Help me chose a thermal coyote rifle.

The #1 community for Gun Owners in Indiana

Member Benefits:

  • Fewer Ads!
  • Discuss all aspects of firearm ownership
  • Discuss anti-gun legislation
  • Buy, sell, and trade in the classified section
  • Chat with Local gun shops, ranges, trainers & other businesses
  • Discover free outdoor shooting areas
  • View up to date on firearm-related events
  • Share photos & video with other members
  • ...and so much more!
  • 42769vette

    Grandmaster
    Industry Partner
    Rating - 100%
    52   0   0
    Oct 6, 2008
    15,222
    113
    south of richmond in
    I'm great at doing this for other people, but I have a bad habit of over analyzing every little thing when doing it for myself.

    I have a super hogster on the way. I'm tore between what gun to use. This will be used on a tripod with Acra swiss mounts, suppressed.

    Option 1

    556, 20 inch AR, with Mlok arca adaptor. I've got 55gr Vmax's to load up for this. It has the advantage of being semi auto for follow-up shots, but I HATE precision reloading for a semi auto. Gun shoots MOAish. I do not have, and cant find H-322. Ill have to use Ramshot, AA2230, Varget, or H-4198. (probably Ramshot or 2230 as I load this progressive)

    Option 2

    I have a Tikka T3 in 243 that I don't use for anything. I have 90gr ELD-x bullets, and piles of powder(Varget/4350/4198/4895). I will load this single stage, problem becomes, mounting it to a tripod will require a new stock (KRG, etc). I use AI mags in a few other rifles, so I have plenty. This gun is sub MOA. I will need to mount an extra pic rail for the battery pack, but with the Chassis that wont be an issue. Ballistically I would assume the 90gr ELD-x would be better than the 55gr Amax, but I don't know what velocities Ill end up with on either. Another big pro is I guide for a few youth whitetail hunts every year for a local outfitter. There has been more than one occasion where a 6 year old showed up to the lodge with dads 30-06. This would do double duty there, as a kid with a 243 off a tripod is better off than a kid with a 30-06
    Option 3

    Buy something like an RPR in 6 Creedmoor, but I dont like this idea because I dont want to load for another caliber, or try and find dies. I could be talked into it if it makes sense.

    Mounting everything up will be easier/cheaper on the AR, Follow up's will be faster on the AR. The T3 is more accurate (not that it will really matter at 300 yard thermal ranges), reloading will be easier on the T3.

    If anyone can give a vote with a pro/con Im not considering that would be great.
     
    Last edited:

    Rookie

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    14   0   0
    Sep 22, 2008
    18,155
    113
    Kokomo
    FWIW, I switched to 6mm creedmoor in an AR-10 small frame platform. I'm using 70 grain Nosler at 3,600 fps. It's a laser. Dies aren't that hard to find...
     

    mmpsteve

    Real CZ's have a long barrel!!
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    11   0   0
    Nov 14, 2016
    5,870
    113
    ..... formerly near the Wild Turkey
    OP, I can't offer actual advise because it sounds like you're more advanced in your knowledge than I am. I just started getting rigged up for night time coyotes. The one thing I can offer is a rotating shooting chair rest. I think mine's a Caldwell from Cabela's, can't remember. It is very stable with a heavy night-vision rig, and you wouldn't have to add tripod mount to your Tikka. Very comfortable to sit in for long periods, and you can rotate to scan a wide view. For what it's worth, I'm using a CZ 527 bolt action in .223, and am 3 for 3 on called coyotes. In terms of follow-up shots, those coyotes scatter pretty quick upon the shot, so I don't know that the AR helps that much, but you may be more experienced than I with that. Best of luck with it.

    .
     

    42769vette

    Grandmaster
    Industry Partner
    Rating - 100%
    52   0   0
    Oct 6, 2008
    15,222
    113
    south of richmond in
    If I do a new gun, it will not be a semi auto (unless a SCAR). The SCAR is the only semi auto I shoot as well as a bolt gun. I might try and find some 70ish grain bullets. Depending on construction, they should be able to pull double duty as a backup deer rifle as well as yotes. The difference between the 243, and Creedmoor for the most part is past 500 yards, so I don't feel the need to switch calibers, unless its for a factory gun that does not come in 243 like the RPR.

