Manual safety on a handgun foils self defense shooting

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  • jsgolfman

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    That's horrible. It's like those dreams we have when we are pulling the trigger and nothing happens or the bullets "float" to and/bounce off the bad guys. The victim is lucky indeed.

    This is why I stopped carrying the 1911 (along with the desire to avoid having such a pretty thing confiscated in the event of a self defense usage). I didn't trust myself to remember the safety, no matter how much I practiced. The Glock muscle memory was just so ingrained. It wasn't worth the effort when the easier and more efficient choice was to stick with what I already knew. Others' MMV.

    I'm not opposed to manual safeties. I prefer firearms that don't have them, but I won't not purchase one just because it does. It will just never be an EDC option. As it is, we rarely use safeties anyway. Never been a need.
    Holy crap! I thought I was unique. I have those dreams too. Bullet seems to crawl out of the barrel and everything is in sow mo except for the bad guy.
     

    thewoods868

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    I was talking to another detective last night and heard one of the saddest stories I've heard in quite awhile. I won't go into detail, but at one point the victim was able to get to a handgun in the house, put the gun into contact with the attacker...and nothing. The attacker took the gun away from the victim and continued the assault and eventually stole the gun after finishing the attack. Its an absolutely heartwrenching tale, and one I truly wish had a different ending, but reality is reality and we can try to learn something from someone else's misfortune.

    So, why nothing? The safety was on.

    Guys, I'm not against a manual safety. I carried a 1911 for years and years. However, not all safeties are created equal. Not all are easy to activate intuitively under stress. If your carry gun has a manual safety, you NEED to practice drawing and deactivating the safety under stress. Get a shot timer, have someone run at you from the side while you try to dry fire, whatever, just make sure its burned into your muscle memory and that you can physically always do it.

    What do I mean physically always do it? Some guns have lousy safeties. They aren't positioned for easy on/off while drawing, they are too stiff, they are too small, or some combination of these based on the gun design and your hand size. I could not consistently deactivate the safety on the CZ40B under stress, so I quit carrying it cocked and locked and went to hammer down/safety off (that particular gun can be carried either way and be ready to fire at the first trigger pull).

    There are, of course, also a multitude of quality proven firearms that do not have a thumb safety. Glocks, XDs, most Sigs, etc. etc.

    On a positive note, the victim survived and is a fighter. I hesitate to say "victim" as much as "survivor", but common terminology says otherwise. The person has already bought a replacement firearm...with no manual safety.
    It’s ironic my truck will not move out of park unless the brake is pressed. What if I’m being carjacked will I have time to apply pressure to the brake? Probably because I’ve done it a thousand times. You have to train with what your using
     

    churchmouse

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    This is just a reminder that you HD/EDC is not a talisman. It is a device that needs to be trained on to use properly. If you choose to have an external safety then as the OP stated practice with it. Burn it into your muscle memory so it is done automatically. No delays while figuring it out.
    Practice practice and then practice some more.
     
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    wcd

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    This is just a reminder that you HD/EDC is not a talisman. It is a device that needs to be trained on to use properly. If you choose to have an external safety then as the OP stated practice with it. Burn it into your muscle memory so it is done automatically. No delays while figuring it out.
    Practice practice and then practice some more.
    But the 1911 is no longer in use anymore. It has been relegated to the history Books. I am not sure but there may be a few survivors in museums somewhere?

    Hope the Mouse is doing well. In all seriousness good info upstream and a stark reminder as to why less is more, and, it’s really not a good idea to have the 31 flavors carry carry rotation.
    Better to train and train some more and to have your system down

    This is just a reminder that you HD/EDC is not a talisman. It is a device that needs to be trained on to use properly. If you choose to have an external safety then as the OP stated practice with it. Burn it into your muscle memory so it is done automatically. No delays while figuring it out.
    Practice practice and then practice some more.
     

    indyartisan

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    In the original post the victim had the gun in contact with the assailant.
    Easy to push the slide out of battery rendering your automatic inoperable,
    safety or not.
     

    russc2542

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    Appears this thread has been resurrected?

    wondering what is the record for length of time in between posts?
    I've seen >10yrs.

    Valid topic for resurrections though. Related note, this is why I advocate if the gun has a safety, use it whether you want to or not: if you only train with it already off and it gets accidentally activated, definitely an "oh crap" moment.
     

    venenoindy

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    Is more often that I see people struggle with manual safeties, I don't understand why people don't invest effort in knowing their own limits. in my case under no circumstances I would carry a handgun with a safety, I train and practice often and still wouldn't risk my or my family's well being in been able to disable a safety under stress.
     

    Cameramonkey

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    Is more often that I see people struggle with manual safeties, I don't understand why people don't invest effort in knowing their own limits. in my case under no circumstances I would carry a handgun with a safety, I train and practice often and still wouldn't risk my or my family's well being in been able to disable a safety under stress.
    Understand most people dont regularly shoot and practice at the range. Even fewer have actually practicing drawing and shooting because the vast majority of ranges dont allow it.
     

    wcd

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    Understand most people dont regularly shoot and practice at the range. Even fewer have actually practicing drawing and shooting because the vast majority of ranges dont allow it.
    Often wonder if the do not allow it is not used as an excuse?

    There are work arounds, while not ideal and the often require manually cycling the slide. There are laser targeting systems that let you use your edc, and seem to do a pretty good job increasing skills.
     

    KLB

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    Often wonder if the do not allow it is not used as an excuse?

    There are work arounds, while not ideal and the often require manually cycling the slide. There are laser targeting systems that let you use your edc, and seem to do a pretty good job increasing skills.
    I would guess insurance and liability issues.
     

    wcd

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    I would guess insurance and liability issues.
    I was kind of thinking about the people that say oh well I can not draw and fire at the range so I will just leave it at that.

    Seriously I have seen some ranges where people are doing good just to keep their firearm pointed in a safe direction. I would not want to add drawing and firing to that mix.

    But I really do think it is beneficial to train versus statically putting holes in paper. But then again a lot of people load their magazine up and never practice in any form or fashion.
     

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