How fast is your draw?

[nucular]

Just curious - how fast is your draw and how accurate is it? I carry appendix and I can (not under duress) get a consistent 2.5 second draw and hit the 9/10 ring from 5 yards or so. I am trying to get to a 1.5 second draw and I can do it now but my grip and my aim goes to hell. I can still hit the target but its sloppy and is definitely not in the 9/10 ring.

 

[daddyusmaximus]

Don't know, don't care.

If I ever get in a situation where a bad guy (or bad guys) has the drop on me... I'm screwed anyway.
That's why you keep you head out of your phone...
You want to be able to spot the signs of trouble before it happens. (situational awareness)

Slow is smooth, smooth is fast. (or so they say)

Besides, if you can't do it under duress... it doesn't matter now does it?

 

[fullmetaljesus]

I'll bet I can shoot my foot before you can!

 

[nucular]

Don't know, don't care.

If I ever get in a situation where a bad guy (or bad guys) has the drop on me... I'm screwed anyway.
That's why you keep you head out of your phone...
You want to be able to spot the signs of trouble before it happens. (situational awareness)

Slow is smooth, smooth is fast. (or so they say)

Besides, if you can't do it under duress... it doesn't matter now does it?

Right but getting good under training conditions should hopefully help out when you are under duress.

Until I went to some training, participated in some shooting matches, and started dry firing more, I never realized just how slow and awkward my draw was.

 

[MCgrease08]

With dry fire I can pretty consistently get a sub two second draw to first shot at three yards. For me that means getting the gun out from concealment, putting the red dot on a 1 inch circle and getting a "shot" off. I use a timer and set the par time at two seconds.

With live fire I tend to be a touch slower. I did the same drill at the same distance to set a baseline in August and had a 30 shot average of 3.42 seconds.

I just did the same drill two weeks ago to see if the dry fire practice has helped, and I found that I had cut a full second off my average. It's now 2.41 seconds. Still not sub two, but improvement none the less.

I also try and put all shots into that 1 inch circle. So far that's been a real challenge. I put the circle in the center of a 6" round paper plate, so I'm generally happy if all shots are on the plate. That's plenty accurate for self defense purposes.

 

[MCgrease08]

If I ever get in a situation where a bad guy (or bad guys) has the drop on me... I'm screwed anyway.
That's why you keep you head out of your phone...
You want to be able to spot the signs of trouble before it happens. (situational awareness)

If you're not already watching the Active Self Protection YouTube channel, I highly recommend checking it out. They have a new video everyday of real world robberies, assaults, shooting, etc. In most instances, there is an opportunity to make a counter ambush. There is almost always a moment where the attacker's attention is off the victim and they have a window of time to get a tool into the fight or make a move if they're willing to wait their turn.

The thing is, those windows are usually very short, so knowing how long it takes you to get a gun out from concealment and get a shot on the bad guy goes a long way towards deciding whether you're going to launch a counter ambush.

 

[nucular]

If you're not already watching the Active Self Protection YouTube channel, I highly recommend checking it out. They have a new video everyday of real world robberies, assaults, shooting, etc. In most instances, there is an opportunity to make a counter ambush. There is almost always a moment where the attacker's attention is off the victim and they have a window of time to get a tool into the fight or make a move if they're willing to wait their turn.

The thing is, those windows are usually very short, so knowing how long it takes you to get a gun out from concealment and get a shot on the bad guy goes a long way towards deciding whether you're going to launch a counter ambush.

In some of his videos, he has talked about how fast your draw needs to be in certain circumstances.

I forget the actual numbers but it was something like 1.5 seconds if he is facing you but head turned away, 2.5 seconds if he is facing away at 90 degrees, etc.

 

[nucular]

Here is my mantisX draw evaluation. Seems to take me a long time to pull the trigger once I'm on target.

 

[MCgrease08]

Here is my mantisX draw evaluation. Seems to take me a long time to pull the trigger once I'm on target.

Me too.

For me that's a symptom of being a relatively new red dot shooter. I have a tendency to wait until everything is lined up just perfectly and centered in the window. It's my brain slowing me down. I've tried shooting with the dot at various spots in the window to see how much parallax factors into accuracy. Spoiler alert, it doesn't have any relevance at all.

I have to remind myself to take the shot as soon as that dot is on the target, regardless of whether it's centered or not. The more I practice that, the easier it gets.

 

[jwamplerusa]

If you're not already watching the Active Self Protection YouTube channel, I highly recommend checking it out. They have a new video everyday of real world robberies, assaults, shooting, etc. In most instances, there is an opportunity to make a counter ambush. There is almost always a moment where the attacker's attention is off the victim and they have a window of time to get a tool into the fight or make a move if they're willing to wait their turn.

The thing is, those windows are usually very short, so knowing how long it takes you to get a gun out from concealment and get a shot on the bad guy goes a long way towards deciding whether you're going to launch a counter ambush.

If nothing else, watch this one just for the laughs! The comments are absolute comedic gold.

 

[jwamplerusa]

Here is my mantisX draw evaluation. Seems to take me a long time to pull the trigger once I'm on target.
View attachment 169830

I need to spend the money on a MantisX system.

 

[nucular]

I need to spend the money on a MantisX system.

It took me a while. They never do sales and I didn't know anyone that had one so I was hesitant to spend the money. I actually appreciate that once you buy the system (both the x and laser academy), that's it. There are no monthly subscriptions. There are other laser systems out there that charge you a recurring monthly fee and I hate that model.

 

[Jackson]

There is no magic number. Faster is better but its far from the only thing you should be training. Faster gives you more options and allows you to utilize more opportunities. That's never bad.

