Leaked/breaking:Roe v. Wade expected to be overturned

[Twangbanger]

I hope it doesn’t lead to them getting a room…

Actually I'd prefer they do...

 

[Twangbanger]

If we can come to the conclusion that a human is dead when their heart no longer beats, why can’t we come to the conclusion that they are alive if the heart is beating?

I don't study this as my #1 issue, but suspect this is where the "But Terry Schiavo" thing might come into play...

 

[Shadow01]

I think you trivialize the risks inherent in pregnancy in order to dismiss a pregnant woman’s right to choose the path of least harm for herself.

Proving that gestating human life is actually, well, human life is only one part of the problem, as is determining when the law should recognize that gestating human as possessing basic human rights. Even if we assume that a two-cell zygote has full legal rights, there is still a potential conflict between those rights and the rights of the mother.

If a pregnant woman does not have a moral conflict with ending the life of her unborn child herself, why should I? That’s between her, her unborn child, and her moral authority, and in my view she alone speaks for all three.

thank you for your continued replies.!

our moral existence is to speak and protect those that are not able to do so themselves. Using your reasoning, all intentional deaths can be justified by saying the perpetrator had no issues ending a life, why should I care?

 

[Twangbanger]

Well it looks like I might've been mistaken and you are in favor of overturing RvW because it was crappy jurisprudence and I agree.

Now it seems like you just want the court to swing the other way on what you think is best politically and swipe the whole issue off the table by fiat. That is not their mandate to decide what is best politically for the nation as a remedy.

It's not within their Constitutional purview to do so. Like it or not this is a states issue to be individually decided by the states.

I don't like precedent, in general. This is where my managerial instincts kick in, because it should never be a rule that crappy work has to be allowed to stand, because it's how it's been done for "X" amount of time.

If the SC had used better legal reasoning than a plaintiff-shopped "right to privacy" finding to decide this, and had made abortion legal in the first trimester, illegal in the third, and left the second trimester up to the States...they could have potentially managed to "pick up the turd by the clean end" and craft some kind of precedent the country could live with. Leaving the door open in the third trimester is what created the idea-space for the two sides to fight each other for 50 years. They didn't finish the job; now their work has crumbled, and will be re-worked. Even the Conservatives on the court seem to realize this issue will never be solved, so they're washing their hands and taking themselves out of it. Having reversed themselves one time, I think they've no desire to set the stage to do it again.

But this is one case where I'd support setting a different precedent. Because this issue will, literally, never really be solved. In the absence of adults putting their foot down somehow, endless resources are going to be poured into this, with no resolution. It's going to be a distraction, that takes other issues down with it. Maybe the Supremes are wise to do so. But it's going to be a massive dumpster fire for the rest of the country.

Every, single civilization since the beginning of man has found a way to tolerate and/or legalize infanticide in some form. If America of 50 years ago couldn't outlaw it, we're even less able to today. This issue is going nowhere. We just have another political football to kick around now.

It is another way for Republicans to buy your vote. At all levels of the political spectrum.

 

[jamil]

You guys have spent 50 pages worth of words in just a couple of posts each!

What the hell good is money these days? If you want to beat inflation just buy stuff. I bought a lot of words. Big deal.

 

[KG1]

What the hell good is money these days? If you want to beat inflation just buy stuff. I bought a lot of words. Big deal.

You are only supposed to buy vowels.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

What the hell good is money these days? If you want to beat inflation just buy stuff. I bought a lot of words. Big deal.

 

[Route 45]

If we can come to the conclusion that a human is dead when their heart no longer beats, why can’t we come to the conclusion that they are alive if the heart is beating?

Heartbeat is not an absolute measure of life, as plenty of people have been resuscitated after experiencing cardiac arrest. People with LVAD pumps don't even have a heartbeat, if you want to get technical about it. (See Dick Cheney)

Brain activity is the measure of life and death.

 

[BigRed]

Heartbeat is not an absolute measure of life, as plenty of people have been resuscitated after experiencing cardiac arrest. People with LVAD pumps don't even have a heartbeat, if you want to get technical about it. (See Dick Cheney)

Brain activity is the measure of life and death.

