I found a machinegun in Grandma's attic!!!

[VUPDblue]

I'll take a complete loss on my fully transferable C&R Japanese Type 99 LMG (approximate value $14,000 with the accessories I've got for it) and on my pre-86 dealer sample Uzi SMG (approximate value $3,400 with all the accessories I've got for it) to be able to build my own fully transferable fully automatic M60 GPMG any day of the week.

Told ya!

 

[Fenway]

Thanks for joining us here on INGO Mike. Look forward to your posts!

 

[MTC]

... I am advocating for the repeal of 922(o) on both Constitutional grounds and on the grounds of legal ineffectiveness.

Snipped for brevity, repped, and to

 

[Bill of Rights]

Unless his suggestions are to shut the hell up and not tell anyone, I say his advice isn't worth the listening to.

Probably one of those 'TURN THEM IN TO F TROOP IMMEDIATELY' bootlickers.

Hm. Read it. Not a bootlicker, but it still pains me to think of anyone giving up war trophies or free market weapons.

Sounds to me like the man knows what he's talking about and has not only the credentials but the legal victories to prove it, and if someone's advice isn't worth listening to, it's not his.

It greatly disturbs me (and indeed, all of us) to think of these historic firearms having to be donated or destroyed because of some stupid, unConstitutional law, but for the moment, and until NFA 1934 is either nullified or repealed by legislative, executive, or judicial action, that's going to keep happening. At least someone is vocal about being out there trying to save as many of them as he can.

Welcome, Mike. Good to have you here.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[alfahornet]

Thank you great thread with great info. Thanks for joining this forum.

 

[Vasili]

Sounds to me like the man knows what he's talking about and has not only the credentials but the legal victories to prove it, and if someone's advice isn't worth listening to, it's not his.

It greatly disturbs me (and indeed, all of us) to think of these historic firearms having to be donated or destroyed because of some stupid, unConstitutional law, but for the moment, and until NFA 1934 is either nullified or repealed by legislative, executive, or judicial action, that's going to keep happening. At least someone is vocal about being out there trying to save as many of them as he can.

Welcome, Mike. Good to have you here.

Blessings,
Bill

not quite what i said. but OK.

i said IF and it turned out he wasn't bootlicking, was he?
i even said he's actually got good advice and people still jumping on me for it.

maybe not true enthusiasts, but people who go NFA for investing do NOT want to lose out on their investments. pure and simple. yeah, it'd be nice to start picking up lahtis for a song, but there ain't no way.

anyone else got any reading issues?

new guy, just to clear stuff up, you're tops.

old guys not so much i guess.

 

[xring62]

If I could get the permit I would do it, if it would just be taken away by ATF id shut my mouth and keep it ,playing with it where safe.

 

[Bill of Rights]

not quite what i said. but OK.

i said IF and it turned out he wasn't bootlicking, was he?
i even said he's actually got good advice and people still jumping on me for it.

maybe not true enthusiasts, but people who go NFA for investing do NOT want to lose out on their investments. pure and simple. yeah, it'd be nice to start picking up lahtis for a song, but there ain't no way.

anyone else got any reading issues?

new guy, just to clear stuff up, you're tops.

old guys not so much i guess.

Mmm... No... The closest you got to "IF" was "unless":

Unless his suggestions are to shut the hell up and not tell anyone, I say his advice isn't worth the listening to.

Probably one of those 'TURN THEM IN TO F TROOP IMMEDIATELY' bootlickers.

Hm. Read it. Not a bootlicker, but it still pains me to think of anyone giving up war trophies or free market weapons.

If I have a reading comprehension problem, please feel free to show me the "if" in that or any other post you made prior to the post you quoted from me in this topic. It looks to me like you're saying that unless he's advising people to knowingly break the law, he should be ignored.

You did clarify that the "probably a bootlicker" thing was in error, and if you noticed, I agreed with you that I hate to think of anyone having to destroy these historic firearms because someone decided they were too scary and some paperwork got glitched up.

