Russia vs. Ukraine Part 2

[SEIndSAM]

 

[SEIndSAM]

 

[KG1]

 

[actaeon277]

Man, I gotta stop pocket carrying my flare gun.

 

[smokingman]

UN watchdog on shelling at Ukraine nuclear plant: ‘Next time, we may not be so lucky’

The head of the United Nations’ nuclear watchdog agency said recent shelling reported near the largest nuclear power plant in Europe was a “close call” and the world “may not be so lucky” if Ukraine’s plant suffers another attack. International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) Director General Rafael...

news.yahoo.com

Fresh shelling for 4 days in a row. I have seen some of the videos of shell impacts from the IAEA UN observers(now taken down). To say it was close is an understatement.

“Even though there was no direct impact on key nuclear safety and security systems at the plant, the shelling came dangerously close to them,” Grossi said. “We are talking metres, not kilometres. Whoever is shelling at the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant, is taking huge risks and gambling with many people’s lives.”

 

[Tombs]

UN watchdog on shelling at Ukraine nuclear plant: ‘Next time, we may not be so lucky’

The head of the United Nations’ nuclear watchdog agency said recent shelling reported near the largest nuclear power plant in Europe was a “close call” and the world “may not be so lucky” if Ukraine’s plant suffers another attack. International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) Director General Rafael...

news.yahoo.com

Fresh shelling for 4 days in a row. I have seen some of the videos of shell impacts from the IAEA UN observers(now taken down). To say it was close is an understatement.

“Even though there was no direct impact on key nuclear safety and security systems at the plant, the shelling came dangerously close to them,” Grossi said. “We are talking metres, not kilometres. Whoever is shelling at the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant, is taking huge risks and gambling with many people’s lives.”

Wasn't everyone complaining about Russia attacking it when they took it?

I don't think Russia is going to shell their own position.

 

[smokingman]

Wasn't everyone complaining about Russia attacking it when they took it?

I don't think Russia is going to shell their own position.

Russian 22nd Army Corps approached the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant on 26 February. It was not defended. They took it over and have been there since. As you can guess the shelling of it since was not done by Russia,though the media has suggested it was many times. The Russian's did however at one point back in May use it to stage troops,so it became a quasi military target. That ended when they built a fire base and supply depot forward of it on May 15th as it was no longer a part of the supply line.

No matter what way you look at it though shelling a nuclear power plant is not a good idea.

In other news today.

NY Times Takes Rare Look At Apparent Ukrainian War Crimes | ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

 

[BigRed]

I only check this thread for acceptence of my offer to put a round through putin's skull and bring this nonsense to an end (offer is now at $8.75B, no credit; gold only).

My apologies for not being current on the latest drama.

Did some UN toadie get plugged?

 

[Ark]

AP Fires Reporter Who Risked Triggering WWIII With Polish Missile Misinformation | ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

Remember that time they tried to kick off WWIII? Well now one of the reporters who broke the story has been fired.

 

[blain]

I don't think Russia is going to shell their own position.

Washington Post, 11-18-2022
Headline: "Sweden finds explosive traces at Nord Stream blast sites, confirms sabotage"
"European leaders pointed to Russia as the only actor with the technical capability and motivation to damage the Nord Stream pipelines with underwater explosions."

If Russia keeps it up, they'll false-flag themselves right out of the picture.
But that Putin is a wily old fox. He's calculating just the right moment when to STOP destroying his own assets.
Now that's some 4D chess in action!

​

 

[smokingman]

Washington Post, 11-18-2022
Headline: "Sweden finds explosive traces at Nord Stream blast sites, confirms sabotage"
"European leaders pointed to Russia as the only actor with the technical capability and motivation to damage the Nord Stream pipelines with underwater explosions."

If Russia keeps it up, they'll false-flag themselves right out of the picture.
But that Putin is a wily old fox. He's calculating just the right moment when to STOP destroying his own assets.
Now that's some 4D chess in action!