I'd say its more important to have a smooth and consistent presentation that comes from the same place, works in a wide range of circumstances, and is less likely to get fouled up in your clothes or a close quarters situation.

Once you develop the method of presentation that meets the above criteria, the practice necessary to increase speed also increases consistency. So you get both.

Also, smooth is smooth and fast is fast. Fast usually includes smooth efficiency, but its very possible to be smooth and slow.

And... After you have the mechanics of the draw stroke, the fundamentals of marksmanship effect speed as much as the movement. You probably need to develop your ability to pick up the sights and get them to target, and effective trigger control to keep them there while breaking the shot in a faster draw. The visual piece is important.

 

[cedartop]

First off, don't believe anybody unless they have video of them, their hits, and a timer. A decent draw to hit in a chest cavity size target at 7 yards from concealment is 1.5 seconds. Like Jackson said accuracy and repeatability are more important than pure speed, but slow is no good either.

 

[gregkl]

First off, don't believe anybody unless they have video of them, their hits, and a timer. A decent draw to hit in a chest cavity size target at 7 yards from concealment is 1.5 seconds. Like Jackson said accuracy and repeatability are more important than pure speed, but slow is no good either.

I have a ways to go. With my dot I can range anywhere from 2.5 seconds to over 3. With time training I'll get faster. Sometimes the dot hides so well that I just start over,lol.

With irons I am right around 2 seconds give or take a tenth or a few hundredths.

From low ready I am 1.5 seconds-ish.

Yeah, I know I'm slow compared to the competitive shooters out there and I'm not sure I'll get that much faster at my age, lol.

 

[NHT3]

Under 2 seconds for first shot on target from concealment but as others have said you don't know unless there's a timer. Train and shoot some matches like the Carry gun match at Parabellum or Tim's Action pistol.. It's enjoyable and gives you a sense of your abilities compared to others.
I have a vid from Carrygun hoser match a year or so ago but can't figure out how to attach it.

 

[daddyusmaximus]

If you're not already watching the Active Self Protection YouTube channel, I highly recommend checking it out. They have a new video everyday of real world robberies, assaults, shooting, etc. In most instances, there is an opportunity to make a counter ambush. There is almost always a moment where the attacker's attention is off the victim and they have a window of time to get a tool into the fight or make a move if they're willing to wait their turn.

The thing is, those windows are usually very short, so knowing how long it takes you to get a gun out from concealment and get a shot on the bad guy goes a long way towards deciding whether you're going to launch a counter ambush.

I watch /sub that channel. Obviously quicker is better than slower... What I mean is I don't get hung up on beating some timer. If you notice, a lot of the videos on that channel deal with somebody getting caught off guard. That's a greater danger in my book.

 

[cedartop]

I have a ways to go. With my dot I can range anywhere from 2.5 seconds to over 3. With time training I'll get faster. Sometimes the dot hides so well that I just start over,lol.

With irons I am right around 2 seconds give or take a tenth or a few hundredths.

From low ready I am 1.5 seconds-ish.

Yeah, I know I'm slow compared to the competitive shooters out there and I'm not sure I'll get that much faster at my age, lol.

You can do way better. You are over confirming with the dot and quite possibly the irons. You could also be reacting too slow to the beep. (If that is your go signal) I am far from being the worlds fastest shooter, not even the fastest on this forum so if I can get decent times so can you. Here are some recent times running the Rangemaster SCAT drill (Short Combat Accuracy Test)
Short Combat Accuracy Test (SCAT) I don't have video because it was just a practice session, but the numbers aren't all that impressive anyway.

RFTS-Q or IALEFI-QP silhouette

Scored: inner chest circle = 5, second chest circle = 4, head circle = 5, any hit in the torso outside the circles above the belt line = 2 points.

Hit factor scoring

5 yards Draw and fire 4 rounds to the chest 2.25 seconds
5 yards From Ready, fire 1 head shot Do this twice .57 , .60
5 yards From Ready, Dominant Hand Only, 3 rounds 1.86
5 yards From Ready, Non-dominant Hand Only, 3 rounds 2.09
7 yards Draw and fire 4 rounds 2.57
10 yards Draw and fire 4 rounds 2.87

20 rounds total
Possible score = 100 100

Record time for each stage, and add together for a total time. 12.81
Divide total points by total time, for an Index. 7.806
Multiply index by 20 for a final score. 156

Par score = 100. Goal is score above 100.

Examples:
96 points divided by 23.6 seconds = 4.07 X 20= 81.4
94 points divided by 20.2 seconds = 4.65 X 20= 93.1
98 points divided by 12.98 seconds= 7.55 X 20= 151.0

80-100 Competent
101-125 Advanced
126+ Highly Skilled

 

[NHT3]

I watch /sub that channel. Obviously quicker is better than slower... What I mean is I don't get hung up on beating some timer. If you notice, a lot of the videos on that channel deal with somebody getting caught off guard. That's a greater danger in my book.

Sub 2 second draw is attainable for anyone that gets some training and practices, it's really not that fast when you observe it in a vid. 1 second first shot on target from concealment is FAST and unattainable by most.
To your point, BBIs stated in a class I attended that what he heard in almost all cases from people involved in self-defense situations was "it didn't happen like I thought it would".. Situational awareness is probably the best defense but it's not easy to stay at Defcon 2 every moment you are in public.

 

[cedartop]

I watch /sub that channel. Obviously quicker is better than slower... What I mean is I don't get hung up on beating some timer. If you notice, a lot of the videos on that channel deal with somebody getting caught off guard. That's a greater danger in my book.

You are 100% correct. But one can strive to have good awareness, judgement, and a fast draw.