Is PCC the way to go?

[Ark]

I mean. A 6” 9mm “pistol” is much easier to use for my wife than a 16” AR with a can. I agree with your points in principal. But I’m more confident in my wife using the pcc with a can of I’m not there to protect the family than an ar if it came down to it.

Cans do change the equation somewhat. A PCC with subsonic 147s and a can is pretty great for shooting indoors without earpro.

 

[Magyars]

I didn't notice any threads discussing penetration thru walls into another dweling/apartment.
For some a PCC may make more sense in that regard.

 

[dudley0]

It’s all about choosing the right tool for the job at hand, and the original premise was about a new shooter.
If the SHTF, and I have to send my non shooting wife into a closet to defend herself, it will be with a PCC. I have 5.56 SBRs in 10.3” and 11.5”. With a rifle can on them, there as big as 16” rifle with a 20 ounce weight hanging on the muzzle. That’s not practical for a new shooter that weighs 120 pounds. If she can’t hold it up, she’s gonna set it down.
A 4” 9mm with a titanium can is a much smaller, much lighter package. Yes, rifles are much better at killing, but 9mm has sent plenty to the other side.

A pistol caliber carbine in her hand, is more deadly than a rifle caliber that she set down because it’s heavy.

subsonic .300 is a pistol round, similar to .45acp ballistically.

Saw an ad on Hornady Sub X bullets. Seems like they are getting better terminal performance from subsonics.

But I have not looked into it much.

 

[bwframe]

Another thought not discussed as of yet in this thread. Something not often considered when considering throwing an "easy to use" weapon into a non shooters hands is the needed tactics and downfalls of the prescribed weapon. Similar to the old foolish thought process that snub nose revolvers are THE choice first guns for women.

Does the non-shooter you are arming with a shoulder weapon know how to move around the house as needed without compromising (or shooting) themselves? Do they understand and practice the four rules without error? Do they understand when and when NOT to shoot?

Everyone has their defensive scenario mapped out as to what they THINK it could be, but what if it's not? Will your non-shooting armed defender innocently shoot through the door at the "threat" on the other side to find it's the drunk neighbor, brother or daughter?

 

[Trapper Jim]

Another thought not discussed as of yet in this thread. Something not often considered when considering throwing an "easy to use" weapon into a non shooters hands is the needed tactics and downfalls of the prescribed weapon. Similar to the old foolish thought process that snub nose revolvers are THE choice first guns for women.

Does the non-shooter you are arming with a shoulder weapon know how to move around the house as needed without compromising (or shooting) themselves? Do they understand and practice the four rules without error? Do they understand when and when NOT to shoot?

Everyone has their defensive scenario mapped out as to what they THINK it could be, but what if it's not? Will your non-shooting armed defender innocently shoot through the door at the "threat" on the other side to find it's the drunk neighbor, brother or daughter?

Wow... did I write this?

 

[DadSmith]

I'm a little late in responding.

I bought one for a SHTF rifle. Plenty of 9mm to use for taking game for meat on the table if that ever comes to that point.
I was originally planning on getting a 22 magnum semiautomatic. However, 9mm ammunition was actually cheaper and more powerful also I can reload it. So it became the gun that fills that spot I felt I needed a 22 magnum for.

 

[Elcardo]

I wont touch on the training aspect of this as its obviously the most important part of the equation when it comes to defense with a firearm but I will say why I dont own a PCC.
I run 300blk 8" pistol for HD use , if you want pistol power run subs through it, if you want something a little spicier throw in some 110 grn , want to suppress? It's one of the quietest
Price of admission is high when it comes to ammo though but these days what isnt ? LoL

 

[Gingerbeardman]

Man, I was so pumped to get a PCC for years. Finally one came up at a good used price at the same time I had some cash stashed....I don't like it. It's handy, it's mag compatible with other guns, it shoots well... but it's not one I would take for a "fun range day" with my shooting buddies. 0-100 yards when a high round count is needed, yeah I would grab it. In the house I'd rather run a pistol.

 

[cbhausen]

Another thought not discussed as of yet in this thread. Something not often considered when considering throwing an "easy to use" weapon into a non shooters hands is the needed tactics and downfalls of the prescribed weapon. Similar to the old foolish thought process that snub nose revolvers are THE choice first guns for women.

Does the non-shooter you are arming with a shoulder weapon know how to move around the house as needed without compromising (or shooting) themselves? Do they understand and practice the four rules without error? Do they understand when and when NOT to shoot?

Everyone has their defensive scenario mapped out as to what they THINK it could be, but what if it's not? Will your non-shooting armed defender innocently shoot through the door at the "threat" on the other side to find it's the drunk neighbor, brother or daughter?