​

So Russia is the "only" one who could have possibly had the technical capability and motivation(what would that possibly be for Russia?)? Really?

Who controls gas from Norway to Poland? What is it priced in? Did that pipe line happen to go active the exact same day as the pipelines were blown up(yes, yes it did).

Hint. It is not Russia that had motive.

Business Daily - Norway, Poland open new gas pipeline amid Nord Stream leaks

As European leaders were warning of sabotage to the Nord Stream 1 and 2 pipelines, Poland and Norway inaugurated a new conduit that will reduce dependence on Russian gas. The move underscores the urgency…

www.france24.com

A month earlier.

What is Nord Stream 2 and can Biden kill it?​

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/08/business/nord-stream-2-germany-biden/index.html

 

[DragonGunner]

Washington Post, 11-18-2022
Headline: "Sweden finds explosive traces at Nord Stream blast sites, confirms sabotage"
"European leaders pointed to Russia as the only actor with the technical capability and motivation to damage the Nord Stream pipelines with underwater explosions."

If Russia keeps it up, they'll false-flag themselves right out of the picture.
But that Putin is a wily old fox. He's calculating just the right moment when to STOP destroying his own assets.
Now that's some 4D chess in action!

​

Ya I'm sure Navy Seals and the CIA don't have any knowledge of underwater drones or how to blow stuff up. I think best they could do is hand grenade something or light a match to stick of dynamite. So it had to be Russia with all their advanced technology.

 

[Libertarian01]

Regarding the damage to Nordstream Pipeline:



Happy Thanksgiving,

Doug

 

[BigMoose]

Putin is pretty much Stalin returned to life..

 

[smokingman]

Regarding the damage to Nordstream Pipeline:



Happy Thanksgiving,

Doug

So he is saying in short,because the pipe line was blown up with explosives everyone knows it was Russia. No mention of the NATO fleet drill that had taken place just days earlier. No actual link to Russia. Just stating as fact "everyone knows it was Russia"....does not not actually make it a fact.

Then he makes excuses for why the Swiss can not publicly say who bombed the pipelines and with what explosive,while at the same time comes up with a purely fictional story on why they would never say Russia did it.

He gave absolute no new or actual facts. Not one. It is pure propaganda.

 

[AndreusMaximus]

Putin is pretty much Stalin returned to life..

I don't understand Russian; what's happening to the soldiers in the video being taken off? Are they to be shot?

 

[BigMoose]

Meanwhile..



Folks, as I have said before. We have a long drug out meatgrinder of a conventional war, something we have honestly not seen since the 1980s Iran Iraq war

Its now Mud Season. So things are getting a bit bogged, down, but Ukraine did launch an assault across the river. To the tiny Kinburn Spit. This may just be an attempt to fixate russian forces. We will see.

Kinburn Spit operation would provide Ukraine with significant advantages, says ISW

Control over the Kinburn Spit, where Ukraine is conducting a "silent" operation, would provide the Ukrainian Armed Forces with a number of significant advantages — including control over the mouths of the Dnipro and Pivdennyi Buh rivers, according to a new report of the U.S.-based Institute for...

news.yahoo.com

 

[BigMoose]

I don't understand Russian; what's happening to the soldiers in the video being taken off? Are they to be shot?

Me ether, I would like to know. I saw one in the video hauled off to a gulag wagon though

 

[Libertarian01]

So he is saying in short,because the pipe line was blown up with explosives everyone knows it was Russia. No mention of the NATO fleet drill that had taken place just days earlier. No actual link to Russia. Just stating as fact "everyone knows it was Russia"....does not not actually make it a fact.

Then he makes excuses for why the Swiss can not publicly say who bombed the pipelines and with what explosive,while at the same time comes up with a purely fictional story on why they would never say Russia did it.

He gave absolute no new or actual facts. Not one. It is pure propaganda.

You are taking this WAY out of context, and omitting statements he has made to fit a narrative.