    Rookie, of the 2 listed, which way would you lean? Sounds like your pretty happy with 6mm's.
     

    42769vette

    Grandmaster
    Industry Partner
    Rating - 100%
    52   0   0
    Oct 6, 2008
    15,222
    113
    south of richmond in
    I've hunted enough yotes out of chair's to realize I don't like them. A lot of the area I hunt is pasture type area's. A chair would be find in the winter, but when grass is a foot or so tall, I don't know that I would be able to see as many dogs as I could from my feet. I'm hoping the suppressor helps to mitigate them bolting quite as quick, but I would not be surprised to find out that is one of those things, that works in theory, but in reality, they are gone. I will say, I'm faster than most at running a bolt.

    I appreciate you guys giving me a sounding board on this.
     

    Rookie

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    14   0   0
    Sep 22, 2008
    18,155
    113
    Kokomo
    Of the two, I'd go with 243. I started out with 223 and got a lot of runners. I'm sure somebody will say "shot placement" and it's true, but one thing a lot of people don't realize is a thermal scope is not a precision scope. Yes, it's accurate, but it will never be as accurate as a good glass scope. Another thing to remember, judging distance is very difficult with thermal. Because of that, I want something that's fast and flat. 6mm creedmoor and 243 fits in that category.
     
    Last edited:

    42769vette

    Grandmaster
    Industry Partner
    Rating - 100%
    52   0   0
    Oct 6, 2008
    15,222
    113
    south of richmond in
    Of the two, I'd go with 243. I started out with 223 and got a lot of runners. I'm sure somebody will say "shot placement" and it's true, but one thing a lot of people don't realize is a thermal scope is not a precision scope. Yes, it's accurate, but it will never be as accurate as a good glass scope. Another thing to remember, judging distance is very difficult with thermal. Because of that, I want something that's fast and flat. 6mm creedmoor and 243 fits in that category.



    Distance judging and needing something forgiving is something I thought of.

    I'm leaning pretty hard towards the 243 at this stage. I'll have to crunch some numbers and see if the 400 yard drop is worth looking at lighter bullets
     

    42769vette

    Grandmaster
    Industry Partner
    Rating - 100%
    52   0   0
    Oct 6, 2008
    15,222
    113
    south of richmond in
    This is for the same bullet out of a 243. These numbers sound high to me on both the creed, and 243, but per nosler, muzzle velocities are about the same.

    I know with the 90s I'm using now, I'll eat more case capacity with the 243 than I would with the creedmoor. Heavies and long range is where the creedmoor pulls away
     

    yote hunter

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Dec 27, 2013
    6,811
    113
    Indiana
    Best gun for coyote hunting I have seen is nun you are looking to get. So I'm prob not the one you want to hear from , but 22-250 or .223 is what I use. Now if you have a multi purpose for the gun you want then ? I doubt you will need to shoot a coyote pass 300yds , you should be able to get them to come the call. Most times.
     
    Last edited:

    Rookie

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    14   0   0
    Sep 22, 2008
    18,155
    113
    Kokomo
    Something to keep in mind when hunting with a thermal scope is that judging distance is very difficult. A large coyote at 250 yards will look similar to a small coyote at 100 yards. Being that you're basically looking at a 2d image, it's very difficult to judge just how far away the coyote is. One trick is to use thermal shading. Coyotes will start to show different shades of heat within 300 yards. Farther out, they tend to show only white (or black, depending on your settings). If you use thermal shading to your advantage, most of the time you can tell if the coyote is in range. This is where a flat shooting round comes into play. A 223 will not hold flat to 300 yards. A 243, 6mm creedmoor, 22-250 will.

    Since nobody asked...
    I zero my thermal scopes at 50 yards for a few reasons. First, zeroing a thermal is more difficult than a day scope due to pixelation at higher magnification. Second, if you look at post #10, that's a 50 yard zero. It's flat.
     

    Rookie

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    14   0   0
    Sep 22, 2008
    18,155
    113
    Kokomo
    Some more information on thermal shading.

     

    BoilerWes

    Expert
    Rating - 100%
    13   0   0
    Jan 2, 2010
    781
    47
    Pendleton
    Allen...I like the 243 FWIW. I am running a 6mm ARC and it is sweet. I’ve had one runner and don’t know what the deal was...probably bad shooting on my part.
     
    Top Bottom