How the ATF, Key to Biden's Gun Plan, Became an NRA 'Whipping Boy'

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  • IndyDave1776

    Grandmaster
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    12   0   0
    Jan 12, 2012
    27,286
    113
    Missed this. But WTF? What is “it” that would be doing the scanning, and for what purpose? How does this extend voting hours?
    That would allow a 24 hour self-service kiosk that can be hacked to collect votes keyed to ID cards that can be stolen or fraudulently generated for dead folks so votes can be cast or hacked in with no human supervision whatsoever all to prop up horribly disparaged rights of people who are too damned lazy or stupid to find some time in a two week window including at least one Saturday to go vote.

    These people would be screaming like smashed cats if we had the system like we had up until not that far back in which you showed up on election day during the 12 hours available or you didn't vote (barring an absentee ballot which required an acceptable justification).
     

    KLB

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    5   0   0
    Sep 12, 2011
    23,011
    77
    Porter County
    It's not Trump's personality that I find distasteful; it's his policies. You all seem to think that personality is the only reason someone could dislike Trump. Trump's administration was actively anti-freedom. The self-proclaimed "law and order candidate" is never going to be the freedom candidate.

    Neither of the major parties represents me very well. Trump's emphasis, though, was primarily on the parts of the Republican platform that I think are bad, ranging from distasteful to outright immoral.
    Trump is a nationalist; I am very much not.
    Trump actively worked to undermine the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, 10th, 14th, and 20th amendments.
    Trump was not a fiscal conservative, full stop.
    Trump did as much as he could to expand the power of the executive, effectively rewriting laws on machine guns, asylum, and much more without any input from the legislature.
    Trump restarted federal prosecutions on marijuana possession in states that had legalized it, still not learning the lesson of the 1920s that prohibition never works.
    Trump was an absolute disaster on foreign policy. Iran was bad. North Korea was bad. Tariffs were bad. If you think any of those was good, we couldn't disagree more.

    Trump emphasized what I think are the worst parts of the Republican Party. And so I chose to vote against him. Is he a bad person? Yes. But I voted against him because of his policies.
    I would say the Ds and Biden are much worse where the 1st, 2nd, and 10th.
    1st - They are actively attacking religion, they try to criminalize speech that they don't like.
    2nd - I really can't imagine I need to say anything here. This is self evident. Trump was not good, Biden is very much worse.
    10th - They want the fed to be the final say on everything. Again, both are bad, but I see the Ds as worse.
    How do you think Trump was worse than them?

    I am not sure that either is good on the 4th.

    I cannot figure out your angle on the 5th. If anything the Ds are the ones that want the Fed to go charge people for crimes when the state fails to convict those they think are guilty.

    The 14th? Really? That is the media talking.

    And finally the 20th, are you referring to his supposed attempt to stay in office after he lost the election?
     

    BugI02

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jul 4, 2013
    31,896
    149
    Columbus, OH
    It's not Trump's personality that I find distasteful; it's his policies. You all seem to think that personality is the only reason someone could dislike Trump. Trump's administration was actively anti-freedom. The self-proclaimed "law and order candidate" is never going to be the freedom candidate.

    Neither of the major parties represents me very well. Trump's emphasis, though, was primarily on the parts of the Republican platform that I think are bad, ranging from distasteful to outright immoral.
    Trump is a nationalist; I am very much not.
    Trump actively worked to undermine the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, 10th, 14th, and 20th amendments.
    Trump was not a fiscal conservative, full stop.
    Trump did as much as he could to expand the power of the executive, effectively rewriting laws on machine guns, asylum, and much more without any input from the legislature.
    Trump restarted federal prosecutions on marijuana possession in states that had legalized it, still not learning the lesson of the 1920s that prohibition never works.
    Trump was an absolute disaster on foreign policy. Iran was bad. North Korea was bad. Tariffs were bad. If you think any of those was good, we couldn't disagree more.

    Trump emphasized what I think are the worst parts of the Republican Party. And so I chose to vote against him. Is he a bad person? Yes. But I voted against him because of his policies.
    So, how's that other guy working out for you on that freedom, fiscal conservatism,
    expansion of executive power without legislative input and foreign policy? :lmfao:


    When you gave your reasons for not voting for Trump upthread, the first two - those given prominence of place - were personal dislike not principled dislike. I suspect that you decided you didn't like Trump first and then constructed the reasons why later
     

    BugI02

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jul 4, 2013
    31,896
    149
    Columbus, OH
    Missed this. But WTF? What is “it” that would be doing the scanning, and for what purpose? How does this extend voting hours?
    Not to mention, why would you choose a centralized, digitized authorization system with its ease of corruption over thousands of poll workers individually comparing you to your identification with the inherent numerical difficulty of corrupting that system
     

    foszoe

    Grandmaster
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    24   0   0
    Jun 2, 2011
    16,052
    113
    That would allow a 24 hour self-service kiosk that can be hacked to collect votes keyed to ID cards that can be stolen or fraudulently generated for dead folks so votes can be cast or hacked in with no human supervision whatsoever all to prop up horribly disparaged rights of people who are too damned lazy or stupid to find some time in a two week window including at least one Saturday to go vote.