He is saying that the Swede's ARE doing an investigation. They HAVE found evidence of Russian used explosives. This does NOT mean that they do not have other evidence, but that this is only a PIECE of it.

He is also not "making excuses," but rather explaining their slow dragging of the release of information, as that release WILL push certain legal obligations, or at least practices. The USA has done this several times. Once in Africa when we refused to call a genocide a genocide, as it would have forced us to legally take certain actions. When General el-Sisi, a military man, overthrew the lawfully elected leader of Egypt, we refused to call it a coup, which it was, because doing so would have legally forced us to withdraw aid to the country. Sweden and Europeans are no different. Except that perhaps(?) they will actually call a spade a spade. He is NOT saying they won't release the full report, just why they may not be in a hurry to do so.

Perhaps the Swede's saw something on sonar (or other surveillance methods) the day of the blast, but for their own national security reasons haven't been willing to share openly.

This guy has a company and team dedicated to finding out facts and information from around the world. We on INGO "surf" for maybe a few hours a week. People at his company, and many others, spend 40 or more hours doing research looking for real information and trying to parse it down into explainable bits for their audience.

I for one do not yet rule out American or British, or any other possible perpetrators. But I certainly do NOT rule out Russia.

Honest, nonjudgmental question here: What really got you so riled up about this??? Mr. Zeihan releases a video explaining a small portion of his interpretation of what is going on without really being too judgmental, and you respond very emotionally (seemingly) with "...excuses...", "...purely fictional story...", "...pure propaganda..." It just appears that your heightened visceral response to this is way out of proportion to what I shared.

Regards and Happy Thanksgiving,

Doug

 

[smokingman]

He is saying that the Swede's ARE doing an investigation. They HAVE found evidence of Russian used explosives.

Watch it again. He never once says the Swede's found Russian explosives. He does not ever say were the explosives came from just that the Swede's found explosive residue, but goes right into saying everyone knows Russia did it. We all know they found explosive residue and that the pipelines were blown up. No shock there at all. Him linking it to Russia through some mental gymnastics and claiming everyone knows it does not remotely point to the Swede's as a source of information. Finding explosive residue,and it being Russian are two very different things.

This guy has a company and team dedicated to finding out facts and information.

He presents just one fact in the entire video. The Swiss found explosive residue.

I for one do not yet rule out American or British, or any other possible perpetrators. But I certainly do NOT rule out Russia.

Honest, nonjudgmental question here: What really got you so riled up about this??? Mr. Zeihan releases a video explaining a small portion of his interpretation of what is going on without really being too judgmental, and you respond very emotionally (seemingly) with "...excuses...", "...purely fictional story...", "...pure propaganda..." It just appears that your heightened visceral response to this is way out of proportion to what I shared.

Regards and Happy Thanksgiving,

Doug

I listened to how he spoke and to the words he used. How he misled the listener to hear one thing(a fact) followed immediately by a statement that something else was known when it clearly is not. That is a tool used to use the listeners own brain into tricking them into the belief the latter statement to be just as true as the first. It is how propaganda works. He has zero facts as to who bombed the pipeline but says Russia and keeps piling on groups who "know" it was Russia to suspend your disbelief. Weaker minds would just cave. "Ok,everyone else thinks it,it must be true"
It is propaganda 101.
He also makes several false claims. Such as the Swiss telling all their allies the day the leaks started it was Russia who blew them up. A total fabrication.
Here is what the swiss actually said.

https://www.thelocal.se/20220927/nord-stream-1-gas-pipeline-hit-by-leaks-in-swedish-and-danish-zones/

Denmark were the first leak was spotted.

Nord Stream 2 leaks gas into sea off Denmark – DW – 09/26/2022

Danish maritime authorities have established a safety zone of 5 nautical miles around the island of Bornholm. The pipeline was filled with gas before the project was halted because of Russia's invasion of Ukraine.

www.dw.com

Side note. I am not emotional about it at all,but very analytical. I have been accused more than once of not even having emotions lol.