today:


    It is well worth reading the entire transcript.

    One excerpt by obidenI will comment on:

    "And when we agreed we were going to respond, we acknowledged there was going to be some costs to our people."

    Let me tell you something, you piece of ****. I am not yours.

    GTH.



    ETA: Another excerpt.

    "Well, thank you your Majesty. There’s an old expression in a little town in Delaware called Claymont, Delaware, a little steel town. And they say, “We’re like poor relatives. We show up when we’re invited and we stay longer than we should.” So, be careful. We may not go back. "

    If there is one promise you can keep......
     

    BugI02

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    I believe the Kinzhal is powered all the way to impact, why no visible engine exhaust

    Even a fairly sophisticated camera would top out at about 1/4000th of a second. If the missile was moving at mach 10 it would be moving at 10800 ft per second, and would have moved 2.7 feet even in 1/4000th of a second, so why so little image blur

    skeptical am I
     

    Keith_Indy

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    I believe the Kinzhal is powered all the way to impact, why no visible engine exhaust

    Even a fairly sophisticated camera would top out at about 1/4000th of a second. If the missile was moving at mach 10 it would be moving at 10800 ft per second, and would have moved 2.7 feet even in 1/4000th of a second, so why so little image blur

    skeptical am I

    The person posting the video is "Advisor to the Minister of Internal Affairs of Ukraine." Good idea to be skeptical.

    The other video showing the strike, seems more plausible.

    You are mistaking the Kh-22 with the Russian hypersonic missile.

    The Kh-22 has a max speed of Mach 4.6, that's 5135.61 ft per second. This is video, not a still camera so 30 frames per second. That's 166 feet per frame. (approximately all throughout)

    It covers the distance in frame in a fraction of a second, which seems right.

     

    BugI02

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    It covers the distance in frame in a fraction of a second, which seems right.
    I was calculating from what the shortest exposure time for any given frame might be. Those thirty frames per second were not shot at 1/30th second exposure in bright sunlight, they do not form a continuous record but a discrete one. 1/4000 was used as the worst case/shortest possible exposure, something only possible if the video had been shot using a DSLR or a high end GoPro - likely shutter speed was quite a bit lower, especially if automatic exposure was being used

    And I'm still skeptical the missile would arrive powered down and ballistic, unless it was at the extreme limit of its range. Surely fuel cut-off as a method to target a missile hasn't been used since the third reich
     

    Keith_Indy

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    And I'm still skeptical the missile would arrive powered down and ballistic, unless it was at the extreme limit of its range. Surely fuel cut-off as a method to target a missile hasn't been used since the third reich

    You also made an assumption about being able to see the engine exhaust.





     

    BugI02

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    Touché

    My first inclination was to claim that the Tomahawk is an air breather and the Kitchen is a liquid fueled rocket, but when I looked at more footage even solid fuel missiles in flight did not have noticeable exhaust trails after the boost phase
     

    smokingman

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    Who could have seen this coming?
     

    BigMoose

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    Well lets have a look at things.

    A few days ago, Russians pulled out the strategic bombers (TU-95, and TU-160) and launched a few more missiles from the stash.
    Sources indicate that Russia launched the missiles from the bombers at nearly max range, and that hampered their accuracy. Some missles are estimated to have expended their fuel and performed a glide to impact, and exploded short. Russia didn't want to risk it's prestige by loosing one of these irreplaceable strategic bombers.
    Some of these missles (like the one above) are actually anti ship missles, repurposed to air to ground.

    The Salient into the Luhansk Oblast is finally proving unfeasible to defend... and the Ukranians have finally been forced into an organized retreat. Not a rout, but its proved too much. Russian pulled anything and everything there and focused everything left at that Salient.. and its finally falling. But its cost them extremely dearly to take it. They have tapped out to take the last bit of the Luhansk Oblast and sacrificed any hope of taking larger areas. However the Russians do seem have finally have learned from their mistakes and aren't making it easy for the Ukranians to target stuff, as they had been.

    Kharkiv area the battle remains largely static, the Ukranians able to hold onto what they have taken back.

    Around Kherson in the south, where they sent those T-62s, the Russians are completely defensive.

    We will see how long this lasts, and how long ether side can keep this up. Its turned into a nasty war of attrition.
     
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    BigMoose

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    Electromagnetic Guns for screwing with drones....
    Great... wait until they figure out they can jack up the power and microwave people. (maybe not realistically yet)

    Basically a man portable EF-111A Raven (Spark Vark)/EA-6B Prowler/EA-18G Growler...

    But hey, it could be fun to screw with cell phones, the cop trying to run your plate, or anything that uses RF. (Even if its just the McDonalds drive through) (All already illegal in the states, though its the FCC on your butt, not the ATF)

    The future of war is here, and its getting real folks..
     

    KellyinAvon

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    1656633131882.png
    Boris: When you look at this picture, what do you see, Yuri?

    Yuri: Ukrainian topsoil is most impressive, Boris. It is no wonder we are the breadbasket of Europe.

    Boris: I forgot you were on soil judging team in Future Ukrainian Farmers while in high school, Yuri. I'll rephrase the question: is that a yoga mat, does Danoli think he is the Marlboro Man, and what kind of a funky weapon is that?

    Yuri: Yes, yes, and that is an EDM4S Counter Unmanned Aerial System gun.

    Boris: An EDM... what the hell is that thing?

    Yuri: Weapon that can shoot down drones with energy.

    Boris: How did Danoli acquire such weapon?

    Yuri: The Lithuanians, who hate russian pig-dogs almost as much as Ukrainians, donated these weapons.

    Boris: Is Valody working on a new modification of this weapon?

    Yuri: He said something about, it will be more impressive than Phased Plasma Rifle in the 40 Watt Range.

    Boris: After we kick Putin's arse, we will kick Skynet's arse!!
     
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    erasure

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    They need — we’re going to be providing another — well, I guess I’ll announce it shortly, but another $800 billion — $800 million in aid for additional weaponry, including — you know, weapons, including air defense system, as well as offensive weapons. I have a whole list I’d be happy to give to you. But that’s the next tranche that’s going to occur.


    That's from Biden.

    What's been more costly at this point? our stunning success in Afghanistan or our stunning success in Ukraine?
     

    smokingman

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    "What do you say to those families that say, 'listen, we can't afford to pay $4.85 a gallon for months, if not years?’"

    BIDEN ADVISOR BRIAN DEESE: "This is about the future of the Liberal World Order and we have to stand firm."

     
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