In addition, while at one time I thought as you do, that no NFA investor would want to see his investment decrease in value, I'm not nearly as involved in NFA stuff as VUPDBlue is and if he tells me he's yet to meet a NFA item owner who would not want to see the law repealed or even another amnesty, I know him well enough to expect that that's based on talking to more than one or two of them and that it's based on discussions to that effect. Tell you what, though: There are quite a few people here on INGO who own a variety of very expensive NFA items that are as expensive as they are because of the closure of the registry. I'd be surprised if we could find one and shocked beyond words if there are as many as three who would work to oppose another proposed amnesty or even the repeal in toto of NFA 1934. Any owner of a pre-86 registered machine gun qualifies to speak up on that.

I'll be interested to see the results.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[VUPDblue]

I would venture to guess that out of 100 machinegun owners, less than 10 would speak out against another amnesty.

 

[koveras225]

I would venture to guess that out of 100 machinegun owners, less than 10 would speak out against another amnesty.

And those 10 are becoming increasingly rare as they start selling what they have. Machine guns aren't really much of an investment anymore, prices are too high and the return is too low. Twenty years ago you could pick up a new M60 for under $2,000... now they're over $30,000. New MG owners aren't buying investments, they're either collecting or just buying expensive 'toys'.

The investing argument is little more than something to hide behind when confronting something considered to be impossible.

What I've always wondered is why, out of every 100 or so machine gun owners, you can't find 10 willing to get in on a serious concentrated challenge (legal OR legislative) to the current restrictions. You hear a lot of "It will never happen" whenever anyone brings up the possibility, then nothing...

 

[VUPDblue]

Because said MG owners are afraid of bringing themselves into the light of political scrutiny. I would even wager that most politicians think that MG ownership is illegal across the board, so imagine the you would get when it is brought up that there are civilians with MGs out there...

 

[RangeMaster]

Having been in the situation mentioned at the beginning of this thread, calling the ATF or having your attorney call the ATF does not always work. I have called the ATF for this exact reason and they told me they will not under any circumstance release tax information. I asked if I had a lawyer call if they would talk to him. She again told me no. I later contacted a "friendly" ATF agent (This was my last resort). The ATF agent ran the numbers for me and not only was able to get the registration info but he was also able to get the ownership history. The gun was returned to the rightful owner, it seemed that some old men who felt that they did not need to do paperwork just traded the gun, or lost it in a poker game, and never did the paperwork.

 

[vork08]

Say I know a guy who has a friend, whose buddy's cousin has a friend who knows a guy that got a MG from his buddy who pulled it out of his Grandpa's house after he died 4yrs ago, followed by his Grandma 3yrs ago. House been cleaned out, no chance any paperwork exists. What are the chances I could legally obtain the MG from him?

 

[vork08]

Might be a german sub MG that could have been a war trophy.

 

[CarmelHP]

What I've always wondered is why, out of every 100 or so machine gun owners, you can't find 10 willing to get in on a serious concentrated challenge (legal OR legislative) to the current restrictions. You hear a lot of "It will never happen" whenever anyone brings up the possibility, then nothing...

They did, back in the late '80's and early '90's there was a lot of activity on this front. It fizzled because of the indifference of the majority of gun owners and a still bad legal climate on the gun issue. Now, there's a shrinking number of machine gun owners and aficionados left to give a damn or carry the fight.

 

[DownByTheTracks]

Say I know a guy who has a friend, whose buddy's cousin has a friend who knows a guy that got a MG from his buddy who pulled it out of his Grandpa's house after he died 4yrs ago, followed by his Grandma 3yrs ago. House been cleaned out, no chance any paperwork exists. What are the chances I could legally obtain the MG from him?

It is not possible.

 

[vork08]

It is not possible

Is there any way to check whether an MG is documented or unfortunate contraband, other than getting a lawyer, or walking in to the ATF and asking "Can I keep this"

 

[Kenny87ky]

its already been illegally transferred at least 3 times assuming it was registered, which it probably wasn't, and the original owner died before then. so if it wasn't registered then is a no, can't be possessed , and if it was it would still be a no with alot of expalining to do on why it was trasfered so many times illegitimately, which in turn an improperly transferred machine gun is the same as an unregistered one.

 

[vork08]

and if it was it would still be a no with alot of expalining to do

Does this mean there has to be a lawyer to check if it was registered?

 

[vork08]

Maybe I should make this point clear. I don't have, nor ever had, an MG in my possession, nor do I know of anyone in possession of either a registered or non-registered one. I was asked this question, and not knowing the answer, decided to investigate.