Sincere question: As an observer, how do to know someone is “understanding” or “practicing” Rule #1?

 

[bwframe]

Sincere question: As an observer, how do to know someone is “understanding” or “practicing” Rule #1?

Hand them a them a blue gun or a flagged real gun. Wait for them to point it at something they shouldn't. Explain...

 

[VERT]

Sincere question: As an observer, how do to know someone is “understanding” or “practicing” Rule #1?

Hand them a them a blue gun or a flagged real gun. Wait for them to point it at something they shouldn't. Explain...

Not this again. Guys this will go nowhere.

 

[bwframe]

Not this again. Guys this will go nowhere.

Question asked. Question answered.

Thread 'Firearms Safety Rules (from the late Col Jeff Cooper, shooter, trainer, hero)' https://www.indianagunowners.com/th...te-col-jeff-cooper-shooter-trainer-hero.5682/

I know safe firearms handling is a given to those among us reading this. Most of us have a fair amount of range time in through training, competition and practice.

In the modern day, anyone who puts in much time at all on a public range will have at least a brush with getting an understanding that muzzle discipline is not just a suggestion.

IIRC though, the OP was a discussion about self defense for those who don't or won't have any interest in range time at all, much less training?

 

[TheJeff]

I own a 5.56 AR. PCC's are great for training and games to mimic your real rifle. For SD though, my rifle needs to be a rifle caliber.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I didn't notice any threads discussing penetration thru walls into another dweling/apartment.
For some a PCC may make more sense in that regard.

Any pistol cartridge worth using on human targets will sail through drywall and hollow core doors without much difference in lethality. JSP 55gr 5.56 is very effective against unarmored humans and will begin to tumble and fragment fairly quickly after going through the same, reducing lethality. Note this is velocity dependent and if you drop the velocity too much due to load/barrel length it will not have the same effect.

 

[GIJEW]

Another thought not discussed as of yet in this thread. Something not often considered when considering throwing an "easy to use" weapon into a non shooters hands is the needed tactics and downfalls of the prescribed weapon. Similar to the old foolish thought process that snub nose revolvers are THE choice first guns for women.

Does the non-shooter you are arming with a shoulder weapon know how to move around the house as needed without compromising (or shooting) themselves? Do they understand and practice the four rules without error? Do they understand when and when NOT to shoot?

Everyone has their defensive scenario mapped out as to what they THINK it could be, but what if it's not? Will your non-shooting armed defender innocently shoot through the door at the "threat" on the other side to find it's the drunk neighbor, brother or daughter?

The OPs question was whether, given minimal training (like, maybe "basic pistol"), would a PCC be an optimal defense weapon?
The need for tactical training (beyond of the added challenge of manuevering a long-ish gun in a confined space) applies to all firearms, and by the parameters of the original question, "isn't there". I understood the question as: if all they have to work with is basic marksmanship training (which might evaporate under stress) is a PCC their best choice?
Likewise, practicing safe gun handling (let alone, not shooting through doors at "threats" they haven't ID'd) applies to all firearms

 

[bwframe]

 

[Trapper Jim]

Cute Video. Boys found the humor in a pile of plastic and zinc PCC's. They came close to explaining the niche avoiding the courage to say it. A marketing idea that filled the void of divisional entries for the shooting sports. Nothing more. Nothing less. Kinda like .40 Caliber. Professional applications aside.

Also, in regards to training the noobs with a PCC, in which the OP and I discussed more than once, we agreed that we can get more noobs hitting better than with a handgun out of the Shute and they are safer to themselves in handling as it is harder to muzzle ones self. However, the transition from cutting teeth on PCC to mastering the handgun is still a pretty broad jump.

Of course this is Just My Opinion and I can't be fired by the PCC makers.

See you on the range

Trapper

 

[KellyinAvon]

Whenever one of Coach's threads gets bumped and you see the BFT avatar... pollen count must be up.

 

[VERT]

Coach is still watching after us.

I still really like my Sig MPX. It is a comfortable travel companion. Mine is an a real carbine and not the pistol with a brace. The video outlined the big disadvantages. But there are some advantages that gave a real PCC the nod over an AR or a shotgun when traveling state to state. Mainly it’s not a handgun that still has the ability to become compact because I don’t have to deal with the buffer tube. Also the magazines can be stored separate from the gun but still be relatively accessible.

 

[bwframe]

Whenever one of Coach's threads gets bumped and you see the BFT avatar... pollen count must be up.

3-4 threads come up in search, when looking for where to plant the posted video.

Coach's threads are always the most relevant.


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