Oops, I bought a machine gun

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  • snorko

    Grandmaster
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    361   0   0
    Apr 3, 2008
    8,348
    113
    Evansville, IN
    As this matter appears to be settled, I thought I would share a little recent adventure.

    About a month or so ago I went to a local gun auction. Bulk of the guns were from a large estate. One of the items that caught my eye was a Czech D-Technik VZ-61 chambered in .32 acp. Came with three magazines and a holster and mag pouch. I ended up getting it for a decent price. It then sat in my safe for a while and I decided it was too much of a range toy, there were other things I wanted, and I would thus sell it on Ingo - hopefully recouping my purchase price. Fairly quickly I received an offer for a trade and we met up on a Saturday. Other INGOer was an FFL so when we traded, I did a 4473 and he entered the VZ into his books.

    Needless to say he was giddy about firing the thing and planned to do so that day. A few hours later, the dealer called to inform me the pistol was capable of full auto fire. He sent me a video which was very cool except for the circumstances. If he wants to out himself here he may, I just want to add that he was extremely cool about the whole thing. Apparently the selector on the VZ-61 pistol, instead of "safe" and "semi-auto fire", was now "semi-auto fire" and "SQUIRT!"


    Doing the Right Thing (as INGO folks do), the dealer immediately contacted the Sheriff who took possession of the firearm pending their transferring it to the ATF. I then contacted the auction company, informing them of the situation. L
    ess than a week later, the FFL I traded it to got a call from the ATF. They stated they were very concerned about it but after about a half hour on the phone, Agent concluded that we did everything right and an agent will eventually pickup the gun from the sheriffs department and have it destroyed. We are both in the clear and so is the auction company. He added if we were both happy financially then we probably won't be hearing from them again on this matter.

    So I sent a cash payment for the gun I received in trade to the dealer, the auction company issued me a refund for the purchase, transfer fee, etc. and at least we have a cool story to tell.
     

    BogWalker

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    6   0   0
    Jan 5, 2013
    6,305
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    I hope it was an illegal MG and not a papered one that the paperwork just got displaced.

    Or was this a mechanical malfunction on a previously functional semi-auto?
     

    snorko

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    361   0   0
    Apr 3, 2008
    8,348
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    Evansville, IN
    I hope it was an illegal MG and not a papered one that the paperwork just got displaced.

    Or was this a mechanical malfunction on a previously functional semi-auto?

    I can not testify to the condition or state of the internals, never saw them. However, googling images of guns shows a three position selector on the full auto VZs. So while I can not accurately speculate, I would guess someone modded or added some parts.
     

    Bfish

    Grandmaster
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    13   0   0
    Feb 24, 2013
    5,801
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    Good story... Glad you shared! If it's possible and ok with all parties you should post the video!
     

    Clay

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 98.8%
    81   1   0
    Aug 28, 2008
    9,648
    48
    Vigo Co
    I was SOOOOOOOOO close to buying that one from you as well!!! thought about it on more than one flip through the classifieds!

    I would love to know if it was a legal papered NFA item or not.
     

    shootersix

    Master
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    0   0   0
    Mar 10, 2009
    4,301
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    being that it was a large auction, I wonder if the bureau of animosity towards fire arms will be inspecting other guns from the same seller?
     

    snorko

    Grandmaster
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    361   0   0
    Apr 3, 2008
    8,348
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    Evansville, IN
    being that it was a large auction, I wonder if the bureau of animosity towards fire arms will be inspecting other guns from the same seller?

    That would be the nightmare scenario. The estate was sold over three auctions and there were 3 or 4 other VZ-61s, dozens of AKs and ARs and over 700 guns in total.
     

    Bigtanker

    Cuddles
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    24   0   0
    Aug 21, 2012
    21,688
    151
    Osceola
    That would be the nightmare scenario. The estate was sold over three auctions and there were 3 or 4 other VZ-61s, dozens of AKs and ARs and over 700 guns in total.

    For a small fee, if they supply the ammo, I'll personally fire each and every gun to make sure there are no more machine guns.
     

    Beowulf

    Master
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    66   0   0
    Mar 21, 2012
    2,880
    83
    Brownsburg
    I hope it was an illegal MG and not a papered one that the paperwork just got displaced.