    These people would be screaming like smashed cats if we had the system like we had up until not that far back in which you showed up on election day during the 12 hours available or you didn't vote (barring an absentee ballot which required an acceptable justification).
    Just leave it disconnected. No network. No different than your credit/debit card. If someone uses it fraudently, you know about it. If you are so worried about being hacked go on the last day of eligibility. Provide a method of allowing you to check for whom your vote counted.
     

    IndyDave1776

    Grandmaster
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    12   0   0
    Jan 12, 2012
    27,286
    113
    Just leave it disconnected. No network. No different than your credit/debit card. If someone uses it fraudently, you know about it. If you are so worried about being hacked go on the last day of eligibility. Provide a method of allowing you to check for whom your vote counted.
    No. I am not getting saddled with responsibility to monitor my vote for malfeasance because someone else is too ****ing lazy to vote unless you do everything this side of sending a vote truck around like an ice cream truck.

    You still haven't accounted for people with access to the elderly. My grandma had valid state ID well past the point she was so far gone with dementia that she made Biden look like Einstein. I could easily have voted for her with no repercussions under your plan.

    Your thoughts are much like the "civilized" characters in Demolition Man who thought it was impossible for Wesley Snipes to do what he did.
     

    jamil

    code ho
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jul 17, 2011
    60,169
    113
    Gtown-ish
    Given the ease of voting in Indiana, the people complaining, I suspect are complaining, because they want to make it easier to cheat. You can vote in-person absentee weeks before the election. If you have valid reasons you can vote by mail absentee. You can vote at any polling locations on election day. The ID that’s required is free. What the **** else do you want?
     

    BugI02

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jul 4, 2013
    31,896
    149
    Columbus, OH
    Given the ease of voting in Indiana, the people complaining, I suspect are complaining, because they want to make it easier to cheat. You can vote in-person absentee weeks before the election. If you have valid reasons you can vote by mail absentee. You can vote at any polling locations on election day. The ID that’s required is free. What the **** else do you want?
    Somebody mentioned (facetiously) a voting truck that would come around to your neighborhood so that voting was like getting ice cream
     

    jamil

    code ho
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jul 17, 2011
    60,169
    113
    Gtown-ish
    I have an idea that would make voting a lot easier for people.

    Recruit Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses to go door to door collecting people's ballots. Oh, hell. Screw the ballots. Just tell the vote collectors who you want to vote for. They'll write it down.

    Oh. And if there are several people in each home that want to vote, you could designate one person to communicate all the votes for the household. That way not everyone has to bother, but still their votes can be counted.

    So in 2024, you shouldn't even have to answer the door. Someone comes knocking, just yell through the door, "Hey, put us down for 23 votes on Harris. What? Oh. Hold up. Make that 32."
     

    KG1

    Forgotten Man
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    66   0   0
    Jan 20, 2009
    25,633
    149
    I have an idea that would make voting a lot easier for people.

    Recruit Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses to go door to door collecting people's ballots. Oh, hell. Screw the ballots. Just tell the vote collectors who you want to vote for. They'll write it down.

    Oh. And if there are several people in each home that want to vote, you could designate one person to communicate all the votes for the household. That way not everyone has to bother, but still their votes can be counted.

    So in 2024, you shouldn't even have to answer the door. Someone comes knocking, just yell through the door, "Hey, put us down for 23 votes on Harris. What? Oh. Hold up. Make that 32."
    I was thinking something along similar lines. I just want someone else to cast my ballot for me because I don’t want to be inconvenienced.
     

    IndyDave1776

    Grandmaster
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    12   0   0
    Jan 12, 2012
    27,286
    113
    Somebody mentioned (facetiously) a voting truck that would come around to your neighborhood so that voting was like getting ice cream
    Yes. My intent was to be a wise ass to make a point but it seems I wasn't far from the truth.
     

    IndyDave1776

    Grandmaster
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    12   0   0
    Jan 12, 2012
    27,286
    113
    I have an idea that would make voting a lot easier for people.

    Recruit Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses to go door to door collecting people's ballots. Oh, hell. Screw the ballots. Just tell the vote collectors who you want to vote for. They'll write it down.

    Oh. And if there are several people in each home that want to vote, you could designate one person to communicate all the votes for the household. That way not everyone has to bother, but still their votes can be counted.

    So in 2024, you shouldn't even have to answer the door. Someone comes knocking, just yell through the door, "Hey, put us down for 23 votes on Harris. What? Oh. Hold up. Make that 32."
    The added bonus for the Mormons and JWs is that most people would answer the door.

    Democrats would answer it several times!
     

    BigRed

    Banned More Than You
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    7   0   0
    Dec 29, 2017
    18,925
    149
    1,000 yards out
    I have an idea that would make voting a lot easier for people.

    Recruit Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses to go door to door collecting people's ballots. Oh, hell. Screw the ballots. Just tell the vote collectors who you want to vote for. They'll write it down.

    Oh. And if there are several people in each home that want to vote, you could designate one person to communicate all the votes for the household. That way not everyone has to bother, but still their votes can be counted.