I often wonder what obiden's level of brain activity is....and that is not a joke.

 

[Route 45]

I often wonder what obiden's level of brain activity is....and that is not a joke.

 

[bwframe]

 

[KG1]

Here's another smaller ciip of that whack job pro-abortion advocate. When asked about the definition of a "woman" she basically says that anyone can identify for themselves. Then when she was asked if men can become pregnant and have an abortion she said yes.

I suspect she's trying to be cute and do a gender identity reversal in which she most likely believes that a transgender person born with female reproductive parts necessary to have a child such as a uterus and ovaries who identifies as a man is a man.

Thus, in her crazy warped gender identity mind a man can get pregnant and get an abortion. So, this is just more of that same old gender identity bull****

Now I would like for someone to tell me if anything on the pro-life advocacy side is anywhere near as whacky as this.

 

[Shadow01]

Heartbeat is not an absolute measure of life, as plenty of people have been resuscitated after experiencing cardiac arrest. People with LVAD pumps don't even have a heartbeat, if you want to get technical about it. (See Dick Cheney)

Brain activity is the measure of life and death.

Then we must bring all pregnancies to term so doctors can measure brain activity before authorizing an abortion…

 

[BigRed]

Here's another smaller ciip of that whack job pro-abortion advocate when asked about the definition of a "woman" and she basically says that anyone can identify for themselves, and then she was asked if men can become pregnant and have an abortion and she said yes.

Now I would like for someone to tell me if anything on the pro-life advocacy side is anywhere near as whacky and woke as this.

It's what happens when you normalize mental illness.

 

[Tombs]

Heartbeat is not an absolute measure of life, as plenty of people have been resuscitated after experiencing cardiac arrest. People with LVAD pumps don't even have a heartbeat, if you want to get technical about it. (See Dick Cheney)

Brain activity is the measure of life and death.

Actually, someone's brain was recently, successfully, placed in stasis with chilled fluid, and later resuscitated.

I can't find the news article but it was done in India.

So even that isn't a good barometer.

 

[ljk]

Will the GOP super majority of the Indiana state legislators do anything once the ruling comes down? Gov. Holcomb?

What do we realistically expect?

 

[Route 45]

Actually, someone's brain was recently, successfully, placed in stasis with chilled fluid, and later resuscitated.

I can't find the news article but it was done in India.

So even that isn't a good barometer.

I think 99.99999999999999% accuracy is a pretty good barometer. Maybe 100%, if we leave out unsourced tales from India.

Anyone who thinks otherwise has no business laughing at people who can't define a woman.

 

[Route 45]

Then we must bring all pregnancies to term so doctors can measure brain activity before authorizing an abortion…

Abortion issue aside, do you really believe that scientists do not know when structures of the brain develop, how they develop and when brain activity begins and progresses?

 

[Cameramonkey]

Abortion issue aside, do you really believe that scientists do not know when structures of the brain develop, how they develop and when brain activity begins and progresses?

And looping back to the Indian experiment. Anyone consider what the brain's owner was feeling? Considering we exist inside that blob of fat, when those synapses started firing, in theory its possible the person's consciousness was back. Its interesting to consider that. Are they confused and wondering whats going on? Freaking the F out because they cant see, feel, hear, etc but are self aware again? AKA sleep paralysis on steroids? Kind of a scary thought really.

I know if I was being executed by firing squads I'd ask for headshots. or given the choice, to be blown up into tiny pieces. Until the brain shuts off, you're still in there. Even after your heart stops. So if you think about how long you can hold your breath without losing consciousness, thats how long you are still feeling pain, self aware, etc after your heart stops.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

I know if I was being executed by firing squads I'd ask for headshots. or given the choice, to be blown up into tiny pieces. Until the brain shuts off, you're still in there. Even after your heart stops. So if you think about how long you can hold your breath without losing consciousness, thats how long you are still feeling pain, self aware, etc after your heart stops.

Holding your breath isn't really a good indicator. There is still a good bit of O2 in your blood that is being pumped around. Better indicator is a properly applied blood choke, which is maybe 10 seconds or less.