    Or was this a mechanical malfunction on a previously functional semi-auto?

    Given the 1968 import cutoff and the 86 ban, I'm not sure there would be any transferable VZ61s in the US. Maybe if one showed up in Vietnam and found it's way back into the country in the hands of a GI who subsequently registered it during the amnesty, or if somehow a demilled parts kit made it out of the Iron Curtain pre-86. So, I guess there could be a couple... maybe.

    I shot a post-sample at Knob Creek last fall. It was definitely a hoot. I'm pretty sure I ran the mag dry before the first shell casing hit the ground.
     

    Tula47

    Expert
    Rating - 100%
    43   0   0
    Jun 28, 2013
    1,119
    48
    Knox Co.
    As this matter appears to be settled, I thought I would share a little recent adventure.

    About a month or so ago I went to a local gun auction. Bulk of the guns were from a large estate. One of the items that caught my eye was a Czech D-Technik VZ-61 chambered in .32 acp. Came with three magazines and a holster and mag pouch. I ended up getting it for a decent price. It then sat in my safe for a while and I decided it was too much of a range toy, there were other things I wanted, and I would thus sell it on Ingo - hopefully recouping my purchase price. Fairly quickly I received an offer for a trade and we met up on a Saturday. Other INGOer was an FFL so when we traded, I did a 4473 and he entered the VZ into his books.

    Needless to say he was giddy about firing the thing and planned to do so that day. A few hours later, the dealer called to inform me the pistol was capable of full auto fire. He sent me a video which was very cool except for the circumstances. If he wants to out himself here he may, I just want to add that he was extremely cool about the whole thing. Apparently the selector on the VZ-61 pistol, instead of "safe" and "semi-auto fire", was now "semi-auto fire" and "SQUIRT!"


    Doing the Right Thing (as INGO folks do), the dealer immediately contacted the Sheriff who took possession of the firearm pending their transferring it to the ATF. I then contacted the auction company, informing them of the situation. L
    ess than a week later, the FFL I traded it to got a call from the ATF. They stated they were very concerned about it but after about a half hour on the phone, Agent concluded that we did everything right and an agent will eventually pickup the gun from the sheriffs department and have it destroyed. We are both in the clear and so is the auction company. He added if we were both happy financially then we probably won't be hearing from them again on this matter.

    So I sent a cash payment for the gun I received in trade to the dealer, the auction company issued me a refund for the purchase, transfer fee, etc. and at least we have a cool story to tell.

    Next time you have to test fire it before we trade hahah.
     

    Tula47

    Expert
    Rating - 100%
    43   0   0
    Jun 28, 2013
    1,119
    48
    Knox Co.
    Given the 1968 import cutoff and the 86 ban, I'm not sure there would be any transferable VZ61s in the US. Maybe if one showed up in Vietnam and found it's way back into the country in the hands of a GI who subsequently registered it during the amnesty, or if somehow a demilled parts kit made it out of the Iron Curtain pre-86. So, I guess there could be a couple... maybe.

    I shot a post-sample at Knob Creek last fall. It was definitely a hoot. I'm pretty sure I ran the mag dry before the first shell casing hit the ground.

    It was fun to shoot. No recoil at all, I fired a box or two through it just to be sure that it wasn't just a malfunction (cough, cough)
     

    Thor

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    2   0   0
    Jan 18, 2014
    10,708
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    Could be anywhere
    I have seen and identified several MGs in museums labeled incorrectly, they are generally on loan from a collection, I have only notified a curator and told them to contact the owner to see if they knew. I hope none of them are ever destroyed. I hope none of the owners ever get in trouble. I really hope they pull them from the display and put them away.

    I hate seeing history lost due to bureaucratic idiocy.
     

    Slow Hand

    Master
    Rating - 99.3%
    146   1   0
    Aug 27, 2008
    3,106
    149
    West Side
    It's a shame you didn't get a chance to run it some before letting go of it. I was lucky enough to shoot a Skorpian several years ago. Next to no recoil and a fast rate of fire! The first magazine was fired under a cover and the empty brass blasted us after ejecting straight up and ricocheting back down! It was no trouble to dump a magazine before the first piece of empty brass hit the ground. It was even more fun once we screwed a 9mm can on the end of it!
     
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