    So in 2024, you shouldn't even have to answer the door. Someone comes knocking, just yell through the door, "Hey, put us down for 23 votes on Harris. What? Oh. Hold up. Make that 32."


    Should some complain that this is open to fraud, just call the, racists.
     

    Ingomike

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    May 26, 2018
    28,176
    113
    North Central
    It's not Trump's personality that I find distasteful; it's his policies. You all seem to think that personality is the only reason someone could dislike Trump. Trump's administration was actively anti-freedom. The self-proclaimed "law and order candidate" is never going to be the freedom candidate.

    Neither of the major parties represents me very well. Trump's emphasis, though, was primarily on the parts of the Republican platform that I think are bad, ranging from distasteful to outright immoral.
    Trump is a nationalist; I am very much not.
    Trump actively worked to undermine the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, 10th, 14th, and 20th amendments.
    Trump was not a fiscal conservative, full stop.
    Trump did as much as he could to expand the power of the executive, effectively rewriting laws on machine guns, asylum, and much more without any input from the legislature.
    Trump restarted federal prosecutions on marijuana possession in states that had legalized it, still not learning the lesson of the 1920s that prohibition never works.
    Trump was an absolute disaster on foreign policy. Iran was bad. North Korea was bad. Tariffs were bad. If you think any of those was good, we couldn't disagree more.

    Trump emphasized what I think are the worst parts of the Republican Party. And so I chose to vote against him. Is he a bad person? Yes. But I voted against him because of his policies.
    So what are you if you are not for your own country? I know what I call them, but am curious what you call it? So by your logic you voted for a president that is not for America first and foremost. Wow! What an admission. Have you considered another country more aligned with your values rather than perverting the country I and so many others love, support, and want to see be the beacon of freedom to the world?
     

    CampingJosh

    Master
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    18   0   0
    Dec 16, 2010
    3,298
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    So what are you if you are not for your own country? I know what I call them, but am curious what you call it? So by your logic you voted for a president that is not for America first and foremost. Wow! What an admission. Have you considered another country more aligned with your values rather than perverting the country I and so many others love, support, and want to see be the beacon of freedom to the world?
    I am for the United States in most instances. I would also like to see the US be the beacon of freedom to the world, though I'm not convinced that's actually the case very often.

    I don't believe that the GPS coordinates at the moment of birth say anything about the value of the person born. I don't believe that the people on the other side of the imaginary lines are somehow lesser.
     

    Ingomike

    Grandmaster
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    6   0   0
    May 26, 2018
    28,176
    113
    North Central
    I am for the United States in most instances. I would also like to see the US be the beacon of freedom to the world, though I'm not convinced that's actually the case very often.

    I don't believe that the GPS coordinates at the moment of birth say anything about the value of the person born. I don't believe that the people on the other side of the imaginary lines are somehow lesser.
    So what are you for? Are you for America to be great or not? I would love the entire world to have a constitution like ours, but someplace has to be the start and that place is the US. What country more aligns to your values and is that beacon of freedom?
     

    Ingomike

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    May 26, 2018
    28,176
    113
    North Central
    I am for the United States in most instances. I would also like to see the US be the beacon of freedom to the world, though I'm not convinced that's actually the case very often.

    I don't believe that the GPS coordinates at the moment of birth say anything about the value of the person born. I don't believe that the people on the other side of the imaginary lines are somehow lesser.
    It is indeed unfortunate that the GPS coordinates of most of the world are not beacons of freedom. You seem to believe in a world utopia, that cannot exist since evil is by nature in mans heart. Freedom is won, block by block, it is a hard fight against said evil. This country is far from perfect because the heart of man is evil, but it is, without a doubt the best option this world has.
     

    Bill of Rights

    Cogito, ergo porto.
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    7   0   0
    Apr 26, 2008
    18,096
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    Where's the bacon?
    I am for the United States in most instances. I would also like to see the US be the beacon of freedom to the world, though I'm not convinced that's actually the case very often.

    I don't believe that the GPS coordinates at the moment of birth say anything about the value of the person born. I don't believe that the people on the other side of the imaginary lines are somehow lesser.
    I am for the United States in most instances. I would also like to see the US be the beacon of freedom to the world, though I'm not convinced that's actually the case very often.

    I don't believe that the GPS coordinates at the moment of birth say anything about the value of the person born. I don't believe that the people on the other side of the imaginary lines are somehow lesser.
    I think you’re partly right here. It’s not about GPS coordinates, but it IS about American principles, about being that beacon of freedom. While none of us could foresee the damage the current administration would do insofar as the extent of it, we could look at what they proposed and we could look at what the then-current administration had done and see that we had what even CNN had to begrudgingly admit was widespread peace.... China, North Korea, the Middle East, all places that we had been told were impossible. As has been said many times, when was the last administration that did not send our troops into a new conflict? Eisenhower?

    I know I’m not going to convince you that everything was rosy and all our troubles were ending under Trump.... I don’t believe that myself.... but I do think we had things much better, and if the country survives this administration in any resemblance of what it was before, I think it will be a bloody miracle.

    My worry is that it will just be bloody. Very bloody.

    Blessings,
    Bill
     
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